Rules

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[Music]

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hello and welcome to thinking critically

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a d and d discussion a podcast where we

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deep dive single word concepts or ideas

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within the dungeons and dragons 5e

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framework my name is danilo and i like

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all kinds of games and the crunchy

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mechanics that make him tick you can

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find me on twitter facebook and

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instagram and i'd really appreciate a

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like or a follow and today i'm joined by

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andrew aka nominrath thank you ever ever

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so much andrew for joining us today can

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you tell us a little bit about yourself

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well i am andrew aka norman wrath and uh

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i've been playing dungeons and dragons

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for about 25 26 years and

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although my

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tt rpg game has kind of slowed down in

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the last few years

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i've been getting heavy into board games

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recently and that's kind of where my

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hobby lies right now

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awesome on that note it's a really good

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timing actually have you played uh

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gloomhaven uh no i've thought about it

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but i've played several uh dungeon crawl

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kind of games i played descent

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i currently am really big on uh

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the fantasy flight uh lord of the rings

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journeys in middle earth i really like

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that one

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okay now your board game experience will

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be much better than mine but one thing i

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can recommend to everybody is gleam

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haven for sure

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it scratches that itch that dnd

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sometimes can't reach yeah that's what i

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hear that's what i hear everybody

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everybody i know that says that's played

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gloomhaven has said oh gloomhaven's like

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really good but uh i don't know for some

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reason the the price tag on gloomhaven

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is just like it's it's kind of out there

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and uh oh yeah first of all i i was well

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lucky or unlucky i'm not sure which way

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it is but i ended up backing it on

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kickstarter way back in the day and

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obviously there's such a long lead time

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between

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backing something like that and then

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actually being delivered that i kind of

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completely forgot about it so by the

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time i actually arrived i was just like

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hey this is like a free gift

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yeah from myself in the past yeah and

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it's funny that i that i mentioned the

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uh

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the price tag because i've spent way

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more on other games through expansions

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and stuff too so the the logic behind it

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actually doesn't match so yeah

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yeah now i i totally get it i'm exactly

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the same i i tend to avoid asking myself

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those questions

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but that is a brilliant brilliant intro

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because today's topic is rules and one

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thing that gleamhaven is particularly

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heavy on as you'd expect the 10 kilogram

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100 board game is the rules but likewise

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so is dungeons and dragons yes so andrew

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what are the what does rules mean to you

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within the dnd framework within the dnd

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framework uh rules are

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for me

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uh i'm a rules as written kind of kind

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of guy so rules are are very important

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foundation i like to

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stick very strictly to the rules and

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i abide by them

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very much

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and they mean they mean a lot to me

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because they keep

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uh they keep the players

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and the dungeon master

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kind of on the same page

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and it keeps the game

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heading in the same direction when it

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comes to the meta of the game

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yeah when i was typing up my notes

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my single sentence answer to that

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question was it's a

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a required framework to ensure integrity

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and balance that's my my best kind of

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like commercial voice i could put on

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there

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that is a much better way to put it

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a shorter way to put it

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but no i i think he had a really good

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point there about keeping players and

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dms on the same page i've seen a lot of

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questions and answers and instances and

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across reddit twitter and stack exchange

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which i'll go on to in a bit around

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this basically and a misalignment

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between the players and the dms and

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there was a really good post on reddit

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that i'm now kicking myself because i

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read it this morning funnily enough and

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forgot to bookmark it the post was a

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meta post on one of the dmd subreddits

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that was basically saying hey we have a

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lot of posts on here

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that are basically people trying to get

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validation for their own

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the way they ruled something so it's

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usually a player going i wanted to do

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this but my dm said no

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why is that the case yeah but that's

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just a glorified wrapping for them

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saying please i just need ammunition to

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go back to my dm to tell him he's wrong

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yeah and as with any complex system

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you're going to have

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margins of error you're going to have

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places where things can fail and that is

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one of said places so i don't know if

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you've got any examples or experiences

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of that kind of friction between

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players and dms yeah i kind of i have a

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little bit of that and it's it's

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actually kind of a common thing more so

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in uh the modern d community i've

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noticed uh

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when i first started playing d the rules

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were

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in second edition a d and d the rules

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were

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they were a little bit more

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vague

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but okay

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they were

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also a little more strict too because of

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the way they were worded they were like

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this does this but if you move outside

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of this box

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you could basically do whatever you

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wanted when it comes to this particular

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thing this is how this rule works and

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that's pretty much

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it but in today's modern dnd

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they are promoting this

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this whole thing

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i i've noticed i see it everywhere on

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twitter on reddit and facebook and

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everywhere this whole rule of cool thing

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just ignore the rules just ignore the

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rules just ignore the rules make up your

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own rule if it doesn't work for you

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and it's like

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okay it's a half truth because you have

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to understand the rules before you do

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that you have to understand how your

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ruling is going to affect the rules as a

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whole when you make that whole

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custom ruling because if you make this

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custom ruling it's going to change

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how the game works fundamentally for

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other players at the table you know you

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this one player says oh i want to do a

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triple gainer and throw both my axes at

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this guy that's that's really cool and

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you make this one ruling

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but that might change

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the game for this other player sitting

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to his right you know so it's like well

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you just invalidated this other player's

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abilities because you

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did this rule of cool for this guy right

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here you know and it's like that kind of

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irks me a little bit because it's these

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player that's these dms that aren't

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really paying attention to the the

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bigger picture as it were

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they're trying to have their cake and

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eat it the people that are you know

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wizards who are saying yeah you know

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rule of call trumps everything

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again a guy on twitter that i that i

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follow optional rule he

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said that the problem with that is that

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he hasn't ever met a player that hasn't

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thought something they're doing isn't

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cool

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exactly

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uh which i really like there's a as an

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argument against that or not against it

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but to say you know take it with a

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you know push it through a filter

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essentially and you i completely agree

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with the point you made there something

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i feel super strongly about is

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and i've been about to go through it

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with my players before literally in the

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game i'm running now

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is that

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if i let you do this thing now

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then that precedent is set yeah then

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that means like if i let you have two

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attacks this time even though you've

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only got one attack action

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okay well suddenly everybody has to have

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two attacks per turn exactly because

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otherwise it's not

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fair just because you're better at

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embellishing and saying you want to do a

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backflip as you do it that's not fair on

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the person who is at the table for a

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slightly different reason exactly yeah

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and it's just okay well

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i'll just get a book of 101 things that

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are cool and just read it just so i can

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get to attacks every turn dm where you

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you promote that kind of

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let me try and appease the dm

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rather than

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that's exactly it and and it never stops

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either they always push the line a

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little bit further too it's always like

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okay well this session he let me have my

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two attacks well next session i'm gonna

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push for that third attack and then

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after that that fourth attack and then

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so on and so forth and it's just like it

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never ends

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so as a dm

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the rules are are there to kind of draw

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that line in the sand to say this is how

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the game works

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every now and then

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when i feel it's warranted

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we're going to step over that line but

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we're never going to erase that line

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that's actually how the rule of cool

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should work but everybody's promoting it

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as this whole now the line doesn't exist

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we're just going to do whatever we want

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and it's like well why even bother have

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the rules at all at that point

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yeah exactly do you think it's a bit of

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a get out of jail free term like rule of

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cool because i feel like we're going to

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get like everyone's going to hate us but

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i know

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we are drawing the ire of so many

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players right now yeah yeah i'm gonna

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have to but you know duck my head up

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beneath the parapet after this but the

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way i the reason why i think that is

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because

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for nine well 99 times out of 100 there

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will be a ruling for the thing that the

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player is

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trying like

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it exists yeah so

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that implies that if you're allowing

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rule of cool you're basically as you've

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just said saying

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well that rule is today

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not important well okay once you've done

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that

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then where's the line no one knows you

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you've blurred the lines between

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what

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is meant to happen and how the dm is

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feeling today

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an extreme example is the next time you

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play gravity is a tenth of what it

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should be and everyone's flying around

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yeah well

281
00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:43,440
that's just how i feel today because

282
00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:44,399
it's cool if everyone's flying around

283
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:46,880
yeah

284
00:10:44,399 --> 00:10:49,600
because it's cool today

285
00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:52,480
exactly that's an extreme example but

286
00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:54,720
it's the same premise yeah i just want

287
00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:55,600
to jump to the top of the roof okay fine

288
00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:58,240
like

289
00:10:55,600 --> 00:11:01,120
i i ironically i find it more difficult

290
00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:04,240
to judge rule of cool then i do actual

291
00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:06,079
rulings but it's it's it's a way more

292
00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:08,000
tricky kind of worms it is to say what

293
00:11:06,079 --> 00:11:10,079
can i allow that player to get away with

294
00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,880
than it is just to say no the rule says

295
00:11:10,079 --> 00:11:12,240
that

296
00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:14,079
sorry

297
00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:14,959
but you've got 101 other things you

298
00:11:14,079 --> 00:11:16,320
could do

299
00:11:14,959 --> 00:11:18,959
so

300
00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:21,440
go ahead yeah i find myself dropping my

301
00:11:18,959 --> 00:11:23,760
two cents on that more than anything

302
00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:26,720
especially on twitter because i'll find

303
00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:29,680
these posts about the rule of cool and

304
00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:32,480
uh i'll i'll find these uh posts about

305
00:11:29,680 --> 00:11:33,200
your dnd hot take

306
00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:36,399
and

307
00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:39,040
my number one hot take is it's okay for

308
00:11:36,399 --> 00:11:40,720
the dm to say no yeah

309
00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,079
yeah for sure for sure of course like

310
00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:43,920
everybody's game is their own and blah

311
00:11:42,079 --> 00:11:46,480
blah blah and yeah that's totally fine

312
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:49,440
but if you want to play a game where

313
00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:50,399
the rules are transient and it's like

314
00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:53,120
trying to

315
00:11:50,399 --> 00:11:55,200
was it nail jelly to the wall then

316
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:58,560
that's a very very very different kind

317
00:11:55,200 --> 00:12:00,240
of game and i feel that undermines the

318
00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:02,160
the narrative hits

319
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:04,800
yeah shall we say yeah you can you can

320
00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:07,279
take away from it yeah totally i mean if

321
00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:09,839
just totally ignoring most of the rules

322
00:12:07,279 --> 00:12:12,160
and going balls to the wall and just

323
00:12:09,839 --> 00:12:14,480
doing whatever you want every week and

324
00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:17,200
changing everything up is their type of

325
00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:20,000
game then whatever that's your fun do

326
00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:21,839
whatever you want but just know that

327
00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:23,519
when those players leave your group or

328
00:12:21,839 --> 00:12:26,480
whatever and they go to another group

329
00:12:23,519 --> 00:12:28,880
and they find a dm like say me who is

330
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:30,720
just like no the book says this and this

331
00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:31,840
is how it's going they're going to be

332
00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:35,760
extremely disappointed

333
00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:38,720
[Laughter]

334
00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:41,440
yeah it's i i think you know emotion

335
00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:43,839
aside i i do honestly think it's one of

336
00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:44,959
those things that certainly newer dms

337
00:12:43,839 --> 00:12:47,279
and players

338
00:12:44,959 --> 00:12:49,360
it's a crutch you know for a new dm to

339
00:12:47,279 --> 00:12:51,360
say okay that's fine and they might not

340
00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:53,600
have that appreciation of the

341
00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:56,240
the snowball effect the domino effect of

342
00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:58,079
what that actually means in the universe

343
00:12:56,240 --> 00:13:00,079
and a really good example that's

344
00:12:58,079 --> 00:13:02,000
happened quite recently i was a player

345
00:13:00,079 --> 00:13:04,240
in this particular campaign but i i

346
00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:07,200
certainly felt for the dm at the time is

347
00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:09,440
that we had a rogue and he wanted to set

348
00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:11,440
an enemy on fire using just his flask of

349
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,800
oil in his bag

350
00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:15,120
and

351
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:16,800
i talked to him afterwards

352
00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:20,240
hands up i did a little bit of backseat

353
00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,959
dming sorry but i dm the pair of them in

354
00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,800
the

355
00:13:20,959 --> 00:13:26,000
three year long campaign so i felt at

356
00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:29,040
least somewhat qualified to comment

357
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:31,279
um and i basically said like that's

358
00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:33,519
fire damage at its core but also setting

