Dec. 25, 2020

Structure


The first European episode! Despite the relatively benign sounding topic of "Structure", Ian (@thefoolishswamidm) and I discuss many thoughtful and deep topics, such as empathy, care, and responsibility. In this episode you can learn how to structure both your one shots and longer-form campaigns, how to set player expectations both "in-universe" and at the table, and how both those approaches serve different needs. If you want to hear me have quite a candid introspection, then this is the episode for you!

  • 05:05 - How to tell a compelling short-form story through structure
  • 15:16 - Structure & care: two sides of the same coin
  • 20:41 - Using structure to prepare players for a long-form story
  • 30:58 - Having a meta-structure to facilitate different types of players
  • 40:26 - Improvisation while foreshadowing
  • 46:14 - Why holding up the game structure is a joint responsibility
  • 53:52 - Rules to support your structure, and not the other way around

Find Ian (@thefoolishswamidm) on:

Find me on:

'The Ultimate Guide to 5 Room Dungeons' by Johnn Four
'Honey Heist' by Grant Howitt
Intro Music: 'Local Forecast' by Kevin MacLeod
Intermission Music: 'Chill' by Kevin MacLeod
Outro Music: 'Local Forecast - Elevator' by Kevin MacLeod

Transcript

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[Music]

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hello and welcome to another episode of

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thinking critically a d discussion a

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podcast where we deep dive single word

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concepts or ideas within the dungeons

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and dragons 5e framework my name is

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danilo a d d humanoid and i like all

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kinds of games and the crunchy mechanics

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that make him tick

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you can find me on twitter facebook and

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instagram and i'd really appreciate a

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like or a follow

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today i'm joined by ian aka the foolish

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swami dm thank you very very much for

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joining can you tell us a little bit

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about yourself

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hi everyone my name is ian i am a

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dungeon master from belgium 25 years old

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and i've just started

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with putting out some stuff on the dms

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guild

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awesome uh we'll look forward to that

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here about that a bit later on so the

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topic of today's podcast is structure so

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what does that mean to you

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well i think structure can be a lot of

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different things

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depends on

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what you're talking about you can have

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storage structure you can have the way

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you structuralize your games or the way

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your party is structurized

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so i think it's it's it depends on on

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what you're exactly talking about but

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it's always about having some kind of

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balance in your structure it has to be

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strict enough so it's clear for

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everybody and that people can hold on to

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it but there has to be some room for

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improvisation

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or going out of that structure just to

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make the game fun

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um yeah you've pretty much hit on almost

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all of my notes there but one good thing

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that i heard there is that like the

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rules are of 5e d and d5e are a

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framework right they are

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guidance but the very nature of the game

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is improvisational as you said

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so i think getting that balance right

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not only in moment-to-moment play but

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also in

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writing homebrew like you just said for

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something for the dm's guild for

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something is

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very difficult to do and i am

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halfway which is putting it kindly

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through a a published module or a module

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i intend to get published which is one

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i've run before completely homebrew but

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really trying to strike the balance

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there between

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okay this dc needs to be this and then

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the npc says that and this is

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bang bang bang this is a sequence of

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events that happens versus how i usually

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run their game which is the complete

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opposite of

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you know sitting on the edge of my seat

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and just

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firing from the hip kind of thing so

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i think the structure of 5v and as a

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gameplay experience is

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difficult to get right basically from

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every different

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point of view i've never played any

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other

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system

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of dnb except for 5v so i can't compare

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it to 3.5 or fall for example i think

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the structure is set and people tend to

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get lost in it

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but

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the moment you start writing because you

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were saying you wrote something for the

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m scale at the moment you start writing

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stuff for other people it takes on a new

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level

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and you have to

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think about why am i going to

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structuralize it in this way

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a lot of the stuff you can find on the

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ms guild especially the one shots they

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are very straightforward kind of

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railroady structuralized and that's

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something

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i personally don't like not because it's

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not a good way to write a story but what

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happens when my players don't reach the

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clue that they need to get at point a to

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go to point b

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and then you can be

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kind of [ __ ] in your game

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um and then you have to pull off some

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kind of deus ex magna that they're not

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gonna like because then they feel like

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you're treating them as a bunch of

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little kids

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so

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when i sit down to write

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the adventures i write i always go for

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sandbox

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i create the setting i create the npcs i

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create the plot line and how all of this

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fits together but it's on you the gm to

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actually run it so i give you the

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structure for you to work in and that's

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the way i i try to empower other dms who

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might not have the time to do the

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writing that i can do or just maybe

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don't want to be bothered with it

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because they're like this is my free

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time i don't want to spend all this

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extra stuff

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into it i don't want to get out of that

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much out of my comfort zone to write a

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whole bunch of

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plot lines just give me something that

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works and i'll run it yeah people dm for

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different reasons and i think you and i

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are quite alike in i do it because i

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like that world building aspect that

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this would be cool if this thing happens

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and all wouldn't it be good if there was

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this other thing down the line whereas

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some dms and it's totally fine are dming

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for the

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the activity at the table

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and as long as they have a tool kit

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ready to use then they're hot to drop

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good to go so it's it's kind of a i

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scratch your back you scratch mine in a

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way which is quite nice um

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you touched on there about

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kind of one shots on dm to get or just

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in general the structure of a one shot

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and one of my notes was just was going

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to talk about how do we tell a

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compelling story in one to maybe three

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sessions i think as you said it's kind

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of difficult to do

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yeah i think especially when you're

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going about writing very short stories

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the structure of your story has to

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empower the game master who's going to

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run it

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so to me that means giving them a lot of

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freedom in a framework in which they can

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decide how they want to run it

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so when you

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start writing a story you should think

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about three main things one the

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to what is now occurring in the setting

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what is happening how is this setting

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going to influence my players and then

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three what are the other people in this

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setting that are influencing this story

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so you have your setting your plot line

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and your npc's

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and if you can work those two together

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and kind of entail them

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in a spider web you can create some kind

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of sandbox you feel even in a four hour

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session where wherever they kind of go

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they can always find a clue that goes

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back to the center

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and that way you can you can create a

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compelling story without having to kind

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of push them forward it can be all about

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the players and which way they want to

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go

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yeah that's a really elegant way of

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putting it and i have to agree that in

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the few number of one shots i've read

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and seen they are very like a saturday

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morning cartoon it's bang bang bang it's

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here's a setup

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here's the middle bit and here's the end

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and to me that feels very prescriptive

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very

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blinkered because you're basically

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saying for the sake of achieving a

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session in one game

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we are kind of having to cut out half of

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what makes d d d which is a shame in my

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opinion but i guess

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people don't have

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a desire to only play long form

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campaigns

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you'll a metaphor there of kind of the

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spiderweb i think is a great i've i've

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never really thought about design

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you know the structure of a story in

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that way before

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i've come at it from more of

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a process perspective so i really want

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to try and think about how i can employ

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that in my game but it ties in nicely

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with something i've read in the past

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where it's the rule of threes

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so to use your example of clues or hooks

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for players i've always read there

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should be at least three and all three

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lead to the same thing but

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you need at least three because the

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players are gonna miss them

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yeah it's a combination of the rule of

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three and the five room dungeon those

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are two of the bigger texts right now

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out there when you talk about storage

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structure and the

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five room dungeon says there's five

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rooms each room has a certain thing to

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it

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a certain feel

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and

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those rooms together make a nice dungeon

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make a nice story structure which you

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can refer back to react to five because

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it kind of fits together as well

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and then you have the rule of three that

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you always need three clues they go back

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to another thing but those three clues

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don't all three have to go back to the

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same thing you can say my story has a

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five room dungeon

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but a five room dungeon doesn't have to

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be linear it can be set in a circle and

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in each of these rooms they can find

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three clues

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and each of these clues will go back to

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another room

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and that way you create a web

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if you now in those rooms with those

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clues you put together npcs who give the

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clues or the clues are about npcs or

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about npc interactions then you're

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creating a big web

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but it's all about the same story

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so you can actually run it in maybe

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sometimes four hours sometimes 12 hours

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depending on the pace your players are

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setting

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and it's still that same story

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it's just woven together

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it's nice the metaphor of a spider's web

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has now become a literal

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web of rooms

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in a dungeon which is quite good the

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only problem that i see there and it's a

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problem i've faced myself many times is

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obviously when it has to remain sensible

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or congruous so if the dungeon is

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literally a cave system underground or

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maybe some typical lich's lair then you

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can have that labyrinthine

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network of rooms but say the dungeon is

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something unusual like a

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abandoned hospital

270
00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:38,080
for example then the internal logic of

271
00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:39,519
what a hospital is kind of has to come

272
00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:43,040
first if you know what i mean there has

273
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to be wards and corridors and pediatrics

274
00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:46,480
and stuff like that versus i think

275
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what's nice is that there's a balance

276
00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:48,959
which is what we started this discussion

277
00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:51,760
of is

278
00:09:48,959 --> 00:09:54,160
how far you move that slider from

279
00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:56,080
internal realism towards this network

280
00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:57,920
design is where the expertise comes from

281
00:09:56,080 --> 00:10:00,560
really and good dungeon design

282
00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:02,079
ultimately lies within yeah but it's not

283
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because it's

284
00:10:02,079 --> 00:10:05,040
let's look at your example of the

285
00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,959
hospital i think it's a very interesting

286
00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:07,920
example you can still have the five

287
00:10:06,959 --> 00:10:10,720
rooms

288
00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:12,320
the five rooms it's from john 4 actually

289
00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:14,320
great guy

290
00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:16,079
has a lot of interesting stuff

291
00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:18,079
so the five rooms the first room is

292
00:10:16,079 --> 00:10:19,760
entrance and guardian the second room is

293
00:10:18,079 --> 00:10:22,079
puzzle or role-playing challenge the

294
00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:23,760
third room is trick or setback the