359
00:13:31,279 --> 00:13:34,480
things on fire is a thing that's unique

360
00:13:33,519 --> 00:13:35,600
to

361
00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,200
classes

362
00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:38,079
and spells

363
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:39,279
so

364
00:13:38,079 --> 00:13:41,920
classes

365
00:13:39,279 --> 00:13:44,240
have to usually expend a resource to

366
00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:47,199
achieve that be it a spouse thought be

367
00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:49,279
it their action just for fire bolt right

368
00:13:47,199 --> 00:13:51,839
um but specifically setting something on

369
00:13:49,279 --> 00:13:54,399
fire is usually a concerted

370
00:13:51,839 --> 00:13:56,399
expenditure of a resource it isn't just

371
00:13:54,399 --> 00:13:58,480
something that every everybody

372
00:13:56,399 --> 00:14:00,240
can do right and they say yeah but the

373
00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,680
you know

374
00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,440
i've had to expend a resource i've had

375
00:14:01,680 --> 00:14:05,440
to expend a flask of oil

376
00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:06,240
and i said yeah that that's true that

377
00:14:05,440 --> 00:14:08,720
you know

378
00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:10,880
that that is completely true

379
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:13,600
however a flask of oil is something like

380
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:15,839
five copper yeah so you've if you're

381
00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:17,760
doing that translation you're basically

382
00:14:15,839 --> 00:14:19,199
saying a you know a level one spell slot

383
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:21,519
is worth five copper and then you're

384
00:14:19,199 --> 00:14:24,560
just again opening a weird can of worms

385
00:14:21,519 --> 00:14:27,279
i don't even want to begin to go down

386
00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:29,440
because the the other avenue available

387
00:14:27,279 --> 00:14:31,839
to the dm there is to say okay well in

388
00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:34,000
my universe flux of oil are actually 50

389
00:14:31,839 --> 00:14:36,720
gold but then what does what does that

390
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:39,600
mean that means that nobody has torches

391
00:14:36,720 --> 00:14:41,839
because nobody can afford the oil to to

392
00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,519
set them on fire yeah and suddenly

393
00:14:41,839 --> 00:14:46,160
sconces don't exist in your universe

394
00:14:43,519 --> 00:14:48,880
anymore because they're reserved for the

395
00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:50,240
aristocracy he's like oh god yeah i

396
00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,560
didn't i didn't think of that and it's

397
00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:54,320
like yeah there's those little

398
00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:55,600
things and you know i had the benefit of

399
00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:56,959
not making it a judgement call at the

400
00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,399
time

401
00:14:56,959 --> 00:14:59,920
i could think about it and come up with

402
00:14:58,399 --> 00:15:03,519
a reason why but

403
00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:06,720
it's those cascading effects that i'm to

404
00:15:03,519 --> 00:15:09,279
be frank petrified of

405
00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:11,360
no i i totally get it i i see that kind

406
00:15:09,279 --> 00:15:13,680
of stuff all the time

407
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:15,760
yeah i can't think of one that came to

408
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:18,639
mind because i haven't i haven't done a

409
00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:20,880
fifth edition campaign in a couple years

410
00:15:18,639 --> 00:15:23,839
right now i've uh

411
00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:26,399
i've moved on to uh i'm actually running

412
00:15:23,839 --> 00:15:28,480
fourth edition essentials right now but

413
00:15:26,399 --> 00:15:30,560
uh cool i remember there was a couple

414
00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:32,320
instances similar that in

415
00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:33,920
in my 5th edition campaign where the

416
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:36,000
players were just like well we want to

417
00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:38,320
do this thing and i'm just like

418
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:40,480
oh man

419
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:42,639
so yeah that's i mean i'm glad we're

420
00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:44,480
we're in agreement on that one maybe

421
00:15:42,639 --> 00:15:46,320
just you and i against the world on that

422
00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:47,680
point but hey yeah well

423
00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:51,040
there's a there's a lot of groggin

424
00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:51,040
hearts out there who are on that

425
00:15:52,839 --> 00:15:58,399
page before the school i asked a dm

426
00:15:57,279 --> 00:16:00,880
friend of mine who's now playing

427
00:15:58,399 --> 00:16:03,920
alongside me in a different campaign who

428
00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:05,519
rob who features on episode one i said

429
00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:07,199
what does it mean to you to help me kind

430
00:16:05,519 --> 00:16:09,920
of fill out my notes a little bit and

431
00:16:07,199 --> 00:16:12,240
his initial response was

432
00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:13,519
they're among the least important parts

433
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,959
of the game

434
00:16:13,519 --> 00:16:16,880
which was

435
00:16:14,959 --> 00:16:19,279
an interesting take and one that i kind

436
00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:21,360
of had to go let me step back and think

437
00:16:19,279 --> 00:16:23,440
about that and i know that

438
00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:25,839
we've just spoken at length about

439
00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:27,360
how important they are how critical and

440
00:16:25,839 --> 00:16:28,079
intrinsic they are

441
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,040
but

442
00:16:28,079 --> 00:16:31,920
when you

443
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:34,079
boil it down to say you know a d d is a

444
00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:36,959
table top role playing game i guess

445
00:16:34,079 --> 00:16:39,120
there's nothing in that five-letter

446
00:16:36,959 --> 00:16:42,160
acronym actually suggests that there

447
00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:43,680
should be rooms and rooms of rules so

448
00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,279
i guess what you know what what is your

449
00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,360
take on that do you agree and feel free

450
00:16:45,279 --> 00:16:49,040
to disagree of course i'm not precious

451
00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:53,199
and neither is he

452
00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:55,600
well d is really a it's a two-part game

453
00:16:53,199 --> 00:16:58,240
is what it is especially d

454
00:16:55,600 --> 00:17:00,800
well most rpgs are a two-part game and d

455
00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:03,360
d especially kind of highlights that

456
00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:06,160
because you have the combat side of it

457
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:07,120
which is rules important

458
00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:08,880
okay

459
00:17:07,120 --> 00:17:10,880
and then you have the narrative side

460
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:15,039
where we do all the talky bits

461
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:17,520
and in that half of the game the rules

462
00:17:15,039 --> 00:17:18,400
really aren't that important

463
00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:21,600
when you're

464
00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:23,120
negotiating with a king on

465
00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:25,120
you know maybe

466
00:17:23,120 --> 00:17:27,919
upping your bounty on somebody that you

467
00:17:25,120 --> 00:17:30,080
captured or you're trying to you know

468
00:17:27,919 --> 00:17:31,760
negotiate for land or whatever it is

469
00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:34,640
that you're trying to do you don't need

470
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:36,160
tons of roles or modifiers or

471
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:38,240
rules or anything like that you don't

472
00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:39,840
even really need to pay attention to the

473
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:42,240
rules of a spell

474
00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:45,440
in those particular instances you just

475
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:46,559
need a general gist of what's happening

476
00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:48,480
because

477
00:17:46,559 --> 00:17:50,400
at that point it's all about the

478
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:53,200
narrative and you want the narrative to

479
00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:56,080
move forward so in those particular

480
00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:57,280
instances i actually agree with that

481
00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,240
particular

482
00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:01,520
point

483
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:03,520
but it's like a final fantasy video game

484
00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:06,400
when you're in that combat screen

485
00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:08,000
the meta becomes super important you

486
00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:09,919
need to know

487
00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:12,480
what plus goes where what minus goes

488
00:18:09,919 --> 00:18:15,360
where what spell does what and how it

489
00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:17,919
exactly affects the grid if you're using

490
00:18:15,360 --> 00:18:19,039
one or the the spaces that you're in or

491
00:18:17,919 --> 00:18:21,039
whatever

492
00:18:19,039 --> 00:18:24,400
but as soon as you're out and about in

493
00:18:21,039 --> 00:18:27,120
the open world just interacting with

494
00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:29,360
the people of the world in a

495
00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:34,080
non-meta fashion

496
00:18:29,360 --> 00:18:36,320
those numbers and the crunch becomes

497
00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:38,080
less of a hindrance i guess is the best

498
00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:40,240
way to put it

499
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,840
i think we've all had games where in the

500
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,799
famous games where no one rolled the

501
00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,320
dice

502
00:18:42,799 --> 00:18:46,400
i think you know you get to the end and

503
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:48,240
you're like actually guys did anyone

504
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:49,840
actually roll the dice that game you

505
00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:51,039
know

506
00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:52,480
which are great

507
00:18:51,039 --> 00:18:54,240
it's it's if you get to the end and you

508
00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:56,000
haven't realized i really do like that

509
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:57,360
kind of okay we've just experienced like

510
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,559
a pure

511
00:18:57,360 --> 00:19:00,559
role-playing

512
00:18:58,559 --> 00:19:02,480
experience up until that point which is

513
00:19:00,559 --> 00:19:03,240
you know has its own form of enjoyment

514
00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:05,039
but

515
00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:07,440
ultimately

516
00:19:05,039 --> 00:19:08,960
you're gonna have a mix of players my

517
00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,400
table does we've got a couple of people

518
00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:12,240
who are really into the crunchy combat

519
00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:13,919
mechanics and they're like i want to go

520
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:16,080
here i want to stop him entering my

521
00:19:13,919 --> 00:19:17,440
range and i want to cast that over there

522
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:19,039
but then you've also got people who are

523
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:20,559
like oh give me that oh give me that

524
00:19:19,039 --> 00:19:23,600
spicy role play i want to stab him in

525
00:19:20,559 --> 00:19:25,120
the back and betray the party and

526
00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,240
do all that kind of stuff and so trying

527
00:19:25,120 --> 00:19:28,880
to

528
00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:30,160
smush that into a big melting pot is

529
00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:32,080
obviously where the challenge but

530
00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:33,919
obviously where the reward comes from oh

531
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,080
it's super yeah it's it's super

532
00:19:33,919 --> 00:19:37,120
rewarding and it's super difficult and

533
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:39,919
uh

534
00:19:37,120 --> 00:19:41,120
it's interesting too because

535
00:19:39,919 --> 00:19:43,039
d d

536
00:19:41,120 --> 00:19:46,160
is one of those games where

537
00:19:43,039 --> 00:19:47,919
if you sit back as a dm and you kind of

538
00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:49,600
take yourself out of the game and you

539
00:19:47,919 --> 00:19:50,640
just look at what's happening at the

540
00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:53,679
table

541
00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:54,720
you can see the divide of the game and

542
00:19:53,679 --> 00:19:56,400
it's

543
00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:58,080
it's kind of a bizarre

544
00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:00,960
experience

545
00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:02,559
the divide in people's yeah people's

546
00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:05,280
styles and

547
00:20:02,559 --> 00:20:07,360
like how the game is actually divided

548
00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,679
because people when they say d d and

549
00:20:07,360 --> 00:20:11,760
they say they play d and d and uh you

550
00:20:09,679 --> 00:20:13,520
bring up this this particular question

551
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:15,120
about you know how important are the

552
00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,880
rules you know when should the rules

553
00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:18,960
apply and when they shouldn't

554
00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:21,360
they want to mish-mash it into one

555
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:23,919
melting pot they want to say the rules

556
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:25,760
are either important or they're not

557
00:20:23,919 --> 00:20:27,120
and

558
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,840
kind of like what we were doing at the

559
00:20:27,120 --> 00:20:32,400
beginning and you know it seems like

560
00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:34,559
right now i've completely flipped table

561
00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:37,600
but like i said

562
00:20:34,559 --> 00:20:39,600
the game is two different parts and

563
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:41,280
yeah you could you can see the different

564
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,720
parts when when you when you do that

565
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:45,039
when you pull yourself away from the

566
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,240
table and and you see how that how it's

567
00:20:45,039 --> 00:20:48,480
playing out

568
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,080
yeah i think a good way to put it

569
00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:51,200
is

570
00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:53,200
rules

571
00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,200
may be the least important parts of

572
00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:56,559
role-playing games but they are not the

573
00:20:55,200 --> 00:20:59,120
least important part of dungeons and

574
00:20:56,559 --> 00:21:00,960
dragons yes that's actually an excellent

575
00:20:59,120 --> 00:21:02,880
way to put it right there

576
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:04,400
yeah thanks so i'm rather proud of that

577
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,720
one i have to say it

578
00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:08,720
and you should be you should be ah thank