295
00:10:22,079 --> 00:10:26,000
thought is the climax the big battle or

296
00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:28,320
the conflict and the fifth is rewards

297
00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:29,920
revelation or plot twist

298
00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:34,240
it's not because you're in a hospital

299
00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:37,040
that you can't have these five rooms or

300
00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,920
these three clues per room because the

301
00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:40,959
room

302
00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:42,240
and the clues are about the story not

303
00:10:40,959 --> 00:10:44,560
about the place

304
00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:46,560
the setting is just the sandbox you

305
00:10:44,560 --> 00:10:48,959
create which shows your players

306
00:10:46,560 --> 00:10:50,880
you can do whatever you want but within

307
00:10:48,959 --> 00:10:52,399
this setting

308
00:10:50,880 --> 00:10:54,079
so because we're talking about structure

309
00:10:52,399 --> 00:10:56,079
it's a structure you make to show them

310
00:10:54,079 --> 00:10:58,240
like you can be free

311
00:10:56,079 --> 00:11:01,440
in whatever you do but if you go outside

312
00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:03,680
of this box then we're out of the story

313
00:11:01,440 --> 00:11:05,600
and that can be a hospital it can be a

314
00:11:03,680 --> 00:11:07,680
dungeon it can be a village it can be a

315
00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:09,120
world depending on how big you want you

316
00:11:07,680 --> 00:11:12,160
want a story to make

317
00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:14,240
and each room even if it has to be set

318
00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:16,560
in some kind of reality like it has to

319
00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:19,279
be pediatric ward or some other typical

320
00:11:16,560 --> 00:11:21,760
place in a hospital they can still talk

321
00:11:19,279 --> 00:11:23,279
about that story you can put clues in

322
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:26,079
your patriotic world

323
00:11:23,279 --> 00:11:28,480
with nbc's with stuff they find

324
00:11:26,079 --> 00:11:30,800
about the overall arc of the story it

325
00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:32,240
just depends on what story it is

326
00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:34,480
but if you if you go about it in a

327
00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:37,600
creative way you can actually do it it's

328
00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:39,200
doable but you have to want to and if

329
00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:40,880
you don't want to that's okay because

330
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:43,920
it's just not the way you structure your

331
00:11:40,880 --> 00:11:45,760
games sure sure yeah i think i

332
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:48,079
am and this is a personality trait of

333
00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:49,839
mine interpreting it very literally i

334
00:11:48,079 --> 00:11:52,880
need to kind of take a step back and

335
00:11:49,839 --> 00:11:55,600
they're using the word room as

336
00:11:52,880 --> 00:11:57,839
a tool to articulate something rather

337
00:11:55,600 --> 00:12:00,240
than literally meaning

338
00:11:57,839 --> 00:12:02,480
four walls and a ceiling yeah the five

339
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,920
rooms are about some kind of emotion or

340
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:06,240
something that happens in the room like

341
00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:08,320
room one is an entrance but an entrance

342
00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:10,800
can be trapped it can be hidden it can

343
00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:13,360
require a special key it can just be

344
00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:15,600
coming in to a story

345
00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:17,920
your entrance can be just your first arc

346
00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:20,480
in your story where people come into a

347
00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:22,160
town and they get to know all the npcs

348
00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:24,160
that's your entry they've known about

349
00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:26,800
the city and you have your setup and

350
00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:28,560
then room two can be your puzzle or your

351
00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:30,399
role-playing challenge can be something

352
00:12:28,560 --> 00:12:32,480
that happens it can be something that

353
00:12:30,399 --> 00:12:34,639
shows the players like there's something

354
00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:36,240
more here a puzzle doesn't have to be

355
00:12:34,639 --> 00:12:38,560
literally a puzzle it can be something

356
00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:40,959
that's puzzling and then you have your

357
00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:44,160
trick or your setback suddenly something

358
00:12:40,959 --> 00:12:46,800
happens they get captured or some npc

359
00:12:44,160 --> 00:12:48,880
they just liked died or whatever and it

360
00:12:46,800 --> 00:12:50,480
can show that there's okay now you're

361
00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:53,360
sure there's something more around here

362
00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:54,240
and then they have to work for room four

363
00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:56,639
they

364
00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:58,160
go around finding clues they might find

365
00:12:56,639 --> 00:13:00,240
rewards and those clues they might find

366
00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:02,320
plot twists which are room five

367
00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:04,240
there might be some revelations and all

368
00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:06,959
these little pieces together will lead

369
00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:08,320
to room four the climax the big battle

370
00:13:06,959 --> 00:13:10,399
or the conflict

371
00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:11,920
the reason i use the hospital example is

372
00:13:10,399 --> 00:13:14,959
because that's actually one i've

373
00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:17,120
designed unbeknowingly with almost the

374
00:13:14,959 --> 00:13:18,000
five-year-old dungeon in mind i think i

375
00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:19,920
am

376
00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,839
lucky in that it kind of came naturally

377
00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:23,920
to me and my desire to

378
00:13:21,839 --> 00:13:25,519
make a very interesting dungeon

379
00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:26,959
a lot of those things kind of fell into

380
00:13:25,519 --> 00:13:28,320
place now i could have formalized it a

381
00:13:26,959 --> 00:13:30,240
little bit better with like the

382
00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,920
breadcrumb trail of the clues

383
00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:33,839
throughout but

384
00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:36,639
the setback for example there was a

385
00:13:33,839 --> 00:13:39,120
central circular staircase

386
00:13:36,639 --> 00:13:41,600
in this hospital and in typical fantasy

387
00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:43,120
fashion there was a trap there where the

388
00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:44,880
stairs

389
00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,720
disappeared and the characters would

390
00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:49,040
slide down to the bottom you know

391
00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,800
classic scooby-doo trap

392
00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:52,480
and the the setback there is you know

393
00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:54,240
they've come in on the ground floor they

394
00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:56,079
investigated the ground floor okay let's

395
00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:58,079
let's head up into the first floor oh

396
00:13:56,079 --> 00:13:59,519
hit this trap uh and then they slide all

397
00:13:58,079 --> 00:14:01,040
the way back down to like the basement

398
00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:03,199
level where there's

399
00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:05,680
another room essentially which again has

400
00:14:03,199 --> 00:14:07,519
these little had a had an npc in there

401
00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:09,040
potentially friendly potentially an

402
00:14:07,519 --> 00:14:11,040
enemy and

403
00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:12,880
that i must admit worked out very well

404
00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:14,240
and for a period of time the players

405
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,160
were like well do we need to go up or do

406
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:18,639
we need to go down it was that middle

407
00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:20,399
puzzling bit that you mentioned so

408
00:14:18,639 --> 00:14:22,000
yeah you've convinced me that even

409
00:14:20,399 --> 00:14:24,000
though i use that example as to say one

410
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:26,000
that might not work in little did i know

411
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,440
that i'd actually made it work in myself

412
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:29,120
almost

413
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:30,800
without even knowing it

414
00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,480
so that's something i want to do some

415
00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:33,600
homework on and have a think about how i

416
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,800
can do that

417
00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:36,560
at the moment i'm running a current

418
00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:39,440
dungeon for my players right now which

419
00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:42,480
is your typical kobold cave system and i

420
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:44,560
kind of brute forced the

421
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:46,560
freedom by literally having the first

422
00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:48,240
kind of outside of the entrance room the

423
00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:49,839
next room they come into is just a split

424
00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:51,680
just three tunnels

425
00:14:49,839 --> 00:14:53,839
and it's they go guys you've got three

426
00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:56,320
ways to go around this dungeon and it's

427
00:14:53,839 --> 00:14:57,760
circular in nature and

428
00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:59,440
there could have been perhaps some more

429
00:14:57,760 --> 00:15:01,760
guidance there you know

430
00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:04,880
scratch marks to suggest one tunnel was

431
00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:06,480
used for a particular reason or humidity

432
00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:08,800
in another tunnel to suggest that lead

433
00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:10,160
to an area of water might have been a

434
00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:12,320
better thing to do but that's the kind

435
00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:14,399
of stuff that i need to work on and when

436
00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:16,399
i get around to if i ever get around to

437
00:15:14,399 --> 00:15:17,600
writing this down for dm's guild

438
00:15:16,399 --> 00:15:19,839
those are the kind of things i have to

439
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:22,079
remind myself to include yeah but that's

440
00:15:19,839 --> 00:15:24,800
a structure you put down for your

441
00:15:22,079 --> 00:15:26,399
players because it gives them an idea of

442
00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,440
what to choose between

443
00:15:26,399 --> 00:15:29,680
you're telling them you have three

444
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:31,680
tunnels but right now they have no clues

445
00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:33,120
no foreshadowing what they could expect

446
00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:34,000
in those tunnels

447
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:35,600
and

448
00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:38,079
if that's something you usually do with

449
00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:40,320
your players it's okay they won't really

450
00:15:38,079 --> 00:15:42,399
react badly to it because their use of

451
00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:44,560
it it's the structure that they have

452
00:15:42,399 --> 00:15:45,279
that you've always given them as a dm

453
00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:47,279
but

454
00:15:45,279 --> 00:15:49,360
some players will

455
00:15:47,279 --> 00:15:51,360
always look for a way to

456
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:53,279
find that structure you're gonna have

457
00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:55,440
those players who will try to do like

458
00:15:53,279 --> 00:15:57,839
three investigation checks

459
00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:59,040
just to be sure about something

460
00:15:57,839 --> 00:16:02,880
and that's because

461
00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:06,160
they need that structure there's an um

462
00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:08,160
caregiving there's a theory a a system

463
00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:11,199
where they talk about structure versus

464
00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:14,480
care okay what what it basically says is

465
00:16:11,199 --> 00:16:16,560
that a child needs both to grow and it's

466
00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:19,360
the same with your players as a dungeon

467
00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:21,279
master it's the same when you're running

468
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:23,040
a company same when you're talking to

469
00:16:21,279 --> 00:16:25,120
other people you need to give them a

470
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:27,680
structure that they know and that they

471
00:16:25,120 --> 00:16:29,199
can trust and then you give them care

472
00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:32,000
within that structure

473
00:16:29,199 --> 00:16:33,519
for example it's okay if you don't know

474
00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:35,759
what that spell does

475
00:16:33,519 --> 00:16:37,680
we'll take a look together we'll figure

476
00:16:35,759 --> 00:16:40,639
it out but the structure

477
00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:43,040
is or you need one spell slot of six

478
00:16:40,639 --> 00:16:44,800
level to cast that spell

479
00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:46,320
so they know i can only try this if i

480
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:48,000
have this

481
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:49,279
and then next to that if i'm

482
00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:51,440
afraid of something or i don't know

483
00:16:49,279 --> 00:16:53,199
what's happening they're gonna help me

484
00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:55,040
because if your players

485
00:16:53,199 --> 00:16:56,800
lose that trust and that can be because

486
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:58,720
you're not caring for them or you're not

487
00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:01,279
giving them enough structure then you're

488
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:04,000
gonna see a lot of against play

489
00:17:01,279 --> 00:17:05,439
a lot of anti-play where players like oh

490
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:07,439
yeah you come into town you have to give

491
00:17:05,439 --> 00:17:08,880
up all your weapons no i'm not doing

492
00:17:07,439 --> 00:17:10,160
that no

493
00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,760
i'm not giving away my weapons you're

494
00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:14,880
gonna you're gonna kill me

495
00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:18,400
yeah i think uh they're not quite there

496
00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:20,959
yet they can be quite antagonistic but i

497
00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:23,600
don't think that is purely due to a lack

498
00:17:20,959 --> 00:17:25,280
of foreshadowing on my part i think a

499
00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:27,360
lot of them are first timers and they're

500
00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:29,360
doing a little bit of wish fulfillment

501
00:17:27,360 --> 00:17:30,320
in terms of i just want to be the bad

502
00:17:29,360 --> 00:17:33,600
boy

503
00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:35,760
and be an antagonist essentially i could

504
00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,120
definitely and i'm kicking myself down

505
00:17:35,760 --> 00:17:38,880
because i really like the idea that i

506
00:17:37,120 --> 00:17:40,160
made up on the spot of each one of those

507
00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,400
tunnels being

508
00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:43,840
foreshadowed in some unique way so now

509
00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,919
i'm annoyed that i didn't do that when i

510
00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:48,080
actually ran the bloody thing so lesson

511
00:17:45,919 --> 00:17:49,760
learned i suppose so yeah there's

512
00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,799
probably improvements again there that i

513
00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,960
can do and

514
00:17:50,799 --> 00:17:54,799
you know the purpose of this podcast is

515
00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:56,080
is to kind of have these little nuggets

516
00:17:54,799 --> 00:17:58,720
of

517
00:17:56,080 --> 00:18:00,720
tips and things to think about and so

518
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:02,160
i'm really happy that we're discussing

519
00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:05,200
this real nitty gritty you know

520
00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:07,039
structure of writing something and as i

521
00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:08,720
mentioned previously for me it's

522
00:18:07,039 --> 00:18:10,160
i'm just winging it

523
00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:11,679
yeah but don't don't forget that you

524
00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:13,039
need to take care of yourself as well

525
00:18:11,679 --> 00:18:15,120
it's not because you forget something

526
00:18:13,039 --> 00:18:17,280
that is bad it's okay

527
00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:19,120
did your players enjoy themselves

528
00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:20,400
that's all i care about

529
00:18:19,120 --> 00:18:21,600
they're hot they're halfway through it

530
00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:24,080
at the moment we're just about to take a

531
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,360
break for christmas period but um well

532
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,200
we'll see if they get out the other side

533
00:18:25,360 --> 00:18:29,520
first and then i'll tell you

534
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:31,120
whether i enjoyed it or not i designed

535
00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,080
my structure in a way that i can take

536
00:18:31,120 --> 00:18:34,799
care of

537
00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:36,880
my story myself and my place so that we

538
00:18:34,799 --> 00:18:39,679
can all have fun and there's enough

539
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:42,160
space to do some stupid stuff

540
00:18:39,679 --> 00:18:44,000
for example my players went to a bar

541
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:46,559
they did a huge challenge there that the

542
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:48,320
barkeep was 100 sure they could never do

543
00:18:46,559 --> 00:18:49,679
it so he would he batted a lot of money

544
00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,840
against him

545
00:18:49,679 --> 00:18:54,000
in the end of course they did it and

546
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:55,039
varkey was so broke that he had to sell

547
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:56,960
his bar

548
00:18:55,039 --> 00:18:58,880
and the players of course with all the

549
00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:00,000
money bought the bar and gave it their

550
00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:02,640
own name

551
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:05,039
that's awesome yeah so it's about making

552
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:06,799
a structure that allows for those

553
00:19:05,039 --> 00:19:09,440
moments it's about a structure that

554
00:19:06,799 --> 00:19:11,520
allows for doing something bad getting a

555
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:12,799
call wrong because if you create a kind

556
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:14,880
of sense with your place where you can

557
00:19:12,799 --> 00:19:16,480
talk about it then you can say look last

558
00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,320
session i did something wrong do you

559
00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:20,799
want to retake it do we go further with

560
00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:22,000
story like it's now and they'll tell

561
00:19:20,799 --> 00:19:23,679
what they want

562
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,840
but is that structure that makes sure

563
00:19:23,679 --> 00:19:27,360
that your players keep coming and make

564
00:19:25,840 --> 00:19:29,679
sure that there's an understanding

565
00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:31,280
between the different players or with

566
00:19:29,679 --> 00:19:32,799
you and the player

567
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,320
it's that structure that makes sure that

568
00:19:32,799 --> 00:19:35,919
players will trust you in what you're

569
00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:37,919
doing and they know that you're not

570
00:19:35,919 --> 00:19:39,679
going to just kill them out of nowhere

571
00:19:37,919 --> 00:19:42,799
yeah or that you're not gonna do this

572
00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:45,360
like big world changing event without

573
00:19:42,799 --> 00:19:47,919
their characters being in it

574
00:19:45,360 --> 00:19:50,160
yeah for sure yeah i think i've done a

575
00:19:47,919 --> 00:19:52,320
fairly decent job of communicating that

576
00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:54,559
and building that trust i like to think

577
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:56,720
well they're still quite dubious of you

578
00:19:54,559 --> 00:19:58,160
know a lot of npcs which i don't know

579
00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:00,320
where that's come from because i've met

580
00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:03,280
a heck of a load of really friendly npcs

581
00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:05,360
but that's a story for another time but

582
00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:07,440
yeah in terms of not just unfairly

583
00:20:05,360 --> 00:20:09,600
killing them that i'm

584
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:11,919
very paranoid of

585
00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:14,240
that kind of stuff so yeah i've you know

586
00:20:11,919 --> 00:20:16,000
i go to great lengths to ensure that

587
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:16,960
there's no just one role

588
00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:19,760
deaths

589
00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:21,760
fail to save okay that's 10 d10 damage

590
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,840
whoops you're dead okay that just kind

591
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:26,159
of sucks for everybody and is crap

592
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:28,000
storytelling as well unless of course

593
00:20:26,159 --> 00:20:29,679
you know the usual caveats of have you

594
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:32,559
foreshadowed it you know has there been

595
00:20:29,679 --> 00:20:33,679
obvious signs that if they do that they

596
00:20:32,559 --> 00:20:36,320
will get hurt

597
00:20:33,679 --> 00:20:37,200
and then okay yeah the gloves are off

598
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:38,799
and

599
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:41,120
they're gonna get got

600
00:20:38,799 --> 00:20:43,440
so we talked earlier on about

601
00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:45,280
uh your thoughts on how to tell a

602
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:48,400
compelling story in one to three

603
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:51,200
sessions with that five room web based

604
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:53,039
theory crafting is that the same for a

605
00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,120
long form campaign

606
00:20:53,039 --> 00:20:57,679
it can be i know i certainly like to

607
00:20:55,120 --> 00:20:58,960
work in that way where i have a world

608
00:20:57,679 --> 00:21:00,559
and a lot of things are happening in

609
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:03,520
this world and it's because of this this

610
00:21:00,559 --> 00:21:05,679
and this and this and in this place

611
00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,640
you're going to notice that this way and

612
00:21:05,679 --> 00:21:08,080
in this place you're going to notice

613
00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:09,360
that this way and in this place you're

614
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,280
going to notice that this way and if you

615
00:21:09,360 --> 00:21:13,039
connect all the little dots together

616
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:14,640
you're going to know where to go next

617
00:21:13,039 --> 00:21:16,320
and your players are going to drive the

618
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:19,039
story forward because they want to know

619
00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:21,200
okay but like we had some demon

620
00:21:19,039 --> 00:21:23,440
sightings in this city and we had some

621
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:25,200
celestial sightings in this city

622
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:27,520
is there like a connection between these

623
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:30,480
two what could this mean maybe we should

624
00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:32,559
go to some kind of temple figure out

625
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:35,280
if there's something happening there

626
00:21:32,559 --> 00:21:36,880
so it's a web you also create you just

627
00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:39,120
make it a little bit bigger

628
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,159
i make very story heavy campaigns and

629
00:21:39,120 --> 00:21:42,880
that's not

630
00:21:40,159 --> 00:21:45,679
everyone's take and that's okay

631
00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:47,840
but for me i almost never

632
00:21:45,679 --> 00:21:50,240
run like random encounters

633
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:52,640
yeah i can make a random encounter table