579
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,000
you

580
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,039
um

581
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,960
so

582
00:21:11,039 --> 00:21:14,799
a little of a little bit of a history

583
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:16,000
lesson for those listening is that

584
00:21:14,799 --> 00:21:18,000
andrew and i actually originally got

585
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,440
talking on twitter funnily enough

586
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:22,159
discussing

587
00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:24,000
some rules around dark vision originally

588
00:21:22,159 --> 00:21:25,679
but it also expanded into kind of

589
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:28,159
conditions and

590
00:21:25,679 --> 00:21:29,600
so on and so on so the next thing i kind

591
00:21:28,159 --> 00:21:31,840
of wanted to talk about is

592
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:33,280
misinterpreted or ignored

593
00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:35,600
rules

594
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:37,520
so why don't we start with

595
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:39,760
dark vision because if i have memory

596
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:41,120
serves the original post was around

597
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,039
you know it's like an fyi i think it was

598
00:21:41,120 --> 00:21:45,280
one page mage had made a post that said

599
00:21:43,039 --> 00:21:48,400
in fyi dark vision still imposes

600
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:49,919
disadvantage on perception checks and

601
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:53,280
that is something

602
00:21:49,919 --> 00:21:56,480
i really remembered way too late into my

603
00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:58,320
dming career yeah yeah it's because most

604
00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:00,159
most people think that dark vision is

605
00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:02,080
just like oh yeah that's now brightest

606
00:22:00,159 --> 00:22:03,200
day and we can just see

607
00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:04,799
miles and miles

608
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,320
[Laughter]

609
00:22:04,799 --> 00:22:07,440
yeah because there's always that you

610
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,360
know there's that

611
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:12,320
criticism that you know every race

612
00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:14,960
pretty much apart from like two or three

613
00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:16,880
has got dark vision ergo it's

614
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:19,200
somewhat pointless yeah you may as well

615
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:21,440
just give it to everybody or make dark

616
00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:23,200
vision not a thing but as soon as i

617
00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:24,320
learned about that i was like okay i'm

618
00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:26,080
gonna go and

619
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:28,080
make this really hammy next time they're

620
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:29,760
underground and then the darkness

621
00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:31,760
yeah i'm going to make it

622
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,520
you know you can't see colors and you

623
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:35,840
still have disadvantage on perception

624
00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:38,320
checks because it's still super dark

625
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:40,720
like i can't i can't stress

626
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:44,960
how much of a disadvantage you're at

627
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:47,360
right now yeah so i had the players into

628
00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,720
a small subterranean chamber that was

629
00:22:47,360 --> 00:22:50,400
flooded to

630
00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,480
a couple of foot maybe like two foot

631
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:53,679
high off the floor

632
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,080
and

633
00:22:53,679 --> 00:22:58,960
underneath the water on on the cave

634
00:22:56,080 --> 00:23:00,159
floor there was cow troughs so

635
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:03,520
spiky

636
00:23:00,159 --> 00:23:06,720
balls blades of glass yeah you know like

637
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:09,440
uh things to impede movement

638
00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:11,280
but i put it under the water

639
00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:12,559
for the express reason that it would be

640
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,880
tricky to see

641
00:23:12,559 --> 00:23:16,080
even regularly let alone with

642
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,679
dark vision

643
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:19,919
because it would just be like a blurry

644
00:23:17,679 --> 00:23:21,600
grey mess that you couldn't like you

645
00:23:19,919 --> 00:23:22,960
could you would not be able to point out

646
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:25,039
the details of

647
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:27,039
i shouldn't be walking here right now of

648
00:23:25,039 --> 00:23:28,720
course that that didn't matter at all

649
00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:30,880
when my players had water walking cast

650
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:32,159
on them and just

651
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:34,840
walked on top and looked through it like

652
00:23:32,159 --> 00:23:37,520
a glass bottom floor and

653
00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:39,039
then um they they you know they're by

654
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,120
parts of the trap which is

655
00:23:39,039 --> 00:23:42,559
you know great but that was quite a slow

656
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:44,000
realization that i was like you can't it

657
00:23:42,559 --> 00:23:45,520
looks like there's something under water

658
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:47,279
little bits of something under the water

659
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:48,080
and then again they're getting curious

660
00:23:47,279 --> 00:23:49,679
and

661
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:51,679
start to push their hands through and

662
00:23:49,679 --> 00:23:52,880
pick it up and i'm like yeah you you

663
00:23:51,679 --> 00:23:53,919
pick a piece out and it's just a cow

664
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,039
chop

665
00:23:53,919 --> 00:23:56,400
oh

666
00:23:55,039 --> 00:23:57,760
maybe we were

667
00:23:56,400 --> 00:24:00,000
oh they probably wanted us to walk on

668
00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:00,000
these

669
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:05,840
yeah they probably did

670
00:24:03,279 --> 00:24:07,520
but it's that you know i really

671
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:09,600
lay it in like you don't have any light

672
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:11,440
so trying to see through the water is

673
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,880
tricky and um

674
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:14,960
you know having

675
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:16,720
gems and gold and stuff that you can't

676
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:18,480
tell what color it is maybe it's just

677
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,880
silver or maybe it's

678
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,559
brilliant diamond you can't tell because

679
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:25,279
you can't see what color it is even just

680
00:24:22,559 --> 00:24:26,720
that alone is enough yeah to get most

681
00:24:25,279 --> 00:24:28,880
players being like

682
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:31,760
goddammit i want to see if this is like

683
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:33,520
a worth a million bucks so let me let me

684
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,840
light a torch just to find out yeah

685
00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:37,840
exactly so yeah that's

686
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:39,279
again another pet peeve people might be

687
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:40,480
realizing how passionately i'm talking

688
00:24:39,279 --> 00:24:42,720
about

689
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:44,559
bloody dark vision no i get it i brought

690
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,039
it up several times during my fifth

691
00:24:44,559 --> 00:24:48,880
campaign and my players would look at me

692
00:24:47,039 --> 00:24:51,360
like i'm crazy i'm like

693
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:54,159
okay you guys realize that you can't see

694
00:24:51,360 --> 00:24:55,760
in color right and they're like what and

695
00:24:54,159 --> 00:24:57,919
you guys still have disadvantage on

696
00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:00,320
perception checks when it's dark

697
00:24:57,919 --> 00:25:01,919
what

698
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:04,240
which makes it which makes it a pain to

699
00:25:01,919 --> 00:25:06,240
see people who are hiding in said

700
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:08,240
darkness yeah

701
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:10,159
for that exact reason i would always

702
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,679
start it because they're like oh we have

703
00:25:10,159 --> 00:25:13,600
dark vision i was like you still might

704
00:25:11,679 --> 00:25:14,720
want to lie to like you know me being

705
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:17,039
the

706
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:18,400
the caring gm you guys still might want

707
00:25:17,039 --> 00:25:20,000
to light a light

708
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:23,440
and they would be like why we have dark

709
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:24,640
vision it's like because so on and so

710
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:25,760
forth

711
00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:29,360
yeah

712
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:31,120
yeah exactly yeah but the the original

713
00:25:29,360 --> 00:25:33,360
discussion we had there and i you know

714
00:25:31,120 --> 00:25:35,679
since rereading it and thinking about it

715
00:25:33,360 --> 00:25:37,440
i i do concede that

716
00:25:35,679 --> 00:25:40,000
as you you rightly put them that

717
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,799
basically no one is as i know as i am

718
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,159
and

719
00:25:40,799 --> 00:25:43,919
rarely are people going to read the rule

720
00:25:42,159 --> 00:25:46,960
book beginning to end especially players

721
00:25:43,919 --> 00:25:47,840
which i i totally get now and that if

722
00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,000
you're

723
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,360
excited about building a character and

724
00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:53,120
you look at dwarf and you see dark

725
00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:55,200
vision and it says you can see

726
00:25:53,120 --> 00:25:57,360
in dark light as it's dim light you're

727
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:58,559
just gonna go oh wicked cool done i'll

728
00:25:57,360 --> 00:26:01,679
take that

729
00:25:58,559 --> 00:26:03,440
exactly i think nothing of it

730
00:26:01,679 --> 00:26:05,600
you're not gonna even bother to go to

731
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,520
the dim light section which is later in

732
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:11,440
the book and be like oh this is what dim

733
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:13,679
light does for me that sucks

734
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:14,480
yeah for sure and i totally get that now

735
00:26:13,679 --> 00:26:16,400
and

736
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,159
old dan lo was

737
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:20,880
quite staunch on like

738
00:26:18,159 --> 00:26:23,360
read the manual as we put it but um

739
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:24,880
yeah i get that that's not

740
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:27,520
not everyone's cup of tea which is

741
00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:29,039
completely fair enough yeah and plus

742
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:30,080
there's another thing that compounds

743
00:26:29,039 --> 00:26:31,279
that too

744
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:32,880
is um

745
00:26:31,279 --> 00:26:35,600
we have

746
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:37,360
players they rely on dms to teach them

747
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:39,039
the game so

748
00:26:37,360 --> 00:26:40,880
you know when you get a dm who doesn't

749
00:26:39,039 --> 00:26:42,559
even know the rules and you're sitting

750
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:46,000
down at the table and the dm doesn't

751
00:26:42,559 --> 00:26:47,919
even bring it up and it's just

752
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:49,279
it's like a robberist that just keeps

753
00:26:47,919 --> 00:26:52,720
feeding itself

754
00:26:49,279 --> 00:26:54,720
down the jeep down to generations

755
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:56,400
yeah i think

756
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,320
leveraging a bit of my ball game

757
00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,480
experience i've always been

758
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:02,880
that person when it comes to board games

759
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:04,720
too so i probably approached it

760
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:06,320
similarly to d and d

761
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,440
and obviously board games are all about

762
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,679
the rules otherwise you wouldn't be

763
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,760
playing it yeah so i approached d and d

764
00:27:09,679 --> 00:27:13,600
in the same way of okay let me

765
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:15,760
get completely familiar with this book

766
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:18,320
that's telling me how to play the game

767
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:20,559
so that i can teach other people yeah i

768
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:23,760
constantly do that with my board games

769
00:27:20,559 --> 00:27:26,240
and with d i'm a little bit of a rules

770
00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:28,720
lawyer confession here rules lawyers

771
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:31,360
anonymous here i'll be i'll be sitting

772
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:33,440
at the game and i'll be playing uh d and

773
00:27:31,360 --> 00:27:34,880
d with somebody and my dm will be like

774
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,799
oh yeah we're just gonna do this and

775
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,870
i'll be like uh that's not how that

776
00:27:36,799 --> 00:27:40,960
works and

777
00:27:37,870 --> 00:27:43,600
[Laughter]

778
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:45,200
it's it's it meet in the middle piece um

779
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,200
there's a time in a place and in one of

780
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,039
the early in a different podcast episode

781
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:51,360
we talked about how you frame the

782
00:27:49,039 --> 00:27:52,640
archetypical rules lawyer into a

783
00:27:51,360 --> 00:27:54,399
positive light to say you know they're

784
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:56,559
helping the dm and the players at the

785
00:27:54,399 --> 00:27:58,480
table to learn the game and

786
00:27:56,559 --> 00:27:59,600
if you have that familiarity with the dm

787
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:03,120
to say

788
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:04,480
you know my my dms no idm and they will

789
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:06,880
say download

790
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,399
what do we do in this situation yeah and

791
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,640
sometimes i'm like i don't even know i

792
00:28:08,399 --> 00:28:13,760
don't know even i don't know i say like

793
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,760
i'm the king of the castle but

794
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:18,559
i don't know um

795
00:28:16,559 --> 00:28:20,000
and so yeah it's that it's that you know

796
00:28:18,559 --> 00:28:21,520
if everyone's on the same page then yeah

797
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,120
go ahead there's a place that's

798
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:25,039
absolutely a time and place for people

799
00:28:23,120 --> 00:28:26,320
that know the rules and it's it's to

800
00:28:25,039 --> 00:28:28,799
resolve those

801
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:31,360
uh the integrity and the balance of the

802
00:28:28,799 --> 00:28:32,640
game to tie it very nicely to the

803
00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:35,200
beginning

804
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:37,120
yeah yeah i i offer my two cents

805
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:39,840
probably a little more than i should

806
00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:41,360
but that's that's just me i'm

807
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:44,080
i don't i don't know maybe i should get

808
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:45,360
diagnosed for ocd or something because