634
00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:54,960
and i'll run the table but it will be

635
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:56,480
encounters i've designed to let the

636
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:58,640
players know something more about my

637
00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:00,480
world what about the story

638
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,480
yeah or about what's what's actually

639
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:04,240
happening in this place yeah they make

640
00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:07,039
sense in universe

641
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:08,400
yeah for me it's all about story and it

642
00:22:07,039 --> 00:22:10,400
doesn't mean that the world can be

643
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:12,799
random it can

644
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:14,799
but it will be in a way that that makes

645
00:22:12,799 --> 00:22:16,960
sense or in a way that that players will

646
00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:19,679
think like oh yeah you know five

647
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:22,000
sessions ago we saw that little dwarf

648
00:22:19,679 --> 00:22:24,320
guy who was talking about this kind of

649
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,760
dwarf lord and now we meet that dwarf

650
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:26,880
lord who has something to do with the

651
00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:29,760
story

652
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:32,720
yeah i am completely the same

653
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:34,480
i am rubbed up against that need for

654
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:36,000
constant encounters while they travel

655
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:38,159
you know seven encounters a day or

656
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:39,760
whatever the number is and every time

657
00:22:38,159 --> 00:22:41,679
i've gone now i'm just i'm just not

658
00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:44,720
going to because it doesn't make sense

659
00:22:41,679 --> 00:22:46,400
and one of my players at one point said

660
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:48,400
hey really loving the campaign and

661
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:50,159
whatnot but it feels like we haven't had

662
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,600
combat in forever

663
00:22:50,159 --> 00:22:53,760
and i said oh let me have a think

664
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:55,679
because that's not been my perception

665
00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:57,520
and i said well actually to be fair you

666
00:22:55,679 --> 00:22:59,679
guys are in a major city

667
00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:01,200
you did an encounter there that you did

668
00:22:59,679 --> 00:23:03,200
without combat so

669
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,799
i mean you chose not to have combat in

670
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:07,280
that instance and then you've gone from

671
00:23:04,799 --> 00:23:08,400
one city to another on a very safe

672
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:11,360
travel route

673
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:13,039
and no one wants to kill you there so

674
00:23:11,360 --> 00:23:14,640
you know there's not going to be any

675
00:23:13,039 --> 00:23:16,080
combat because you're in the middle of a

676
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,280
popular city and at the moment they're

677
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:20,840
at a lower level level where they're not

678
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:23,360
you know targeted by assassins or other

679
00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:24,640
arbitrary fights but on the second hand

680
00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:26,880
they're also not low enough level that

681
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:29,360
the combat would have to be quite exotic

682
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:31,440
and to have basilisks burrow up out of

683
00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:34,400
the ground

684
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:35,760
might make sense if that fits what's

685
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:38,159
happening in your campaign with

686
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,919
subterranean creatures coming up but

687
00:23:38,159 --> 00:23:40,960
otherwise it's going to be very random

688
00:23:39,919 --> 00:23:42,799
for

689
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:44,880
the capital city to be like whoa this is

690
00:23:42,799 --> 00:23:46,480
the first basilisk attack we've had in

691
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:48,000
400 years

692
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:49,679
and it just so happens that it happens

693
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,640
to be when the players are there

694
00:23:49,679 --> 00:23:54,960
so yeah i'm a huge proponent of

695
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:57,120
making the combat encounters make sense

696
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:59,200
in universe yeah it doesn't mean that

697
00:23:57,120 --> 00:24:01,440
you can't have like random

698
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,039
combats doesn't mean you can't just have

699
00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:04,240
a good combat but

700
00:24:03,039 --> 00:24:06,559
there's always going to be a second

701
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:09,200
layer to it it can it can also just be

702
00:24:06,559 --> 00:24:11,919
so that you're doing the combat just to

703
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:14,240
otherwise teach your players something

704
00:24:11,919 --> 00:24:16,400
yeah sorry to jump in but

705
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:18,480
it's great minds again because

706
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:20,559
literally in the early levels after a

707
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,520
piece of combat i explicitly said to

708
00:24:20,559 --> 00:24:23,360
them

709
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,760
okay that's to teach you

710
00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:27,600
that enemies have resistances like now

711
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:29,600
now you'll know not to blow all your

712
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,960
spell slots because this is the first

713
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,880
time you've had three combat encounters

714
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:35,760
in a row that kind of stuff you know

715
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:38,799
especially for the the newer players

716
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:40,720
i explicitly said okay this combat has

717
00:24:38,799 --> 00:24:43,679
taught you that if one of you gets

718
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:46,240
stunned that's bad or damage resistances

719
00:24:43,679 --> 00:24:48,559
are a thing and that's bad i think

720
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:50,159
especially at younger levels random

721
00:24:48,559 --> 00:24:52,720
combats can add

722
00:24:50,159 --> 00:24:55,919
a lot to the story even if you don't put

723
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:58,559
as much in it as a dm just like

724
00:24:55,919 --> 00:25:00,400
a comet with random bandits at that

725
00:24:58,559 --> 00:25:02,000
point can learn the party

726
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:04,480
how they should structuralize themselves

727
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:05,679
in a combat situation yeah who's going

728
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:08,000
to be in the front it's going to be on

729
00:25:05,679 --> 00:25:10,080
the back who has the flanks who has to

730
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:12,400
range who needs to be everywhere for the

731
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:14,000
healing and by letting them try out

732
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,600
those little things with these little

733
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,840
kind of combats they're going to figure

734
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,880
it out before they hit their first major

735
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:20,080
villain

736
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,000
and they're not going to die like a

737
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,679
bunch of snowflakes in the sun

738
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:25,120
yeah you're preparing them as you said

739
00:25:23,679 --> 00:25:26,240
it's that care

740
00:25:25,120 --> 00:25:27,120
factor

741
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,039
of

742
00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:30,799
guiding them to be like this is the

743
00:25:29,039 --> 00:25:32,320
stuff that can happen and also from a

744
00:25:30,799 --> 00:25:34,000
mechanical point of view to that band

745
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:36,000
encounter it can also swing the other

746
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,760
way in terms of if they could talk their

747
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:39,120
way out of it or whatever there's

748
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:41,039
another route that they could

749
00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:44,400
potentially take and that again teaches

750
00:25:41,039 --> 00:25:45,520
them hey you don't have to murder

751
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,279
everything

752
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,799
you come across yeah it gives them an

753
00:25:47,279 --> 00:25:50,559
opportunity to figure out a party

754
00:25:48,799 --> 00:25:53,039
structure are we a party who talks first

755
00:25:50,559 --> 00:25:55,279
or a party who hits first are we a party

756
00:25:53,039 --> 00:25:57,520
who flanks are we a party who just goes

757
00:25:55,279 --> 00:25:59,840
straight forward are we a party of

758
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:01,440
spellcasters who just hey let's just

759
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,480
keep our distance and

760
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:05,840
let's just

761
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:07,039
[ __ ] them all up with fireball

762
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:09,919
which

763
00:26:07,039 --> 00:26:11,840
that latter one tends to be how my guys

764
00:26:09,919 --> 00:26:13,520
go i'm kind of running two games at the

765
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,360
moment and both have

766
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:18,000
the cliche of a very fireball happy

767
00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:20,000
caster on the back line so yeah check

768
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,240
that d bingo box

769
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:25,760
but also that it's a really elegant way

770
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:27,200
of as you mentioned of having flavor put

771
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,000
into the world

772
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,559
so

773
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:32,880
perhaps these bandits are

774
00:26:30,559 --> 00:26:36,000
quite well maintained maybe they've got

775
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:38,080
decent armor on them but hang on why

776
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,840
they hi women why are they holding up

777
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,279
people on the side of the road that begs

778
00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:42,799
the question then of

779
00:26:41,279 --> 00:26:45,279
what the heck is happening in the

780
00:26:42,799 --> 00:26:47,360
economy in this part of the city and

781
00:26:45,279 --> 00:26:50,240
that's such a elegant way of introducing

782
00:26:47,360 --> 00:26:52,960
those moments of flavor that you don't

783
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:55,200
have to heavy hand later on with oh the

784
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,240
politicians have said that bandits are

785
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,760
now

786
00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,760
rich and have got loads of money and can

787
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,679
afford really good stuff on on a

788
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:04,159
newspaper they see next time they go to

789
00:27:01,679 --> 00:27:05,919
town yeah for example or maybe your band

790
00:27:04,159 --> 00:27:08,159
is sort of starving and that's why

791
00:27:05,919 --> 00:27:10,799
they're attacking because they they're

792
00:27:08,159 --> 00:27:12,880
not able to get any food because of x y

793
00:27:10,799 --> 00:27:14,559
z that then later on has a more

794
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:17,760
significant part of your story it

795
00:27:14,559 --> 00:27:20,080
doesn't have to be oh this encounter has

796
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:23,039
thing a that directly connects to b no

797
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:24,480
it can go a few extra steps your world

798
00:27:23,039 --> 00:27:26,799
and what the story that is happening in

799
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:29,520
the world is going to influence your

800
00:27:26,799 --> 00:27:30,960
world and everyone in it not only the

801
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,200
party

802
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:34,799
so it's before you do a random encounter

803
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,520
you can use a random encounter table but

804
00:27:34,799 --> 00:27:38,720
just think about how can i put something

805
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:40,480
in here

806
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:42,480
that shows the way my world is

807
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:45,440
structuralized and that shows what is

808
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:47,440
happening maybe on a very small scale

809
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:50,159
not everything has to be grand

810
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:52,399
yep yep that's something i need to think

811
00:27:50,159 --> 00:27:55,440
about i'm quite happy with how it's gone

812
00:27:52,399 --> 00:27:56,320
so far hands up they have had

813
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,960
one

814
00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:01,440
generic bandit encounter