809
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,200
it's like

810
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:49,200
sometimes it just really grinds my gears

811
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:51,600
when i'm sitting there and i'm like i

812
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:53,520
hear a dm just like oh yeah this this is

813
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:56,480
how it works and i'm like no that's not

814
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:58,399
how it works i'm saying to myself and he

815
00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:01,520
just keeps doing it and that's like okay

816
00:28:58,399 --> 00:29:03,039
can i say something i'll ask i won't

817
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:06,320
just be like no

818
00:29:03,039 --> 00:29:06,320
that's not how it works

819
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:13,200
just flip the desk and walk out i know

820
00:29:10,399 --> 00:29:14,960
but i'll say you know um

821
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,159
and then he'll say what's going on and

822
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:19,360
i'll say well

823
00:29:16,159 --> 00:29:21,919
it says here that you know this is how

824
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:23,919
this actually works and then he'll

825
00:29:21,919 --> 00:29:25,600
either say oh i didn't know that and

826
00:29:23,919 --> 00:29:28,559
okay this is how it works okay that's

827
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:30,640
cool or he'll say well i know that but

828
00:29:28,559 --> 00:29:32,559
i'm doing it this way and at that point

829
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:34,640
if he says that then i'll shut my mouth

830
00:29:32,559 --> 00:29:36,399
because i know he has a different plan

831
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:39,039
but yeah

832
00:29:36,399 --> 00:29:40,640
yeah i was i was um i was not part of a

833
00:29:39,039 --> 00:29:42,640
game recently but i've talked to a

834
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:44,880
friend about it and i said you know how

835
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,919
did it go and he said

836
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,679
i don't know whether i should tell you

837
00:29:45,919 --> 00:29:50,320
this because it's gonna

838
00:29:47,679 --> 00:29:51,440
it's gonna make you angry

839
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,960
tell me

840
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,600
and he said one of the players said can

841
00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:57,039
i investigate this and the dm said sure

842
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,720
real perception

843
00:29:57,039 --> 00:30:00,880
and i went yeah i wish he hadn't told me

844
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:00,880
that

845
00:30:01,870 --> 00:30:06,159
[Music]

846
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:06,960
so yeah that's uh that's a funny one but

847
00:30:06,159 --> 00:30:09,200
um

848
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:10,320
again a classic well not a classic but

849
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,520
it's

850
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,120
there's a bit of nuance between

851
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:15,440
perception and investigation i

852
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:18,080
personally haven't felt there to be

853
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:19,760
too much confusion but i know that

854
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:22,000
i mean i've seen enough blog posts

855
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:23,840
trying to demystify perception versus

856
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:27,600
investigation that it's clearly a thing

857
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:29,840
that you struggle with yeah it really is

858
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:32,080
the dm that i was just playing with he

859
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:33,679
has a he has a little bit of a trouble

860
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:36,559
between the nuance between several of

861
00:30:33,679 --> 00:30:38,799
the skills like athletics and acrobatics

862
00:30:36,559 --> 00:30:39,760
perception and investigation

863
00:30:38,799 --> 00:30:42,960
and

864
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:43,760
just wisdom and intelligence overall

865
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:45,840
are

866
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:47,279
a couple of his uh

867
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,640
he doesn't he doesn't quite get the

868
00:30:47,279 --> 00:30:50,159
difference between them so it's just

869
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:52,320
kind of like

870
00:30:50,159 --> 00:30:55,039
yeah it's tricky it's tricky that's what

871
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:57,440
yeah that's what the uh variant rules

872
00:30:55,039 --> 00:30:59,679
for saying um rolling

873
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:01,279
uh intimidation strength rather than

874
00:30:59,679 --> 00:31:03,440
intimidation charisma which is what i

875
00:31:01,279 --> 00:31:06,000
think it is normally a fool is to kind

876
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,279
of again meet in the middle a little bit

877
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,360
of

878
00:31:07,279 --> 00:31:11,440
you want to do this and i can't

879
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:12,880
quite really put a finger on what

880
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:15,039
exactly you're trying to do so let's

881
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,640
roll a little bit of both to a certain

882
00:31:15,039 --> 00:31:19,039
extent yeah and that's that's that's

883
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:20,960
what i tell them too i was like you just

884
00:31:19,039 --> 00:31:23,200
just just pay attention to what what the

885
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:25,760
players saying you know is is he

886
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,360
grabbing the guy and like throttling him

887
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,279
or is he

888
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:31,120
threatening him with his words because

889
00:31:29,279 --> 00:31:33,279
if he's throttling him then you want

890
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:34,399
strength and intimidation but if he's

891
00:31:33,279 --> 00:31:36,480
like

892
00:31:34,399 --> 00:31:38,880
telling him he's gonna bust his head

893
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:41,519
open then it's charisma because

894
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:42,399
he's he's using his words so

895
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:44,559
yeah

896
00:31:42,399 --> 00:31:46,559
yeah precisely yeah

897
00:31:44,559 --> 00:31:48,320
are there any other um

898
00:31:46,559 --> 00:31:50,480
misinterpreted or ignored rules that

899
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:52,640
you've experienced or come across i'm

900
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:53,919
sure i've come across a bunch of them

901
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:56,960
but um

902
00:31:53,919 --> 00:31:57,919
dark vision is probably the number one

903
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:59,600
um

904
00:31:57,919 --> 00:32:02,720
the second one that i usually come

905
00:31:59,600 --> 00:32:04,799
across is the nuance between attacks

906
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:07,120
big a in little a as i call it big

907
00:32:04,799 --> 00:32:09,519
attack and small attack yeah

908
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:11,440
yeah capitalization

909
00:32:09,519 --> 00:32:14,000
yeah cause uh anything with an attack

910
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:15,279
role is defined as an attack so

911
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,039
therefore if

912
00:32:15,279 --> 00:32:19,039
if something references giving bonuses

913
00:32:17,039 --> 00:32:21,440
to an attack it can receive those if it

914
00:32:19,039 --> 00:32:23,679
has an attack role otherwise it cannot

915
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,720
get those because i had a friend who was

916
00:32:23,679 --> 00:32:27,360
like

917
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:29,120
i'm gonna launch magic missile and then

918
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:31,440
you know paladin's going to give me all

919
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:33,360
of its attack bonuses and

920
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:35,600
the bard's going to give me all of his

921
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,919
attack bonus all the attack bonus buff

922
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:39,760
stuff he can give and it's like no no no

923
00:32:37,919 --> 00:32:41,279
no

924
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:43,919
magic missile doesn't have an attack

925
00:32:41,279 --> 00:32:46,159
role it's not an attack it's all but but

926
00:32:43,919 --> 00:32:48,159
it causes damage

927
00:32:46,159 --> 00:32:50,799
it's all about the legality of it i'm

928
00:32:48,159 --> 00:32:52,399
sorry but magic

929
00:32:50,799 --> 00:32:54,240
the magic missile is an aggressive

930
00:32:52,399 --> 00:32:56,640
action but it's not an attack by the

931
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:58,240
legal definition of dnd i sound like

932
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,200
sound like a lawyer

933
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,880
but

934
00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:02,610
technically um

935
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,080
yeah

936
00:33:02,610 --> 00:33:06,480
[Music]

937
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,880
because otherwise magic missile would be

938
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,760
super overpowered because it auto hits

939
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:11,200
so

940
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:14,559
yes

941
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:16,960
yeah i i totally get it and

942
00:33:14,559 --> 00:33:20,399
as i've said before i feel that the

943
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:22,320
terminology they use is

944
00:33:20,399 --> 00:33:24,000
um one thing they do do good is that

945
00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:26,080
it's the same that i haven't found a

946
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:27,440
single instance of them using attack

947
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,200
with a capital a where it should be

948
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,919
attacked with a lowercase a and the same

949
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:32,799
for action for that matter

950
00:33:31,919 --> 00:33:33,600
but

951
00:33:32,799 --> 00:33:36,320
it's

952
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:39,120
disparate throughout the book and it's

953
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:40,960
those edge edge cases which shouldn't

954
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:43,120
really be edge like magic missile isn't

955
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:45,279
an edge case spell but

956
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:47,200
there's so much confusion do i roll one

957
00:33:45,279 --> 00:33:49,600
dice for every dart or a separate dice

958
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:52,080
for every dart is it an aoe or is it not

959
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:54,080
an aoe is it an attack or is it not an

960
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:58,320
attack magic missile was like the most

961
00:33:54,080 --> 00:34:01,120
popular spell in the in the game

962
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:04,799
so yeah it's it's i i i absolutely

963
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:07,039
concede that point that it's obtuse to a

964
00:34:04,799 --> 00:34:08,560
certain extent or it's just

965
00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:09,520
some things are perhaps more complicated

966
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:10,320
than

967
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,760
they

968
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:13,679
would otherwise be but i feel like

969
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:15,760
that's a symptom of

970
00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:18,159
these five additions and three decades

971
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:21,280
of of embellishment

972
00:34:18,159 --> 00:34:24,320
yeah totally it's uh dnd's got a lot of

973
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:26,040
baggage on it is what it's got

974
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,079
yeah but uh all the all the

975
00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:30,960
misinterpretations and stuff that i that

976
00:34:28,079 --> 00:34:33,440
i usually come across it's it's not

977
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:35,919
they're not huge deals but they're

978
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:38,079
they're like individual cases like the

979
00:34:35,919 --> 00:34:39,599
thing about poison that i mentioned to

980
00:34:38,079 --> 00:34:40,639
you

981
00:34:39,599 --> 00:34:43,200
where

982
00:34:40,639 --> 00:34:46,399
i had a player who was like

983
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,440
who got confused between the idea of a

984
00:34:46,399 --> 00:34:51,440
poison

985
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:53,760
the poisoned condition and poison damage

986
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:54,639
and yes it's like

987
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:57,040
okay

988
00:34:54,639 --> 00:34:59,440
you have a poison in you but that

989
00:34:57,040 --> 00:35:02,000
doesn't mean you are poisoned

990
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:04,960
as per the condition and it's causing

991
00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:08,320
damage to you but it's not poison damage

992
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:10,079
as per the definition of poison damage

993
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:12,160
and it's like

994
00:35:10,079 --> 00:35:13,920
and it was just really hard for this

995
00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:16,560
player to wrap his head around all that

996
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:18,720
because it was all related to the poison

997
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,800
it's like and it's at that times like

998
00:35:18,720 --> 00:35:23,119
that that i wish

999
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:25,200
the writers of dnd would have used just

1000
00:35:23,119 --> 00:35:27,440
different terminology for that like

1001
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:29,760
poisoned condition i actually when i

1002
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:31,599
first read fifth edition i actually wish

1003
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:32,800
they had called that something else

1004
00:35:31,599 --> 00:35:34,480
anyway

1005
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,599
because to me it just doesn't make any

1006
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:38,160
sense i wish they would have called it

1007
00:35:35,599 --> 00:35:39,520
like nausea or sickened or something

1008
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,520
like that because that's

1009
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:43,760
actually what it's supposed to represent

1010
00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:45,280
anyway yeah and then you've got you've

1011
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:49,280
also got like

1012
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:50,720
is it thun thunder and force which are

1013
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,720
too

1014
00:35:50,720 --> 00:35:55,760
uh

1015
00:35:52,720 --> 00:35:57,359
yeah double checks i know thunder is a

1016
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,640
type of damage which is kind of just

1017
00:35:57,359 --> 00:36:00,720
like

1018
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:03,520
magical bludgeoning damage yeah lack of

1019
00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:06,000
a better term um oh yeah quickly that

1020
00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:08,240
now uh because i wanted to make sure of

1021
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:10,320
something but yeah here we go

1022
00:36:08,240 --> 00:36:13,040
so yeah you do have force damage as i

1023
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:16,000
thought yeah so pure magical energy

1024
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:17,680
focused into a damaging form

1025
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:19,680
isn't that

1026
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:23,440
every spell ever

1027
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:25,760
i know that's what magic missile does

1028
00:36:23,440 --> 00:36:27,920
yeah yeah that's the example it uses in

1029
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:29,760
the book actually but yeah so

1030
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:31,920
again with poison that's that's a pretty

1031
00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:34,240
egregious example but also like

1032
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,920
thundering which is just kind of like

1033
00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:38,320
immediately draws to mind thunder and

1034
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:39,760
lightning but in reality has nothing to

1035
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:41,760
do with

1036
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,520
electricity because that's

1037
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:45,200
lightning and yeah i

1038
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,480
yeah there's just a little baggage i

1039
00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,760
think as you said

1040
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:48,960
yeah

1041
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:51,359
it's it's because they're trying to

1042
00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:52,880
harken back to the old days

1043
00:36:51,359 --> 00:36:54,880
and

1044
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:56,880
i think what it could have done

1045
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:59,440
is it could have just dropped a bunch of

1046
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,760
that old day stuff and just streamed

1047
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:04,000
into it just a little bit more

1048
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:07,200
but that's just me

1049
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:10,160
by dropping some of that stuff but yeah

1050
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:10,160
yeah what do i know

1051
00:37:11,390 --> 00:37:14,730
[Music]

1052
00:37:18,260 --> 00:37:23,599
[Music]

1053
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:25,040
one thing that i've literally realized

1054
00:37:23,599 --> 00:37:26,320
this week

1055
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:29,280
is

1056
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:30,079
around spell casting on a turn

1057
00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,480
so

1058
00:37:30,079 --> 00:37:35,200
i've always had in my head and have been

1059
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:38,079
completely committed to the idea

1060
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:39,760
that despite all the verbage ultimately

1061
00:37:38,079 --> 00:37:42,320
it boils down to

1062
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:45,040
pretty much you can only really expend a

1063
00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:47,520
single spell slot on a turn

1064
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:51,560
now i did some research

1065
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:51,560
turns out that's very wrong

1066
00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:55,119
which kind of blew

1067
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:57,440
my whole you know

1068
00:37:55,119 --> 00:37:58,800
a put me in my place which is a humbling

1069
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,160
experience

1070
00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:01,200
but

1071
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,200
also

1072
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,960
really was like oh okay this actually

1073
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:08,079
opens up to a lot more possibilities

1074
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:09,040
than i wasn't thinking about and

1075
00:38:08,079 --> 00:38:12,079
suddenly

1076
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:14,480
what was not very attractive to me a

1077
00:38:12,079 --> 00:38:16,560
fighter eldritch knight

1078
00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:19,119
always felt like a bit of a

1079
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:21,760
bad wizard who can hit things

1080
00:38:19,119 --> 00:38:24,240
yeah suddenly the possibility of action

1081
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:27,040
surging two fireballs on your turn

1082
00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:29,040
was a lot more attractive to me here

1083
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:32,800
yeah you still can't

1084
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:35,280
cast two fireballs i don't think um you

1085
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:37,040
might have to trust me on this one um as

1086
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:38,640
i've read more than i would care to

1087
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:40,640
mention around

1088
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,839
various stack overflows and whatnot but

1089
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:43,280
but ultimately

1090
00:38:41,839 --> 00:38:45,440
the only real restriction is bonus

1091
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,960
actions and if you don't have anything

1092
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:48,960
to do with bonus actions

1093
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:51,040
okay outside of the action economy as it

1094
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,640
is normally there's no restriction so

1095
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:54,720
with action surge granted due by a

1096
00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,599
fighter could

1097
00:38:54,720 --> 00:38:56,800
cast

1098
00:38:55,599 --> 00:38:58,480
two spells

1099
00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:59,359
as soon as you bring a bonus action then

1100
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:03,200
it gets

1101
00:38:59,359 --> 00:39:05,040
super locked down and restrictive and

1102
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:07,520
yeah because so on and so on i know if

1103
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,480
you cast with two with the bonus action

1104
00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,960
it's like

1105
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:12,800
one of them has to be a can trip

1106
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:15,599
the first level one has to be a cantrip

1107
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:17,280
and some other nonsense but yeah yeah it

1108
00:39:15,599 --> 00:39:18,240
gets weirdly

1109
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:21,200
like

1110
00:39:18,240 --> 00:39:23,040
again that i've well the proof is that i

1111
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:25,599
was super confused about it for the last

1112
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:27,520
five years and only now have i really

1113
00:39:25,599 --> 00:39:28,960
expended more effort than i would have

1114
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:29,839
liked to have tried to get to the bottom

1115
00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:31,040
of it

1116
00:39:29,839 --> 00:39:32,880
but um

1117
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,640
yeah that was uh the the main

1118
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:36,000
interesting takeaway from that

1119
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:38,000
was that

1120
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:39,760
i often and

1121
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:42,240
you can with melee classes approach

1122
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:44,079
turns sequentially

1123
00:39:42,240 --> 00:39:45,440
okay here's the start of my turn i have

1124
00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:48,480
a number of options laid out in front of

1125
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:50,560
me i move forward and then i do this and

1126
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:52,640
then i hit that and then i move back and

1127
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:54,880
then do i have anything else left oh

1128
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:56,640
yeah i can do a bonus section let me

1129
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:57,760
throw out bardic inspiration

1130
00:39:56,640 --> 00:40:01,040
done

1131
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:03,440
there's that fluidity to it

1132
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:04,800
but when you cast a spell as a bonus

1133
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,960
action

1134
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:09,440
at any point of your turn

1135
00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:11,599
it's locked down the entire turn so you

1136
00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:13,599
can't have that

1137
00:40:11,599 --> 00:40:15,200
sequential thought process to return as

1138
00:40:13,599 --> 00:40:16,560
a spellcaster

1139
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:18,480
you have to know if at any point you're

1140
00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:20,160
gonna do you want to do that because

1141
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:21,680
that affects both

1142
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:23,280
before that

1143
00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:25,200
the time that thing happened and after

1144
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:27,599
the time that happened and i couldn't

1145
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:29,280
think of another example where that

1146
00:40:27,599 --> 00:40:30,240
has that

1147
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:32,400
impact

1148
00:40:30,240 --> 00:40:33,920
yeah to quite the same extent

1149
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:35,359
so you can't just say oh you can't get

1150
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,119
to the end of your turn and go oh do i

1151
00:40:35,359 --> 00:40:39,040
have anything left i can use because

1152
00:40:37,119 --> 00:40:40,880
nine times out of ten you you you're

1153
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:43,440
probably locked down if you've cast any

1154
00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:45,760
kind of spell that's already been

1155
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:47,040
ordained that you can't do something

1156
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,480
else and it was a really kind of

1157
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:50,640
interesting

1158
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:52,480
take on it approaching your turn as a

1159
00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:54,000
whole rather than as a sequence of

1160
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:56,079
events yeah

1161
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:57,760
anyway at least someone else now um you

1162
00:40:56,079 --> 00:40:58,800
know oh god i really hope no one's

1163
00:40:57,760 --> 00:41:00,800
listening to this and goes you're

1164
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:01,920
completely wrong down low i really

1165
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,480
really hope that

1166
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:06,560
that doesn't happen

1167
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:08,720
i'm sure i'm sure i'll find out just as

1168
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:10,079
confused as that's only the die-hard

1169
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:12,800
people who are

1170
00:41:10,079 --> 00:41:13,840
just throwing fireballs just like left

1171
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:16,990
and right they know

1172
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,990
[Laughter]

1173
00:41:17,359 --> 00:41:19,599
um

1174
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:21,920
i also think that's one of the reasons

1175
00:41:19,599 --> 00:41:23,680
why haste doesn't give you the ability

1176
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:24,560
to cast a spell because then i think it

1177
00:41:23,680 --> 00:41:25,520
would be

1178
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:28,240
more

1179
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:29,760
juicy than it already is yeah that would

1180
00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:32,880
be pretty insane

1181
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:34,400
double check uh attack yeah so you can't

1182
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,160
use it to cast a spell and i'm pretty

1183
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:38,000
sure it's because

1184
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:41,119
that that was the loophole they had to

1185
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:43,920
the close there yeah

1186
00:41:41,119 --> 00:41:46,319
okay so i mentioned it at the beginning

1187
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:49,920
around a resource

1188
00:41:46,319 --> 00:41:52,800
it's uh rpg stack exchange

1189
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:55,200
my point was that

1190
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:56,720
sources like that exist that and sage

1191
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:57,520
advice

1192
00:41:56,720 --> 00:41:59,760
which

1193
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:02,079
just obviously implies that

1194
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:03,040
there is an inherent confusion around

1195
00:42:02,079 --> 00:42:05,359
rules

1196
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:07,760
yeah the fact that those are needed and

1197
00:42:05,359 --> 00:42:09,520
still are needed to this day despite 5v

1198
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,359
being however old it is

1199
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:13,119
does always just put a bit of a awry

1200
00:42:11,359 --> 00:42:14,000
smile on my face that yeah people are

1201
00:42:13,119 --> 00:42:15,200
still

1202
00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:17,839
finding

1203
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:20,160
weird edge cases and weird combinations

1204
00:42:17,839 --> 00:42:21,359
of things and

1205
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:23,599
well i don't actually know what that

1206
00:42:21,359 --> 00:42:25,280
might my true point is yeah as i said it

1207
00:42:23,599 --> 00:42:26,400
just brings me back down to earth to

1208
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:28,400
think hey

1209
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:32,240
it's okay to be confused

1210
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:33,599
yeah yeah um i find myself going to

1211
00:42:32,240 --> 00:42:36,560
sage advice

1212
00:42:33,599 --> 00:42:38,480
every now and then and

1213
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:41,200
looking up a question that one of my

1214
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:44,160
players has or even that i have because

1215
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:47,440
it just it comes up in a game where a

1216
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:50,720
player is just like what happens if i do

1217
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:52,800
this and it sounds like a mad scientist

1218
00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:55,200
experiment but it's just like

1219
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:56,560
whoa i never even thought of that it's

1220
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,520
just like

1221
00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:59,920
yeah

1222
00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:02,079
yeah i mean those i i do like those ones

1223
00:42:59,920 --> 00:43:04,480
those are good questions to answer yeah

1224
00:43:02,079 --> 00:43:06,079
ones that i hate answering is do i get

1225
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:08,400
an attack of opportunity

1226
00:43:06,079 --> 00:43:10,000
that grinds my gears but the good

1227
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:11,440
question starts and i posted a tweet

1228
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:13,280
about it recently with my player asked

1229
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,560
me is there

1230
00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:16,880
conservation of

1231
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:19,119
uh of momentum through

1232
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:22,319
spells such as dimension door and misty

1233
00:43:19,119 --> 00:43:23,200
step to which brought my mind to a whole

1234
00:43:22,319 --> 00:43:24,240
and when

1235
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:27,680
gosh

1236
00:43:24,240 --> 00:43:30,319
i have never thought of that before but

1237
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:32,960
it's a totally interesting question

1238
00:43:30,319 --> 00:43:34,960
that's pretty cool

1239
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:38,240
so his thought was he might be having a

1240
00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:40,400
big fool at some point and to stop him

1241
00:43:38,240 --> 00:43:41,839
splatting into the ground he'll misty

1242
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,280
step

1243
00:43:41,839 --> 00:43:45,280
just above it

1244
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:46,800
kill the momentum and just drop the last

1245
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:48,319
meter or so

1246
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:49,760
and um

1247
00:43:48,319 --> 00:43:50,720
luckily we never had to cross that

1248
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:53,040
bridge

1249
00:43:50,720 --> 00:43:55,920
in in the session but it was a very

1250
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:58,400
interesting thought process to just even

1251
00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:00,079
i was like well misty step you disappear

1252
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:02,560
and then you reappear so maybe that

1253
00:44:00,079 --> 00:44:04,640
resets your momentum whereas dimension

1254
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:07,680
door you're stepping through

1255
00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:09,920
a doctor strange portal so maybe

1256
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:11,440
you know you've kind of bent space times

1257
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:13,040
the two parts are aligned so maybe that

1258
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:15,920
would conserve it because it's like a

1259
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:18,000
portal from the video game portals yeah

1260
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:19,839
and it was just like oh gosh this is

1261
00:44:18,000 --> 00:44:21,599
uh that's that's

1262
00:44:19,839 --> 00:44:22,880
yeah that's that's kind of how i would

1263
00:44:21,599 --> 00:44:25,040
think of it i would think of it kind of

1264
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:27,200
like uh in thor dark world when they're

1265
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:29,440
throwing the soda can and it disappears

1266
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:31,680
and then it reappears

1267
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:33,119
and it just keeps going

1268
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:35,839
that's that's kind of how i would do