815
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:04,000
which at the time was

816
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:05,520
pretty straightforward pretty much

817
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,440
on the face of it

818
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:11,440
they got attacked in the night by the

819
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:12,799
side of the road by bandits okay however

820
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:14,480
the beauty of

821
00:28:12,799 --> 00:28:17,760
d d is that

822
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:20,000
i then have complete freedom to

823
00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:21,919
incorporate that not in point b maybe

824
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,440
but in point c d e and f

825
00:28:21,919 --> 00:28:25,120
later on to say hey those guys that

826
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,080
attacked you on the road well maybe they

827
00:28:25,120 --> 00:28:28,000
were

828
00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:29,600
in some way related to something else or

829
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:30,720
because you killed them all and murdered

830
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,000
them all and got rid of the bodies

831
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,840
without checking the bodies you didn't

832
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:37,120
know that they were hired by somebody

833
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:39,200
and so on and so on so i'm quite

834
00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:42,799
i guess a fan of

835
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:44,559
dm retconning when it is fair to do so

836
00:28:42,799 --> 00:28:46,080
i guess that's what i'm getting at yeah

837
00:28:44,559 --> 00:28:47,679
because that's the structure of your

838
00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,760
game in your world

839
00:28:47,679 --> 00:28:52,720
other people might think i just put out

840
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:54,640
a bunch of architects because that's my

841
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,320
world orcs are aggressive and they go

842
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:58,000
around and that's the structure if

843
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,360
you're gonna travel a road you know it's

844
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:02,000
going to be dangerous

845
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:03,840
so by showing your players that showing

846
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:06,000
not telling by showing them that you

847
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,200
teach them how to interact with your

848
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,960
world

849
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:11,039
and there again you have that structure

850
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:12,559
versus care thing because you're caring

851
00:29:11,039 --> 00:29:14,720
for them you're hitting them for for

852
00:29:12,559 --> 00:29:16,480
what's going to happen in this world how

853
00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:19,120
it works but you're giving them the

854
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:20,720
structure of how to fit into it and then

855
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,640
they're going to do the same thing for

856
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:24,880
you because they're going to show you

857
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:27,279
this is my character please care for my

858
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,720
character this is what he likes this is

859
00:29:27,279 --> 00:29:29,760
what he doesn't like this is how he role

860
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,200
plays

861
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,520
and you can you can show that care in

862
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:36,399
different ways for some dm's it's

863
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:38,240
making special patrons for warlocks for

864
00:29:36,399 --> 00:29:40,399
other resists making

865
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:42,080
specific magic items for certain players

866
00:29:40,399 --> 00:29:44,000
because they know that is the play style

867
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:45,520
and they're going to use it in that way

868
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:46,559
and it's it's all about the balance

869
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:49,039
between

870
00:29:46,559 --> 00:29:51,200
those things and the balance is

871
00:29:49,039 --> 00:29:52,720
always according to the one who

872
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:54,799
is running the game with the people he's

873
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:57,279
running it for

874
00:29:54,799 --> 00:29:59,279
there's no structure that always works

875
00:29:57,279 --> 00:30:00,640
some people just want to hit some

876
00:29:59,279 --> 00:30:02,240
monsters

877
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:04,320
and that's okay and other people want

878
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:06,559
more role play and that's okay and some

879
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:08,720
tables will have a mix

880
00:30:06,559 --> 00:30:11,279
which is where i find myself with a

881
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:13,919
quite a varied player base of six

882
00:30:11,279 --> 00:30:15,760
who do run that whole gamut from

883
00:30:13,919 --> 00:30:18,159
i want to hit something to here's my

884
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:20,080
warlock patron please let's have

885
00:30:18,159 --> 00:30:23,279
interactions with them

886
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:25,520
mr dm which is fun and interesting and

887
00:30:23,279 --> 00:30:28,159
sometimes hard to

888
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:31,279
get them all to come together and

889
00:30:28,159 --> 00:30:33,120
work together to do a single cause but

890
00:30:31,279 --> 00:30:34,960
it ties in very nicely with

891
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:37,360
on the previous episode of this podcast

892
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:39,200
or talking to manny about emotions and

893
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:41,520
trying to find out what makes players

894
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:44,240
tick and trying to elicit a response

895
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:49,080
from them ties in very nicely to how you

896
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:49,080
structure your world to enable that

897
00:30:49,170 --> 00:30:52,509
[Music]

898
00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,360
i'm running stone king's thunder at the

899
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,519
moment

900
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,760
and i've made an expansion i'm calling

901
00:31:01,519 --> 00:31:05,039
it the kraken society expansion and i'm

902
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,320
going to write it and put it on them

903
00:31:05,039 --> 00:31:08,399
skill later but it's going to take some

904
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:09,440
time i have eight players around my

905
00:31:08,399 --> 00:31:11,919
table

906
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,919
wow which is okay a lot

907
00:31:11,919 --> 00:31:15,519
yeah i'll shut up talking about how how

908
00:31:13,919 --> 00:31:16,880
problem it is with my six players

909
00:31:15,519 --> 00:31:19,120
because uh

910
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:21,360
um i have eight players they're all very

911
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:24,000
different in the way they want to play i

912
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:25,440
have players who need to get out 54 dick

913
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,559
jokes in one session or they're gonna

914
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:29,440
explode

915
00:31:26,559 --> 00:31:32,320
i have players who need to have the

916
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:34,399
feeling of deep emotion in a session and

917
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:36,399
i have players who just want to slice

918
00:31:34,399 --> 00:31:38,799
someone's head off and i have players

919
00:31:36,399 --> 00:31:40,799
who are in between all those three

920
00:31:38,799 --> 00:31:42,480
and that's okay and i've always said to

921
00:31:40,799 --> 00:31:44,320
them from the beginning i said i'm gonna

922
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:46,559
run a campaign and the reason why i

923
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:49,519
started running dnd in my hometown was

924
00:31:46,559 --> 00:31:51,120
because i moved from university and i

925
00:31:49,519 --> 00:31:52,799
got back after a few years and not

926
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,679
really talking with anyone and i was

927
00:31:52,799 --> 00:31:56,000
like

928
00:31:53,679 --> 00:31:57,760
i don't really have any friends here but

929
00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,919
of course i had i had friends i had

930
00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:01,919
acquaintances from before i have family

931
00:31:59,919 --> 00:32:04,159
here i just

932
00:32:01,919 --> 00:32:05,279
wanted a way to be able to have fun with

933
00:32:04,159 --> 00:32:06,320
my friends

934
00:32:05,279 --> 00:32:09,120
at least

935
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:10,559
once in a month and for me that was d

936
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,760
because it also allowed me to do some

937
00:32:10,559 --> 00:32:13,600
storytelling and i said from the

938
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:15,039
beginning of this campaign i said i'm

939
00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:17,200
gonna run it we can be with eight

940
00:32:15,039 --> 00:32:18,960
players but everybody needs to be able

941
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,880
to participate in it in the way they

942
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:23,039
want to

943
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:25,919
which means that for the guy who just

944
00:32:23,039 --> 00:32:29,039
wanna does dick jokes he can but not

945
00:32:25,919 --> 00:32:30,640
always in the forefront you know sit

946
00:32:29,039 --> 00:32:33,200
next to a guy who really loves your dick

947
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:36,159
jokes and just now and then yeah talk

948
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:37,919
between the two of you it's okay

949
00:32:36,159 --> 00:32:39,120
well maybe i'm doing the intricate role

950
00:32:37,919 --> 00:32:40,399
play with the one who needs the deep

951
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,399
emotions

952
00:32:40,399 --> 00:32:45,039
but it also means that some players will

953
00:32:42,399 --> 00:32:46,480
not experience the game in the same way

954
00:32:45,039 --> 00:32:48,480
and that is something that players need

955
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,760
to know that if they're not going to do

956
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,120
a lot of note keeping if they're not

957
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:52,880
going to take a lot of attention and

958
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:54,000
it's going to be running forward and

959
00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:56,240
hitting things that they're going to

960
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:58,559
miss a deeper layer in my games because

961
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,919
that's the way i create my games yeah

962
00:32:58,559 --> 00:33:02,320
and if they're okay with that then

963
00:32:59,919 --> 00:33:04,000
that's okay for me and that is

964
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:06,080
the structure we have laid out between

965
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:07,679
us and it's because i have these kind of

966
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,519
structures with my players with all

967
00:33:07,679 --> 00:33:11,840
eight of them that i'm able to run for

968
00:33:09,519 --> 00:33:12,960
eight players because they know when to

969
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,279
shut up

970
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:17,360
because i've told them

971
00:33:15,279 --> 00:33:19,039
i've told them before when i was i was

972
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:21,360
doing a one-on-one kind of role play

973
00:33:19,039 --> 00:33:22,240
thing with one and the guy with his dick

974
00:33:21,360 --> 00:33:24,320
joke

975
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,840
just said one too loud at the wrong time

976
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:28,159
and i just turned my head and i said

977
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:29,679
dude shut up you're taking this moment

978
00:33:28,159 --> 00:33:32,320
away from him

979
00:33:29,679 --> 00:33:35,039
yeah so structure is not only about how

980
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:36,720
you do the rules how you play with the

981
00:33:35,039 --> 00:33:37,600
rules how you play with each other but

982
00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:40,480
also

983
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:42,320
sometimes being a yeah like tough love

984
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:44,320
sometimes being tougher and saying no

985
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:46,080
this is the line i'm sorry but this is

986
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:47,519
not gonna work if we're gonna do all of

987
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,480
this together

988
00:33:47,519 --> 00:33:50,799
i think

989
00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:52,799
there won't be a table that who hasn't

990
00:33:50,799 --> 00:33:55,200
required an interaction

991
00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:57,039
like that in the past i'd like to say hi

992
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:59,200
guys shut up because i can't hear the

993
00:33:57,039 --> 00:34:01,120
conversation i'm trying to have and i've

994
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,559
said like you go and laugh but this

995
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:05,600
guy's trying to have he doesn't role

996
00:34:02,559 --> 00:34:07,039
play that often so i'm really having to

997
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:09,440
this is a great opportunity here and you

998
00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:10,399
guys are talking over it so shut up and

999
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,440
listen

1000
00:34:10,399 --> 00:34:13,679
basically

1001
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,599
they've had their goofy time so now it's

1002
00:34:13,679 --> 00:34:17,040
serious time so yeah there won't be a

1003
00:34:15,599 --> 00:34:19,040
game where that hasn't happened or

1004
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,800
someone's lying if they say

1005
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:21,839
because that's just that's the human

1006
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:23,599
nature

1007
00:34:21,839 --> 00:34:25,119
i always tell my players

1008
00:34:23,599 --> 00:34:27,280
especially at the beginning of sessions

1009
00:34:25,119 --> 00:34:29,440
i'll often start my session with um guys

1010
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,280
can you all listen to me my ego needs

1011
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:33,919
your attention now

1012
00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:36,079
and just by putting in those small kind

1013
00:34:33,919 --> 00:34:38,079
of jokes they know like okay this is

1014
00:34:36,079 --> 00:34:40,079
where where we try to line but i'm not

1015
00:34:38,079 --> 00:34:41,760
attacking them

1016
00:34:40,079 --> 00:34:43,919
so there's there's different ways to put

1017
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:45,599
in the structure as you have with story

1018
00:34:43,919 --> 00:34:47,040
there's different way to put to put in a

1019
00:34:45,599 --> 00:34:49,200
story that you have you can go straight

1020
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,720
forward railroad you can go despite the

1021
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:52,560
web we talked about

1022
00:34:50,720 --> 00:34:54,560
but it's the same with structuring the

1023
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:56,639
way you talk to people

1024
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:58,240
it's not because i'm i'm not okay with

1025
00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:59,599
the behavior you're setting

1026
00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:02,480
that i have to

1027
00:34:59,599 --> 00:35:04,880
put that in a negative sense

1028
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:06,880
i can tell you with a warm and calm

1029
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:09,520
voice like okay

1030
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:11,040
i understand you find this funny but

1031
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,240
right now at this moment it just doesn't

1032
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:14,160
work for me

1033
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:16,560
and maybe five minutes later if he would

1034
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:18,880
say the same joke i would maybe be

1035
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,760
cracked up mm-hmm yeah that's just being

1036
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,520
a

1037
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,880
human being and the

1038
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:24,720
the only frustrating thing is that

1039
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:26,320
everything we're talking about is much

1040
00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:27,440
easier said than done

1041
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,760
even in

1042
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:32,560
a laboratory setting let alone

1043
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:34,720
a live table when especially the dm has

1044
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:36,880
a million and one things going around in

1045
00:35:34,720 --> 00:35:38,880
their head but i think that's

1046
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:41,040
that's where you start to see that

1047
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:42,800
separation from

1048
00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:44,800
i don't want to say amateur that sounds

1049
00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:46,560
too harsh but you know what i mean just

1050
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:48,400
just someone who's picked up the dungeon

1051
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:50,480
masters guide and gone let me give this

1052
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:53,359
a shot to somebody who's

1053
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:55,119
putting in a shitload of effort to

1054
00:35:53,359 --> 00:35:57,520
really have an experience well the

1055
00:35:55,119 --> 00:35:59,200
biggest difference is the kind of game

1056
00:35:57,520 --> 00:36:01,359
master who can

1057
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,960
who can actually pull it off having a

1058
00:36:01,359 --> 00:36:04,400
lot of players having a lot of story

1059
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,920
having a lot of everything is the one

1060
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:10,000
who knows his structure and the

1061
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:12,000
structure of his players he has set a

1062
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:14,320
a way of sitting around the table with

1063
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:16,720
all of them together that works for him

1064
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:19,040
that allows him to maintain the story as

1065
00:36:16,720 --> 00:36:22,079
well as maintain the fun and to max out

1066
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:23,839
both of them and to play with him

1067
00:36:22,079 --> 00:36:25,520
he he's a

1068
00:36:23,839 --> 00:36:27,200
director of an orchestra and the

1069
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:29,200
orchestra is played by the by the

1070
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:32,079
players and the instruments of the story

1071
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:34,000
and he knows exactly when to maybe put

1072
00:36:32,079 --> 00:36:35,839
in a little bit more bass or when you go

1073
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,599
for the hi-hats or when to go for the

1074
00:36:35,839 --> 00:36:39,839
strikers it's

1075
00:36:37,599 --> 00:36:42,800
because he has set up the structure

1076
00:36:39,839 --> 00:36:45,040
himself he has created it

1077
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:46,480
yeah that's a really nice way of

1078
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:48,000
thinking about it really and it also

1079
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:49,200
kind of reinforces that idea if we're

1080
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,040
all in it

1081
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,800
together right everyone has a part to

1082
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,880
play and

1083
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:57,119
you know we all have times where we need

1084
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:58,000
to clang that triangle and if we don't

1085
00:36:57,119 --> 00:37:00,079
then

1086
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:02,079
it might fall a bit flat

1087
00:37:00,079 --> 00:37:03,680
for me the ideal session

1088
00:37:02,079 --> 00:37:06,079
is the session where

1089
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:08,720
i don't have to do a lot oh for sure

1090
00:37:06,079 --> 00:37:09,599
and the only way to create that is

1091
00:37:08,720 --> 00:37:11,599
if you

1092
00:37:09,599 --> 00:37:13,440
set expectations between players and

1093
00:37:11,599 --> 00:37:14,880
between yourself at your place and by

1094
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:17,280
doing that by giving that a certain

1095
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:18,960
structure they know how to communicate

1096
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:22,160
with each other i can give you a more

1097
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:24,480
concrete example with corona hitting the

1098
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:27,520
world and we went in belgium in lockdown

1099
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:29,599
the first time i had to run suddenly an

1100
00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,640
internet game on roll 20 with eight

1101
00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:33,440
players

1102
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:34,480
i had no idea how to do that so we did a

1103
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:36,960
one shot

1104
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:38,000
honey heist from groundhog went terribly

1105
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:41,520
i

1106
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:44,160
finished it i was exhausted i

1107
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:46,160
hated it but my players enjoyed it and

1108
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:48,079
it was just an overload because i didn't

1109
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:49,359
know how to structuralize my games

1110
00:37:48,079 --> 00:37:51,280
through the internet yeah i've never

1111
00:37:49,359 --> 00:37:53,040
done it before and so one of the things

1112
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,560
we i talked about with players is

1113
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,240
there's a lot of

1114
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,160
time between

1115
00:37:56,240 --> 00:37:59,520
uh your takes where you don't have a lot

1116
00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:01,200
of input as a player when you play

1117
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,200
online yeah you just sit in front of a

1118
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:04,560
screen you have to wait especially if

1119
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:05,520
you're running a combat with eight

1120
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:06,800
players

1121
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:08,240
you just have to wait and there's not

1122
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:10,400
much to be done

1123
00:38:08,240 --> 00:38:13,599
so one of the things i did with my place

1124
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:15,040
we created a a discord server with

1125
00:38:13,599 --> 00:38:16,320
different text channels and different

1126
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:18,400
video channels

1127
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:20,800
where players could switch between the

1128
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:23,119
channels if they wanted to maybe just

1129
00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:24,720
talk about tactics during the combat and

1130
00:38:23,119 --> 00:38:26,160
they would just switch and when it was

1131
00:38:24,720 --> 00:38:27,520
their turn i could just pull them back

1132
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:29,760
into the server where i was running the

1133
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:31,680
combat and they knew what to do

1134
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:33,599
and in the meantime we did different

1135
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:35,760
text channels because some of them

1136
00:38:33,599 --> 00:38:38,400
really wanted to still make tick jokes

1137
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,200
so we had a meme channel and during the

1138
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,200
game

1139
00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:43,920
i only saw it afterwards but

1140
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:45,599
50 100 memes during a four-hour session

1141
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:47,280
would be on there and i would just have

1142
00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:49,200
i would have a great time afterwards

1143
00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:50,640
reading them yeah and in the meantime my

1144
00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:52,480
players were still listening to what was

1145
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:54,720
happening but they found an outlet for

1146
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,400
that creativity that they normally can

1147
00:38:54,720 --> 00:38:59,680
do at the table that they couldn't do

1148
00:38:56,400 --> 00:39:02,240
online yeah i think that shift to online

1149
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:04,640
play has obviously hit everybody or

1150
00:39:02,240 --> 00:39:06,560
pretty much everybody myself included i

1151
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:09,040
was lucky that i had some

1152
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:10,400
mainly player experience of remote play

1153
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,480
and

1154
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:15,440
what's interesting is obviously there's

1155
00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:17,119
a bit of a anxiety there as you said

1156
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:18,320
like i've not done this before it's a

1157
00:39:17,119 --> 00:39:20,320
completely different way of not

1158
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:22,079
completely different way of playing but

1159
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,200
a bit of a different way of playing

1160
00:39:22,079 --> 00:39:26,720
right it's a different atmosphere it's a

1161
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:27,680
different vibe and aside from your idea

1162
00:39:26,720 --> 00:39:28,800
there of having a different voice

1163
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:30,800
channel and tech channel which is

1164
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:32,480
something i'm absolutely going to steal

1165
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:34,800
my players have kind of taken to it

1166
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:36,800
quite well and yes there's only

1167
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:38,880
six in in quotes

1168
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:40,640
but um they have taken to it rather well

1169
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:42,400
and in some ways it's

1170
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,960
it's got them to focus more