1269
00:44:33,119 --> 00:44:38,160
dimension door but uh the teleport one

1270
00:44:35,839 --> 00:44:39,280
that's that's an interesting one

1271
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:40,720
um

1272
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:42,640
and i've heard it

1273
00:44:40,720 --> 00:44:45,599
argued the other way to say because

1274
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:47,359
misty steps instantaneous

1275
00:44:45,599 --> 00:44:49,040
you would conserve your momentum because

1276
00:44:47,359 --> 00:44:50,560
it's just like a you were there but now

1277
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:52,960
you're here but you're still moving the

1278
00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:54,480
same way you were moving whereas

1279
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:56,640
because dimension door goes a lot

1280
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:57,760
further and there's a bit of a bigger

1281
00:44:56,640 --> 00:44:58,880
spell

1282
00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:00,800
in quotes

1283
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:02,800
that it's it's a bit more powerful and

1284
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:05,440
can stop that from happening so it's

1285
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:06,640
it's a one food food for thought

1286
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,450
i wonder if it has been answered

1287
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:11,839
actually on stage advice already

1288
00:45:08,450 --> 00:45:13,119
[Laughter]

1289
00:45:11,839 --> 00:45:14,240
but then again if we if we tie that back

1290
00:45:13,119 --> 00:45:15,440
to what we're talking about earlier on

1291
00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:17,839
that like

1292
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:19,680
featherfall exists for a reason and

1293
00:45:17,839 --> 00:45:22,560
perhaps if you let misty step stop you

1294
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:25,920
from falling then you've taken the

1295
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,359
agency away from those whose oh man

1296
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:29,200
i prepared feather for today and i

1297
00:45:27,359 --> 00:45:30,319
needn't of because misty step can do

1298
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:31,119
that as well

1299
00:45:30,319 --> 00:45:33,040
yeah

1300
00:45:31,119 --> 00:45:35,280
then yeah it's it's

1301
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:37,440
they've been short changed that actually

1302
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:40,079
brings up why i don't use uh the

1303
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:42,000
flanking rule oh yeah because there's

1304
00:45:40,079 --> 00:45:43,920
tons of spells and abilities and stuff

1305
00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:44,880
that grant advantage

1306
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:48,720
and

1307
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:51,200
by letting players get advantage by just

1308
00:45:48,720 --> 00:45:54,720
moving into the correct position

1309
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:56,400
you render a lot of those abilities

1310
00:45:54,720 --> 00:45:57,760
not necessarily

1311
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:58,839
useless but

1312
00:45:57,760 --> 00:46:01,920
kind of

1313
00:45:58,839 --> 00:46:03,280
pointless yeah great minds because in my

1314
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:06,800
list here i'm looking at now for my

1315
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:08,240
notes i've got flanking and

1316
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:10,400
it's one that i get the impression a lot

1317
00:46:08,240 --> 00:46:12,319
of dms use which is weird because hey

1318
00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,359
it's an optional rule and b it's buried

1319
00:46:12,319 --> 00:46:15,920
away

1320
00:46:13,359 --> 00:46:17,760
halfway in a chapter in the dm's guide

1321
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:20,319
oh it's because it's a carryover from

1322
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:22,319
3.5 oh there we go so this is the kind

1323
00:46:20,319 --> 00:46:23,680
of historical context i get guests like

1324
00:46:22,319 --> 00:46:26,400
you one for

1325
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:28,960
yeah it was a thing that happened in 3.5

1326
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:30,800
and it was in fourth edition and it was

1327
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:32,640
just right there in the open

1328
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:35,520
and it just carried over

1329
00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:37,839
and because it was optional players just

1330
00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:40,400
assumed that it was a thing and it just

1331
00:46:37,839 --> 00:46:43,760
kept going and going and going and going

1332
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:45,839
it's a whole generational thing

1333
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:47,839
that baggage again

1334
00:46:45,839 --> 00:46:49,680
yeah when i was trying to find a

1335
00:46:47,839 --> 00:46:50,800
reference for it in the rulebook i just

1336
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:54,000
googled

1337
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:55,040
the d5v flanking rules and

1338
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:56,319
one of the

1339
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,680
comments on this article i found

1340
00:46:56,319 --> 00:46:59,359
basically said oh it's difficult to give

1341
00:46:57,680 --> 00:47:01,599
other players advantage so the flanking

1342
00:46:59,359 --> 00:47:03,280
rules can be brought in to do that and

1343
00:47:01,599 --> 00:47:05,280
my immediate thought was

1344
00:47:03,280 --> 00:47:07,119
no it's not any player can give any

1345
00:47:05,280 --> 00:47:08,800
other player advantage by taking the

1346
00:47:07,119 --> 00:47:11,200
help action the help action it

1347
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:12,640
completely renders the help action just

1348
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,760
you just throw it right out the window

1349
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:15,680
because you just

1350
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:17,839
move

1351
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:20,800
yep yeah i was like it's a piece of cake

1352
00:47:17,839 --> 00:47:23,599
everybody can do it even the level zero

1353
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:25,119
npc critic and even your owl familia can

1354
00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:27,359
do it like

1355
00:47:25,119 --> 00:47:29,839
it's it's a piece of cake to give

1356
00:47:27,359 --> 00:47:31,440
somebody advantage the real problem

1357
00:47:29,839 --> 00:47:34,240
is nobody's willing to sacrifice their

1358
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:36,000
own action which is a lot more of a an

1359
00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:38,000
interesting choice

1360
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:39,520
which is why it's challenging it's why

1361
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:42,800
it's interesting it's it's do i what do

1362
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:44,640
i sacrifice to to maybe pay that cost

1363
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:47,119
to have that potential benefit it's a

1364
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:48,559
gamble essentially whereas flanking

1365
00:47:47,119 --> 00:47:50,640
there's no gamble

1366
00:47:48,559 --> 00:47:53,440
there's no interesting decision

1367
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,960
it's just i go there and i get this

1368
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:57,040
yeah cool

1369
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:58,800
yeah but the help action it makes it

1370
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:01,119
makes it a tactical under strategic

1371
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:03,599
decision rather than just

1372
00:48:01,119 --> 00:48:05,920
i'm just gonna move

1373
00:48:03,599 --> 00:48:07,359
yeah and then uh and i i do recall

1374
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:09,839
someone commenting a little while ago

1375
00:48:07,359 --> 00:48:11,920
basically saying that it turns the grid

1376
00:48:09,839 --> 00:48:13,680
into just this dance of the figures on

1377
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:15,200
the grid of them just trying to position

1378
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:18,240
themselves in the most

1379
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:21,119
perfect way to maximize advantage across

1380
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:23,280
the board which seems a bit yeah against

1381
00:48:21,119 --> 00:48:24,640
the spirit shall we say which is ironic

1382
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:26,319
considering we've talked at length about

1383
00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:28,559
how important the rules are and the

1384
00:48:26,319 --> 00:48:31,599
spirit is obviously just some abstract

1385
00:48:28,559 --> 00:48:33,440
concept but yeah

1386
00:48:31,599 --> 00:48:35,359
well the rules don't don't kill the

1387
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,920
spirit you know the spirit is always

1388
00:48:35,359 --> 00:48:40,160
there because even in like board games

1389
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:42,400
and stuff you can see the theme of the

1390
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:44,480
game kind of shine through even through

1391
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:45,760
the rules and stuff they they kind of

1392
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:48,800
preserve it

1393
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:50,880
a good game the rules will

1394
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:53,119
will make the theme and the spirit kind

1395
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:55,520
of shine because they'll represent the

1396
00:48:53,119 --> 00:48:58,240
theme in the spirit of the game whereas

1397
00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:59,040
bad rules will will hamper it and kind

1398
00:48:58,240 --> 00:49:01,760
of

1399
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:03,200
force it into submission

1400
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:05,280
yeah that's true it's one of those

1401
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:08,079
things that's really hard to articulate

1402
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:09,680
it's that if you know when you've read

1403
00:49:08,079 --> 00:49:12,480
a good rule book

1404
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:13,760
but unless you're a rules designer it's

1405
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:16,079
one of those things that's really hard

1406
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:18,400
to be like

1407
00:49:16,079 --> 00:49:19,280
it's good because it makes the game

1408
00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:21,520
better

1409
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:21,520
yeah

1410
00:49:21,599 --> 00:49:24,800
but i i totally get what you're getting

1411
00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:26,559
like you can

1412
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:28,079
see the thread there's a common thread

1413
00:49:26,559 --> 00:49:30,319
there's a common theme there's common

1414
00:49:28,079 --> 00:49:32,079
elements throughout the rules that will

1415
00:49:30,319 --> 00:49:34,400
serve the purpose of

1416
00:49:32,079 --> 00:49:37,040
of whatever it is it's trying to sell

1417
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:39,040
a feeling a thought process

1418
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,000
of that particular game

1419
00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:41,200
yeah

1420
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:43,680
so

1421
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,960
obviously we we're both quite uh

1422
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:47,760
well hopefully you won't be offended if

1423
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:50,240
i say opinionated on a number of rules

1424
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:52,559
oh no i'm not offended at all i i

1425
00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:56,400
definitely am i've gotten into squad

1426
00:49:52,559 --> 00:49:56,400
squabbles at my table about the

1427
00:49:56,839 --> 00:50:02,559
rules uh so i wanted to get your opinion

1428
00:49:59,839 --> 00:50:04,240
on how some any any house rules you

1429
00:50:02,559 --> 00:50:07,359
might have which

1430
00:50:04,240 --> 00:50:08,160
might sound abhorrent but um yeah or

1431
00:50:07,359 --> 00:50:10,480
maybe

1432
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:12,960
an alternative question is any rules

1433
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:14,880
that you've maybe

1434
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:17,359
modified although i know the answer is

1435
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:19,359
probably no or any that you've thrown

1436
00:50:17,359 --> 00:50:21,359
away completely but like you know

1437
00:50:19,359 --> 00:50:23,119
obviously drawing that line in the sand

1438
00:50:21,359 --> 00:50:25,520
so what do you what are your take on

1439
00:50:23,119 --> 00:50:28,079
house rules essentially i don't mind

1440
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:29,040
house rules as long as they serve a

1441
00:50:28,079 --> 00:50:31,119
purpose

1442
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:32,559
uh there's only one real house rule that

1443
00:50:31,119 --> 00:50:34,960
i used in

1444
00:50:32,559 --> 00:50:37,040
fifth edition and that was

1445
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:40,240
i call it the rule of one

1446
00:50:37,040 --> 00:50:41,280
any successful attack does at least one

1447
00:50:40,240 --> 00:50:44,599
damage

1448
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:47,839
unless that damage is nullified by like

1449
00:50:44,599 --> 00:50:49,440
invulnerability or other effects that

1450
00:50:47,839 --> 00:50:51,520
specifically

1451
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:54,000
reduce damage

1452
00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:55,920
so resistance can't get rid of damage

1453
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,520
completely all the way

1454
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:58,400
things like that

1455
00:50:57,520 --> 00:51:00,319
because

1456
00:50:58,400 --> 00:51:02,559
when i first started

1457
00:51:00,319 --> 00:51:04,480
we were playing and

1458
00:51:02,559 --> 00:51:07,359
i don't remember how it happened but one

1459
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:09,520
of my players he had like a resistance

1460
00:51:07,359 --> 00:51:11,440
in one thing and another thing and he

1461
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:13,359
was he wasn't taking any damage and i

1462
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:15,599
was just like okay this is

1463
00:51:13,359 --> 00:51:19,040
this is ridiculous you you've like

1464
00:51:15,599 --> 00:51:20,800
broken the damage system this is

1465
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:22,880
you have to take at least one damage

1466
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:25,040
from a successful attack this that's

1467
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:27,359
just

1468
00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:29,680
so that that was one house rule that i

1469
00:51:27,359 --> 00:51:32,319
had because i remember in older editions

1470
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:34,720
that was how it was you know it was just

1471
00:51:32,319 --> 00:51:37,359
like a successful attack does at least

1472
00:51:34,720 --> 00:51:40,079
one damage otherwise

1473
00:51:37,359 --> 00:51:42,400
what's the point of having a successful

1474
00:51:40,079 --> 00:51:43,760
attack yeah you're changing the def

1475
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:45,440
you're changing the definition of the

1476
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:49,040
word success at that point to mean

1477
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:49,040
something else exactly