1171
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:45,839
despite being distanced because there's

1172
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,680
no

1173
00:39:45,839 --> 00:39:48,880
table play

1174
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:50,480
which

1175
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:51,760
some have admitted like they enjoyed

1176
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:53,680
that but

1177
00:39:51,760 --> 00:39:55,520
it actually took them out of the game so

1178
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:57,440
they were kind of sacrificing the game

1179
00:39:55,520 --> 00:40:00,000
to have something else but now one of

1180
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:01,359
them said you know that's actually i

1181
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:03,359
i didn't know but i actually did want to

1182
00:40:01,359 --> 00:40:05,760
focus and think more and now i can

1183
00:40:03,359 --> 00:40:07,680
because i'm not [ __ ] around with my

1184
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:09,280
mate next to me so

1185
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:11,760
the structure there has changed to

1186
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,359
enable the new ways of approaching it

1187
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:15,599
and new ways of thinking about it and i

1188
00:40:13,359 --> 00:40:16,960
think for the better it's

1189
00:40:15,599 --> 00:40:18,880
we're lucky i think in that we've

1190
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:20,960
transitioned quite well to a digital

1191
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:22,640
format

1192
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:24,319
another gi used earlier on i was

1193
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:26,640
thinking about when i was writing my

1194
00:40:24,319 --> 00:40:28,240
notes for this thing about long-form

1195
00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:30,560
story structure

1196
00:40:28,240 --> 00:40:32,079
is the way i do it at least which i

1197
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:34,000
think we've discussed is not

1198
00:40:32,079 --> 00:40:36,160
prescriptive it's similar to you in that

1199
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:38,240
it's very freeform

1200
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,839
it's very hairy and major pieces here

1201
00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:42,240
are major players

1202
00:40:39,839 --> 00:40:44,079
the players can fill in the gaps and tie

1203
00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:46,160
it all together themselves

1204
00:40:44,079 --> 00:40:48,480
and what i likened it too is that

1205
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:50,720
there's a film a wallace and gromit film

1206
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:51,680
which those in the uk will be familiar

1207
00:40:50,720 --> 00:40:52,800
with

1208
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,720
where

1209
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,240
he's on a model train going around the

1210
00:40:54,720 --> 00:40:57,920
lounge and he's putting the track down

1211
00:40:56,240 --> 00:41:01,119
in front of him as he's going around on

1212
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:03,440
the train and that was what i likened my

1213
00:41:01,119 --> 00:41:05,200
dm style to in that the lounge might

1214
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:07,200
have a coffee table in it and a

1215
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:09,680
footstool and a couple of chairs which

1216
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:11,920
would be your big bad encounters your

1217
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:14,640
dungeons but the way the players lay the

1218
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:16,319
track to get there is entirely up to

1219
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:17,760
them in a way so they're kind of laying

1220
00:41:16,319 --> 00:41:19,040
their own i mean now i think about it's

1221
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:19,960
actually a bad metaphor because of the

1222
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:22,400
railroading

1223
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:24,240
[Laughter]

1224
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,440
suggestions to it but i i quite like

1225
00:41:24,240 --> 00:41:27,119
that idea of you know they could go left

1226
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:29,599
they can go right they can do a loop

1227
00:41:27,119 --> 00:41:31,359
and whatnot but those big things are

1228
00:41:29,599 --> 00:41:32,560
still present in the universe and if

1229
00:41:31,359 --> 00:41:34,480
someone comes in you know tucks the

1230
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:37,040
chair in which is tied into what we're

1231
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:39,680
saying earlier on like other actors

1232
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:41,280
in the setting can impact it that can

1233
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:43,119
still happen while the players are

1234
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:44,720
having fun

1235
00:41:43,119 --> 00:41:48,640
putting the track down in front of

1236
00:41:44,720 --> 00:41:50,880
themselves so that was my own way of

1237
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:51,760
badly describing the chaotic nature of

1238
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:53,680
my

1239
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:55,520
my campaign structure

1240
00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:57,760
i think it's a fun analogy

1241
00:41:55,520 --> 00:42:00,800
the dog is he wallace or gromit

1242
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:03,040
uh he is grommet okay so if you look at

1243
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:04,720
gromit as your players then you're not

1244
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:06,319
railroading because they're deciding

1245
00:42:04,720 --> 00:42:08,400
which track to take

1246
00:42:06,319 --> 00:42:11,599
you've put down a world a setting a

1247
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:13,040
sandbox with chairs and tables and they

1248
00:42:11,599 --> 00:42:15,599
decide if they want to go to the chairs

1249
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:18,400
first or to the tables first or

1250
00:42:15,599 --> 00:42:19,920
yeah precisely and the way i've done

1251
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,520
that and this isn't blowing my own

1252
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:24,400
trumpet this is just you know food for

1253
00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:26,480
thought for listeners or yourself to say

1254
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:27,839
okay that's that's one way to do it is i

1255
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,359
i riffed on

1256
00:42:27,839 --> 00:42:31,680
the small amount of critical role one

1257
00:42:29,359 --> 00:42:33,119
i'd listen to so i have

1258
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:35,680
in the macro

1259
00:42:33,119 --> 00:42:38,000
completely sandbox in that here's eight

1260
00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:40,240
things you can go after players

1261
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:41,440
pick any one of the eight you know

1262
00:42:40,240 --> 00:42:43,040
chapters in the book if they want to do

1263
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,960
chapter seven and then chapter three

1264
00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:46,880
cool that's fine

1265
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:49,200
so that's a very high level

1266
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:50,880
structure kind of free-form structure

1267
00:42:49,200 --> 00:42:52,319
i've put in place to say

1268
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:53,599
you can go left and then you can go

1269
00:42:52,319 --> 00:42:55,680
right or you can go straight and then

1270
00:42:53,599 --> 00:42:58,640
you can go right what i probably need to

1271
00:42:55,680 --> 00:43:01,520
apply a little more structure to is the

1272
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:02,640
moment to moment the five room dungeons

1273
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,800
the

1274
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:06,560
scratch marks on the tunnel wall

1275
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:08,560
that kind of stuff is what i personally

1276
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:10,720
need to work more on and i think once i

1277
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:13,119
have that in place the whole

1278
00:43:10,720 --> 00:43:15,200
thing will be uplifted the moment you

1279
00:43:13,119 --> 00:43:17,119
will have put kind of the structure of a

1280
00:43:15,200 --> 00:43:19,119
five-room dungeon in your game or the

1281
00:43:17,119 --> 00:43:20,880
moment you've internalized that into

1282
00:43:19,119 --> 00:43:23,839
your the way you think about your

1283
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:25,280
campaign the foreshadowing stuff

1284
00:43:23,839 --> 00:43:27,200
it will just be there

1285
00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:29,359
it'll just happen your players will go

1286
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:31,440
to a place and you know they're going to

1287
00:43:29,359 --> 00:43:33,280
hit a first and then they're going to go

1288
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,560
b but you know and beat this and this

1289
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:36,480
happens and you know they have to be

1290
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:38,720
prepared so you'll just make up

1291
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:40,400
something in a to foreshadow it

1292
00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:43,440
which can be very easy maybe an old

1293
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:44,800
friend who just recently visited point b

1294
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:47,680
and can talk about what's happening

1295
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:49,200
there or yeah it can just be some kind

1296
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:50,160
of material clue or it can just be

1297
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:52,079
gossip

1298
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:53,920
the reason why it's

1299
00:43:52,079 --> 00:43:55,599
fun to have a world that lives in

1300
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:58,560
breezes because you can use their world

1301
00:43:55,599 --> 00:43:59,760
to foreshadow for your place

1302
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:02,240
and something i'm definitely going to

1303
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:05,119
employ in the chapters that they haven't

1304
00:44:02,240 --> 00:44:07,359
gone to yet of which there is plenty

1305
00:44:05,119 --> 00:44:08,880
left and trying to incorporate those

1306
00:44:07,359 --> 00:44:11,280
elements a little bit more just to do a

1307
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:14,160
little bit more signposting despite

1308
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:15,599
having dm'd for quite a long time you

1309
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:17,280
know a good couple of years and this you

1310
00:44:15,599 --> 00:44:19,359
know with these players

1311
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:21,280
i still struggle with that player dm

1312
00:44:19,359 --> 00:44:23,839
perception so obviously it's very

1313
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:25,359
difficult to disassociate yourself from

1314
00:44:23,839 --> 00:44:27,599
the structure that you've built and the

1315
00:44:25,359 --> 00:44:29,200
structure that you've planned and to try

1316
00:44:27,599 --> 00:44:31,280
and flip that around and see yeah but

1317
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:33,440
the players can only see this tiny

1318
00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:35,680
sliver of it and they're making their

1319
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:37,839
decisions based on

1320
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:40,560
a two degree slither of the pie of the

1321
00:44:37,839 --> 00:44:41,839
structure whereas i can see 360 degrees

1322
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:43,359
yeah but you can you can always talk

1323
00:44:41,839 --> 00:44:44,880
about it with your place

1324
00:44:43,359 --> 00:44:46,640
if something happens if you see that

1325
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:48,400
there's approaching something very

1326
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:51,520
slowly or in a way that you didn't

1327
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:52,880
expect you can just ask why did you

1328
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:55,440
do it that way

1329
00:44:52,880 --> 00:44:56,319
and what do you need

1330
00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,720
to

1331
00:44:56,319 --> 00:45:00,560
do it in the way that that i felt like

1332
00:44:58,720 --> 00:45:03,520
it it should have been done

1333
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,640
and and not by going a or b

1334
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:06,960
it's not like

1335
00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:08,640
the way i think is the right way yeah

1336
00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:10,640
yeah i understand but i'm i'm talking

1337
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:12,800
more about the behavior your players

1338
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:14,800
will put forward if your players are us