1478
00:51:49,119 --> 00:51:53,760
and uh let's see if i if i could change

1479
00:51:52,319 --> 00:51:57,200
something

1480
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:59,440
else that would be um

1481
00:51:57,200 --> 00:52:01,599
i'm not particularly fond of the short

1482
00:51:59,440 --> 00:52:01,980
long rest mechanic in 5th edition right

1483
00:52:01,599 --> 00:52:03,200
now

1484
00:52:01,980 --> 00:52:05,760
[Music]

1485
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:08,079
i get what they were going for

1486
00:52:05,760 --> 00:52:10,319
but for me it doesn't

1487
00:52:08,079 --> 00:52:12,640
it doesn't compare the

1488
00:52:10,319 --> 00:52:13,440
power scale between the classes very

1489
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:16,000
well

1490
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:18,559
it creates this weird

1491
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:21,119
power dynamic between all the classes

1492
00:52:18,559 --> 00:52:22,720
and it it creates a hierarchy of power

1493
00:52:21,119 --> 00:52:24,480
between the classes the spell casters

1494
00:52:22,720 --> 00:52:28,240
are definitely the best and the martial

1495
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:28,240
classes are kind of meh and

1496
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:32,880
yeah you get a lot of elephant and the

1497
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:33,760
room talks of you know some people being

1498
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:35,839
like

1499
00:52:33,760 --> 00:52:37,760
i'm tapped out i need to i need to rest

1500
00:52:35,839 --> 00:52:40,319
now and i was being like no i'm good i'm

1501
00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:42,000
good to go i can keep going yeah yeah

1502
00:52:40,319 --> 00:52:44,800
just lead to those awkward sometimes

1503
00:52:42,000 --> 00:52:47,119
awkward conversations around who's you

1504
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:48,000
know let's not rest here i mean i kind

1505
00:52:47,119 --> 00:52:49,920
of like

1506
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:51,040
the role play conversation side of it

1507
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:52,400
the

1508
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:55,119
you know somebody

1509
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:56,800
having blown all their spells too soon

1510
00:52:55,119 --> 00:52:58,880
having to be like oh can we rest and the

1511
00:52:56,800 --> 00:53:01,119
rest of the party being like no come on

1512
00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:02,400
get your ass in gear

1513
00:53:01,119 --> 00:53:04,000
yeah it's your fault that you don't

1514
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:05,280
notice but i like that the role play

1515
00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:07,760
side of things

1516
00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:08,960
but let's just say i wouldn't want to

1517
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:10,800
balance

1518
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:13,200
what abilities come back on short or

1519
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:15,440
long rests because again it's that

1520
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:17,040
cascading like

1521
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:18,800
trying to keep parity with the power

1522
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:21,920
level of other classes and whatnot it's

1523
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:23,760
just a minefield in my head yeah it's

1524
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:25,200
with the way it's set up it's

1525
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:26,880
you would you would have to go through

1526
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:30,240
and just

1527
00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:32,400
redo everything so it's just whatever it

1528
00:53:30,240 --> 00:53:34,480
is what it is so i'm not gonna mess with

1529
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:34,480
it

1530
00:53:34,720 --> 00:53:38,960
but um yeah that's that's the only house

1531
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:41,359
rule that i've ever used is the rule of

1532
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:43,680
one and um

1533
00:53:41,359 --> 00:53:46,240
another one that i did was uh i had a

1534
00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:48,079
system for creating spells because at

1535
00:53:46,240 --> 00:53:50,800
one point i created a sorcerer who

1536
00:53:48,079 --> 00:53:53,040
specialized in acid spells

1537
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:56,800
well it turns out that there's only

1538
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:58,240
three acid spells and the entire

1539
00:53:56,800 --> 00:54:00,800
spell list

1540
00:53:58,240 --> 00:54:03,440
and one of them was chromatic orb which

1541
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:04,559
can be oh yeah anything

1542
00:54:03,440 --> 00:54:06,640
so

1543
00:54:04,559 --> 00:54:09,440
i was like sol on that and i was just

1544
00:54:06,640 --> 00:54:12,319
like well that really sucks my specialty

1545
00:54:09,440 --> 00:54:14,240
and damage type doesn't do anything for

1546
00:54:12,319 --> 00:54:15,839
me

1547
00:54:14,240 --> 00:54:19,040
so what you re-flavored and re-skinned

1548
00:54:15,839 --> 00:54:21,119
some spells to do acid damage yeah like

1549
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:23,359
fireball and things like that i think

1550
00:54:21,119 --> 00:54:24,720
that made it like acid ball you know

1551
00:54:23,359 --> 00:54:26,640
things like that

1552
00:54:24,720 --> 00:54:28,559
yeah now there probably is

1553
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:30,559
some combat encounters where the

1554
00:54:28,559 --> 00:54:32,480
difficulty will shift because of that

1555
00:54:30,559 --> 00:54:34,000
but otherwise often to my head that

1556
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:36,000
seems

1557
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:37,280
fairly benign

1558
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:39,440
a change

1559
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:42,000
yeah yeah i

1560
00:54:39,440 --> 00:54:44,079
and chromatical also has a a costed

1561
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:45,920
material component as well that gets

1562
00:54:44,079 --> 00:54:47,280
consumed if memory serves so you can't

1563
00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:50,480
just keep throwing those out even if you

1564
00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:54,880
wanted to exactly yeah that sucks i'm

1565
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:57,680
actually rolling a uh chromancy wizard

1566
00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:58,640
which is a uh explorer's guide to will

1567
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:01,119
the mount

1568
00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:03,440
subclass school and that obviously

1569
00:55:01,119 --> 00:55:04,480
because it's a it's a subclass and a

1570
00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:06,640
book that

1571
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,520
is part of some other campaign it's it's

1572
00:55:06,640 --> 00:55:09,280
um

1573
00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:11,280
chromancy spells obviously few and far

1574
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:12,559
between so i know the pain of

1575
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:16,079
being like yeah i'm gonna build a time

1576
00:55:12,559 --> 00:55:19,040
wizard oh there's three time spells okay

1577
00:55:16,079 --> 00:55:20,960
i i guess i'm a fireball wizard then

1578
00:55:19,040 --> 00:55:22,960
it seems like they focused on fire and

1579
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:26,010
it was just like oh i guess every wizard

1580
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:28,799
in the entire universe is a pyromancer

1581
00:55:26,010 --> 00:55:29,920
[Laughter]

1582
00:55:28,799 --> 00:55:32,640
yeah

1583
00:55:29,920 --> 00:55:35,200
and they wonder why adventures just burn

1584
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:36,240
down every tavern therein

1585
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:37,119
yes

1586
00:55:36,240 --> 00:55:39,119
yeah

1587
00:55:37,119 --> 00:55:41,839
i have i have heard that you know that i

1588
00:55:39,119 --> 00:55:42,880
have seen official comments on

1589
00:55:41,839 --> 00:55:45,359
fiber

1590
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:47,280
specifically because i think

1591
00:55:45,359 --> 00:55:49,839
like numerically like mathematically

1592
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:52,559
it's ever so slightly more powerful than

1593
00:55:49,839 --> 00:55:54,799
other spells of its the same level yeah

1594
00:55:52,559 --> 00:55:56,079
but they've basically said hey

1595
00:55:54,799 --> 00:55:57,520
you're gonna have to give us that one

1596
00:55:56,079 --> 00:56:01,599
we're keeping it in just for literally

1597
00:55:57,520 --> 00:56:04,079
just like as a homage to the it's such a

1598
00:56:01,599 --> 00:56:06,079
prominent spell a famous spell that to

1599
00:56:04,079 --> 00:56:07,440
change it now it's almost sacrosanct at

1600
00:56:06,079 --> 00:56:10,559
this point so we're just going to keep

1601
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:12,160
it as it is because it's just a classic

1602
00:56:10,559 --> 00:56:13,839
exactly i wish they would have kept

1603
00:56:12,160 --> 00:56:14,799
lightning bolt the way it was in second

1604
00:56:13,839 --> 00:56:17,040
edition

1605
00:56:14,799 --> 00:56:19,119
in second edition you could pick the

1606
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:21,200
start point where

1607
00:56:19,119 --> 00:56:24,799
lightning bolt started

1608
00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:26,160
and it would ricochet off walls

1609
00:56:24,799 --> 00:56:29,040
that sounds

1610
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:31,760
dope yeah it was really cool so it

1611
00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:33,520
wasn't just this long line and if

1612
00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:35,920
from where you started you could like

1613
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:38,960
say i wanted to start here and it could

1614
00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:41,520
ricochet down hallways and it was just

1615
00:56:38,960 --> 00:56:43,200
it was really cool but now it's just a

1616
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:44,799
line

1617
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:46,319
yeah from where you i mean i thought you

1618
00:56:44,799 --> 00:56:48,319
were just going to stop it you could

1619
00:56:46,319 --> 00:56:50,559
pick where it started from and then draw

1620
00:56:48,319 --> 00:56:53,040
a line from there which is still cool

1621
00:56:50,559 --> 00:56:54,960
for like shooting around corners and

1622
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:57,440
kind of getting around obstacles and

1623
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:59,440
stuff yeah but having it ricocheted too

1624
00:56:57,440 --> 00:57:00,319
is also very cool yeah

1625
00:56:59,440 --> 00:57:02,720
yeah

1626
00:57:00,319 --> 00:57:04,319
one thing i've talked about another dm

1627
00:57:02,720 --> 00:57:06,720
with recently

1628
00:57:04,319 --> 00:57:09,119
and it's it's a it's a home brew

1629
00:57:06,720 --> 00:57:11,280
homebrew it's a house rule that i see

1630
00:57:09,119 --> 00:57:13,680
a lot of people use you know in the

1631
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:15,520
lists on twitter when people say

1632
00:57:13,680 --> 00:57:18,960
well house rules do you use it's always

1633
00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:20,720
on there of potions as a bonus action

1634
00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:22,720
imbibing a potion is a bonus action

1635
00:57:20,720 --> 00:57:25,440
rather than rules is written

1636
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:27,920
it's an action right now i have a little

1637
00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:29,839
bit of baggage myself with this because

1638
00:57:27,920 --> 00:57:31,760
i'm fairly certain that's because of

1639
00:57:29,839 --> 00:57:32,799
critical role that people have adopted

1640
00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:34,079
that rule

1641
00:57:32,799 --> 00:57:34,960
yeah

1642
00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:36,160
which

1643
00:57:34,960 --> 00:57:38,720
has its own

1644
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:38,960
kind of uh it has its own stigma around

1645
00:57:38,720 --> 00:57:41,359
it

1646
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:43,839
[Laughter]

1647
00:57:41,359 --> 00:57:45,520
yeah you know it's

1648
00:57:43,839 --> 00:57:47,680
just weird that

1649
00:57:45,520 --> 00:57:50,319
that's just another game right and it's

1650
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:52,079
that one thing that now everybody takes

1651
00:57:50,319 --> 00:57:53,760
almost for granted

1652
00:57:52,079 --> 00:57:55,440
i feel that

1653
00:57:53,760 --> 00:57:57,359
again maybe i'm going to get

1654
00:57:55,440 --> 00:57:59,839
strung up for this but i kind of like

1655
00:57:57,359 --> 00:58:03,200
that potions require an action same here

1656
00:57:59,839 --> 00:58:04,160
because it it adds that tactical value

1657
00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:06,559
to it

1658
00:58:04,160 --> 00:58:07,440
you have to stop and say

1659
00:58:06,559 --> 00:58:09,680
okay

1660
00:58:07,440 --> 00:58:11,599
i have to make a decision am i gonna use

1661
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:14,319
my turn to

1662
00:58:11,599 --> 00:58:16,880
do the cool thing or

1663
00:58:14,319 --> 00:58:19,760
or am i gonna try and save myself or my

1664
00:58:16,880 --> 00:58:21,520
friend you know and that's it just goes

1665
00:58:19,760 --> 00:58:23,280
back to what you said earlier about

1666
00:58:21,520 --> 00:58:24,960
people wanting their cake and eating it

1667
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:27,040
too yeah

1668
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:29,440
i think as you've said before they could

1669
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:31,920
have picked the terminology better

1670
00:58:29,440 --> 00:58:33,760
i think calling bonus actions

1671
00:58:31,920 --> 00:58:35,839
bonus actions

1672
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:39,119
implies that they are like

1673
00:58:35,839 --> 00:58:41,920
another action yeah and of course you

1674
00:58:39,119 --> 00:58:43,520
can do pretty much anything as an action

1675
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:46,079
so calling them bonus actions just

1676
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:48,160
immediately draws that connection in a

1677
00:58:46,079 --> 00:58:49,359
person's head to say oh they're like

1678
00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:51,040
actions right

1679
00:58:49,359 --> 00:58:53,280
when in reality if you look at the

1680
00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:55,520
things that are bonus actions

1681
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:57,280
that they're quite specific they're

1682
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,880
quite unique they're quite you know

1683
00:58:57,280 --> 00:59:01,200
clearly there's a design intent there to

1684
00:58:58,880 --> 00:59:04,480
say these are exceptional things you can

1685
00:59:01,200 --> 00:59:05,520
do and they're only allowed by

1686
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:07,359
certain

1687
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:10,480
things it's like

1688
00:59:07,359 --> 00:59:13,440
like the rogue for instance he only gets

1689
00:59:10,480 --> 00:59:15,359
the bonus action is only like activated

1690
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:17,599
quote unquote when

1691
00:59:15,359 --> 00:59:19,200
his ability is used it's not like

1692
00:59:17,599 --> 00:59:22,160
everybody has

1693
00:59:19,200 --> 00:59:24,720
a bonus section that they can just use

1694
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:26,960
whenever they want it's just like

1695
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:29,119
that's kind of one of the reasons that i

1696
00:59:26,960 --> 00:59:30,079
kind of went back to running fourth

1697
00:59:29,119 --> 00:59:32,880
edition

1698
00:59:30,079 --> 00:59:35,520
because the action economy is

1699
00:59:32,880 --> 00:59:38,799
actually just much more clear

1700
00:59:35,520 --> 00:59:41,440
in what it wants to do on your turn you

1701
00:59:38,799 --> 00:59:43,280
get a standard action a move action and

1702
00:59:41,440 --> 00:59:44,880
a minor action

1703
00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:47,599
this is what you can do with each of

1704
00:59:44,880 --> 00:59:50,720
them standard actions do this move

1705
00:59:47,599 --> 00:59:53,440
actions do this minor actions do this

1706
00:59:50,720 --> 00:59:57,359
and there's no confusion as to

1707
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:59,359
any of it um yeah yeah and of course

1708
00:59:57,359 --> 01:00:01,920
again like you just said like everybody

1709
00:59:59,359 --> 01:00:04,640
gets an action but nobody

1710
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:07,119
by default has a has a bonus action but

1711
01:00:04,640 --> 01:00:09,200
by calling them the same thing

1712
01:00:07,119 --> 01:00:10,559
people rightly

1713
01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:11,440
assume that they do just like dark

1714
01:00:10,559 --> 01:00:12,799
vision

1715
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:15,200
when you just read that little thing you

1716
01:00:12,799 --> 01:00:16,799
just assume that you do yeah whereas in

1717
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:20,000
reality it's not it's

1718
01:00:16,799 --> 01:00:22,000
your class enables you to spend this

1719
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:23,280
bonus action that may or may not exist

1720
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:24,640
depending on

1721
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:26,640
whether you have anything that can make

1722
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:28,720
use of it yeah so

1723
01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:31,200
allowing potions to be used as a bonus

1724
01:00:28,720 --> 01:00:33,280
action blurs that line even further i

1725
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:35,599
think and and can set a bad you know can

1726
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:38,559
just reinforce that

1727
01:00:35,599 --> 01:00:41,040
wrong interpretation of the rules

1728
01:00:38,559 --> 01:00:43,680
that's exactly what it is if anything

1729
01:00:41,040 --> 01:00:44,960
they should just allow you to

1730
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:47,280
drink your

1731
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:49,520
potion as a reaction because everybody

1732
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:50,480
has a reaction and that all but that

1733
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:52,079
also

1734
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:53,040
lets you drink it in addition to your

1735
01:00:52,079 --> 01:00:55,040
action

1736
01:00:53,040 --> 01:00:56,400
but it also makes it another tactical

1737
01:00:55,040 --> 01:00:59,040
decision because if you use your

1738
01:00:56,400 --> 01:01:01,359
reaction that means you can't take uh

1739
01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:02,880
attacks of opportunity or anything like

1740
01:01:01,359 --> 01:01:06,240
that so

1741
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:07,520
um i'm not sure i'm i'm a strong fan of

1742
01:01:06,240 --> 01:01:09,280
reactions having to have a strong

1743
01:01:07,520 --> 01:01:11,520
trigger and i'm not i'm struggling to

1744
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:13,520
think of what the trigger would be for

1745
01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:14,240
drinking a potion somebody's smacking

1746
01:01:13,520 --> 01:01:19,760
you in the face

1747
01:01:14,240 --> 01:01:21,839
[Laughter]

1748
01:01:19,760 --> 01:01:25,920
but no i get i get what you're saying no

1749
01:01:21,839 --> 01:01:27,920
i'm perfectly fine just doing it raw

1750
01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:30,880
like i said it needs to be a tactical

1751
01:01:27,920 --> 01:01:33,680
decision i'm just saying if uh if you

1752
01:01:30,880 --> 01:01:35,760
were to modify it yeah for sure that's

1753
01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:37,359
that would probably be the better way to

1754
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:38,960
do it

1755
01:01:37,359 --> 01:01:41,760
yes especially if you're trying to give

1756
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:44,240
it to and you know a good example is a

1757
01:01:41,760 --> 01:01:45,280
character's down and you want to go and

1758
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:47,839
feed them

1759
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:49,200
a health potion yeah i think that's one

1760
01:01:47,839 --> 01:01:50,400
of the reasons you know one of the main

1761
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:52,720
reasons that it was brought in as a

1762
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:55,520
bonus action to help people to increase

1763
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:57,680
the survivability of the party but to me

1764
01:01:55,520 --> 01:01:59,760
that's a really critical point you know

1765
01:01:57,680 --> 01:02:01,680
that person is going to live or die

1766
01:01:59,760 --> 01:02:04,079
and just making it even even more

1767
01:02:01,680 --> 01:02:06,000
trivial to get them up when

1768
01:02:04,079 --> 01:02:07,520
the cleric can just shout healing word

1769
01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:09,039
from across the room and suddenly

1770
01:02:07,520 --> 01:02:10,240
they're back up again

1771
01:02:09,039 --> 01:02:11,760
like now just

1772
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:12,960
make that a conscious effort not only

1773
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:15,280
because

1774
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:16,559
rules is written animals is intended it

1775
01:02:15,280 --> 01:02:19,039
seems that that's what they are

1776
01:02:16,559 --> 01:02:20,799
suggesting yeah but also trying to get

1777
01:02:19,039 --> 01:02:22,640
an unconscious person to drink a magic

1778
01:02:20,799 --> 01:02:24,480
potion in the middle of a fight doesn't

1779
01:02:22,640 --> 01:02:27,200
sound particularly exceptional that

1780
01:02:24,480 --> 01:02:28,720
sounds ex very difficult and very

1781
01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:30,880
arduous and

1782
01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:32,400
just as arduous trying to get past

1783
01:02:30,880 --> 01:02:34,640
someone's defenses and bonk them on the

1784
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:36,799
head with a sword yeah in fact it would

1785
01:02:34,640 --> 01:02:39,520
i would argue that it would take longer

1786
01:02:36,799 --> 01:02:43,039
than six seconds so

1787
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:43,039
skill challenge here we come

1788
01:02:44,559 --> 01:02:48,160
like just just using it as a bonus

1789
01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:49,839
action just makes me feel like the

1790
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:51,839
person rushes over to the body just and

1791
01:02:49,839 --> 01:02:53,039
pops the cork and it just dash like just

1792
01:02:51,839 --> 01:02:54,559
pours the liquid on the body right

1793
01:02:53,039 --> 01:02:55,760
that'll do you good

1794
01:02:54,559 --> 01:02:58,000
come on

1795
01:02:55,760 --> 01:02:59,599
or just throws it at him

1796
01:02:58,000 --> 01:03:01,920
smash

1797
01:02:59,599 --> 01:03:04,000
suck it in like osmosis style or

1798
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:08,000
something

1799
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:08,000
like a sponge on the floor just

1800
01:03:08,240 --> 01:03:12,480
i mean i do really like the idea of just

1801
01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:15,200
someone like eating a health potion just

1802
01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:19,200
across the room just smash it

1803
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:19,200
back you're healed anyway uh

1804
01:03:19,359 --> 01:03:23,760
your face is covered in broken glass but

1805
01:03:24,799 --> 01:03:28,640
cool well on on that note is there

1806
01:03:27,119 --> 01:03:32,000
anything else you wanted to discuss

1807
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:33,920
about rules uh no i think we we touched

1808
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:36,640
on it i think i think we made our points

1809
01:03:33,920 --> 01:03:38,960
that we're we're very much in favor of

1810
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:41,119
the rules when the rules apply because

1811
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:43,680
like we said the the game is kind of

1812
01:03:41,119 --> 01:03:46,880
divided into two sections the

1813
01:03:43,680 --> 01:03:48,000
the area where the rules need to to be

1814
01:03:46,880 --> 01:03:50,559
and then

1815
01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:53,039
you know the narrative role-playing game

1816
01:03:50,559 --> 01:03:54,480
where it's not really that important

1817
01:03:53,039 --> 01:03:56,160
where we're just kind of

1818
01:03:54,480 --> 01:03:58,880
doing our thing

1819
01:03:56,160 --> 01:04:00,559
and some rules might pop up every now

1820
01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:03,039
and then but for the most part you can

1821
01:04:00,559 --> 01:04:06,000
kind of wing it and free form it

1822
01:04:03,039 --> 01:04:07,730
and uh everybody out there is probably

1823
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:10,000
going to hate us but whatever

1824
01:04:07,730 --> 01:04:11,920
[Laughter]

1825
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:14,000
i mean it was only a matter of time and

1826
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:15,200
hey if this is you know over 20 episodes

1827
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:16,559
in

1828
01:04:15,200 --> 01:04:18,240
and only people now are going to start

1829
01:04:16,559 --> 01:04:21,039
to hate me i'm happy

1830
01:04:18,240 --> 01:04:21,039
yeah exactly

1831
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:26,240
uh okay cool well

1832
01:04:24,160 --> 01:04:29,039
that was a lot of fun thank you very

1833
01:04:26,240 --> 01:04:31,599
very much for your time today no problem

1834
01:04:29,039 --> 01:04:34,319
uh is there anything you want to plug no

1835
01:04:31,599 --> 01:04:36,400
i'm i'm a i'm a nobody so

1836
01:04:34,319 --> 01:04:38,880
i'm just i'm just glad that uh that you

1837
01:04:36,400 --> 01:04:41,119
had me on here and i thank you for

1838
01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:43,039
having me on here i'm honored to be here

1839
01:04:41,119 --> 01:04:45,839
it was my pleasure and nobody's and

1840
01:04:43,039 --> 01:04:48,079
nobody uh so it was it was it was

1841
01:04:45,839 --> 01:04:49,200
awesome and uh yeah lots of lots of

1842
01:04:48,079 --> 01:04:50,880
interesting things and hey we're on

1843
01:04:49,200 --> 01:04:54,200
there we're on the we're going down on

1844
01:04:50,880 --> 01:04:54,200
the ship together

1845
01:04:54,319 --> 01:04:58,720
we've got that for tuna so

1846
01:04:56,240 --> 01:05:00,480
yep so thank you again for joining us

1847
01:04:58,720 --> 01:05:02,319
thank you everybody

1848
01:05:00,480 --> 01:05:05,039
who's probably throttling at the mouth

1849
01:05:02,319 --> 01:05:06,559
at home who's listened to us talk about

1850
01:05:05,039 --> 01:05:09,520
rules today

1851
01:05:06,559 --> 01:05:11,839
any comments i say in confidence please

1852
01:05:09,520 --> 01:05:14,559
find me on twitter at download

1853
01:05:11,839 --> 01:05:16,720
underscore dnd otherwise

1854
01:05:14,559 --> 01:05:18,620
thank you all for listening and good

1855
01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:23,810
night good night

1856
01:05:18,620 --> 01:05:23,810
[Music]