1339
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:17,119
players afraid you'll notice it in your

1340
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:20,240
game and you can just ask them why were

1341
00:45:17,119 --> 00:45:22,319
you so afraid of going to this point

1342
00:45:20,240 --> 00:45:25,200
what was holding you back and what do

1343
00:45:22,319 --> 00:45:27,440
you need to actually be able to go there

1344
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:28,560
confidently without being afraid that

1345
00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,800
something

1346
00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:32,560
very big is going to happen

1347
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:35,200
i say this because i have

1348
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:38,560
very big very deadly encounters in my

1349
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:39,760
game and sometimes they come out of

1350
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,920
nowhere

1351
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:43,440
where i might have felt like i

1352
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:46,640
foreshadowed this

1353
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:48,240
or it's normal if you're gonna act this

1354
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:49,760
this and this way against this this and

1355
00:45:48,240 --> 00:45:52,640
this kind of monster he's going to try

1356
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:54,319
to rip your head off yeah but my players

1357
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:56,880
didn't know

1358
00:45:54,319 --> 00:45:58,880
i didn't foreshadow it to them enough

1359
00:45:56,880 --> 00:46:00,960
and so that that's my fault

1360
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:02,560
and i've told him like okay i'm i don't

1361
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,760
want to do you guys like this you're my

1362
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:06,640
friends

1363
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:09,280
so what do you need for me in order

1364
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:10,800
to not make this happen anymore and some

1365
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:13,280
of them told me

1366
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:15,599
what it is that they specifically needed

1367
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:16,720
and other said it's fine for me the way

1368
00:46:15,599 --> 00:46:18,079
it is

1369
00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:20,640
yeah but it's it's not because you're

1370
00:46:18,079 --> 00:46:22,640
the one making the structure that you're

1371
00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:24,160
the only one who has input in that

1372
00:46:22,640 --> 00:46:26,240
structure

1373
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:28,240
your players as well as creating the

1374
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:30,000
game as well as creating the story they

1375
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:31,040
also create that structure

1376
00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:32,240
by

1377
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,079
saying to

1378
00:46:32,240 --> 00:46:36,400
the other guy who's five minutes later

1379
00:46:34,079 --> 00:46:38,560
bro you're late come on

1380
00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:41,280
or when it's taking you like a half a

1381
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:42,960
century to pick a date them just saying

1382
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:45,119
can you just please fill in the doodle

1383
00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:48,640
or something so we can you know have a

1384
00:46:45,119 --> 00:46:50,800
game yeah it's a responsibility that you

1385
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:52,960
hold up together you're not the only one

1386
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:55,359
carrying this game as a game master it

1387
00:46:52,960 --> 00:46:56,480
has to be the whole table

1388
00:46:55,359 --> 00:46:57,440
yeah that's

1389
00:46:56,480 --> 00:47:00,960
really

1390
00:46:57,440 --> 00:47:03,200
wise words and hands up i've

1391
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:05,599
been getting a little bit burned out if

1392
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:08,240
i'm being honest over the past

1393
00:47:05,599 --> 00:47:11,200
couple of weeks and months and that's

1394
00:47:08,240 --> 00:47:13,599
partly due to just the onslaught of dnd

1395
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:15,920
that my life now is but also partly

1396
00:47:13,599 --> 00:47:18,880
because of feeling like i was having to

1397
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:20,559
do a lot of the heavy lifting and it

1398
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:22,079
wasn't so much of

1399
00:47:20,559 --> 00:47:23,760
the dm sets the pieces up and the

1400
00:47:22,079 --> 00:47:24,559
players knocked them down it was pretty

1401
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:26,000
much

1402
00:47:24,559 --> 00:47:28,400
i was having to do a lot of the knocking

1403
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:30,240
down as well so coming into december i

1404
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:32,160
said okay look guys we're gonna take a

1405
00:47:30,240 --> 00:47:34,319
break over christmas and new year's i

1406
00:47:32,160 --> 00:47:36,000
need to recharge refresh

1407
00:47:34,319 --> 00:47:37,760
you know approach the story

1408
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:40,319
from a different perspective

1409
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:42,640
going into next year here's how

1410
00:47:40,319 --> 00:47:45,599
things are going to change and i

1411
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:48,480
set that expectation perhaps a bit too

1412
00:47:45,599 --> 00:47:50,559
late or perhaps at the best time i

1413
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:52,720
that remains to be seen but i basically

1414
00:47:50,559 --> 00:47:54,720
said you've got to learn the rules

1415
00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:56,319
because we're 50 sessions in

1416
00:47:54,720 --> 00:47:58,400
so you've got to learn the rules you've

1417
00:47:56,319 --> 00:48:00,160
got to learn your spells if you don't

1418
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:02,400
you'll lose your turn or you'll take the

1419
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:04,720
dodge action if you continue to do so

1420
00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:06,480
then either you leave or i leave

1421
00:48:04,720 --> 00:48:08,800
essentially that's that's not where

1422
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:10,880
we're at yet but it's it's getting there

1423
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:13,520
right and it ties back into what you

1424
00:48:10,880 --> 00:48:15,200
said before like the dm is

1425
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:17,280
unless you're being paid

1426
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:19,280
to do it you're there to make to have

1427
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:20,640
fun yourself and you've got to really

1428
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:23,119
take care of that don't forget both

1429
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:24,720
sides of the coin because you're telling

1430
00:48:23,119 --> 00:48:27,119
them this is my structure you need to

1431
00:48:24,720 --> 00:48:28,480
learn the rules and if you don't then

1432
00:48:27,119 --> 00:48:30,960
it's over

1433
00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:32,640
but you've have you asked them

1434
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:34,240
what do you need from me to learn those

1435
00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:35,200
rules is there something i can do to

1436
00:48:34,240 --> 00:48:36,800
help you

1437
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:39,280
you have to take take care of them as

1438
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:41,920
well it goes both ways

1439
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:43,280
not in those exact words

1440
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:46,079
obviously i've offered

1441
00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:48,319
them my rule book many times in the past

1442
00:48:46,079 --> 00:48:50,480
and have told them how to get the rules

1443
00:48:48,319 --> 00:48:51,440
and stuff but i you know

1444
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:53,359
yeah but

1445
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:55,440
it can be it doesn't have to be

1446
00:48:53,359 --> 00:48:57,040
in that kind of way i'll i'll give an

1447
00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:58,480
example of myself an example of a player

1448
00:48:57,040 --> 00:49:03,200
i'll start with myself

1449
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:04,240
recently i've um so we use doodle to

1450
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:06,559
set up

1451
00:49:04,240 --> 00:49:08,160
when we're going to play and often it

1452
00:49:06,559 --> 00:49:10,079
takes a lot of time and i have to ask

1453
00:49:08,160 --> 00:49:12,800
again and again and again for some

1454
00:49:10,079 --> 00:49:15,440
people to just fill it in and what that

1455
00:49:12,800 --> 00:49:17,200
had done to me as a person is that i

1456
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,800
felt like my players didn't want to play

1457
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:21,440
my game

1458
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:23,040
because they weren't filling in

1459
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:26,000
to date

1460
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:28,400
and i've now recently said look i'm not

1461
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:29,839
going to make another doodle again

1462
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:32,160
if you want to play

1463
00:49:29,839 --> 00:49:34,160
then make a doodle

1464
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:36,319
and what that i've seen now is players

1465
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:38,720
just saying are we going to play again

1466
00:49:36,319 --> 00:49:41,119
where is the doodle

1467
00:49:38,720 --> 00:49:43,119
and so i know that they want to play

1468
00:49:41,119 --> 00:49:44,800
again and i know that i'm not constantly

1469
00:49:43,119 --> 00:49:46,640
in my head thinking oh they don't want

1470
00:49:44,800 --> 00:49:48,960
to play they don't want to play

1471
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:51,440
so that way i've told them this is my

1472
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:52,640
structure can you take care of me and

1473
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:54,319
they did

1474
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:56,640
but it goes the other way around there's

1475
00:49:54,319 --> 00:49:58,240
an another side of the coin

1476
00:49:56,640 --> 00:49:59,839
i had a player who had a very

1477
00:49:58,240 --> 00:50:01,760
interesting but

1478
00:49:59,839 --> 00:50:03,760
very complex character especially in

1479
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,440
combat and

1480
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:08,160
for him taking a turn

1481
00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:09,680
was taking forever

1482
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:12,720
he was thinking about maybe i should do

1483
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:13,680
this maybe i should dead and i asked to

1484
00:50:12,720 --> 00:50:14,640
him like

1485
00:50:13,680 --> 00:50:16,319
why

1486
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:18,400
is it taking you so long and he told me

1487
00:50:16,319 --> 00:50:19,839
like i have to go to all these pages and

1488
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:21,760
i have like these bonus actions but then

1489
00:50:19,839 --> 00:50:23,839
i also have the actions and then i have

1490
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:26,160
spells and i don't know which one to use

1491
00:50:23,839 --> 00:50:28,640
when and if i use this one can i use

1492
00:50:26,160 --> 00:50:30,800
that one or not and what we created

1493
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:31,599
together is we made some kind of mind

1494
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,599
map

1495
00:50:31,599 --> 00:50:34,720
of all the actions he could he can take

1496
00:50:33,599 --> 00:50:37,119
in combat

1497
00:50:34,720 --> 00:50:39,520
we've put them under action bonus action

1498
00:50:37,119 --> 00:50:41,599
spells so he just have to look okay for

1499
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:43,440
action i can do these things for bonus

1500
00:50:41,599 --> 00:50:45,599
action i can do these things for

1501
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:47,520
reaction i can do these things and so he

1502
00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:48,400
just has to decide and we color-coded

1503
00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:50,240
him

1504
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:52,559
which what is what is defense what is

1505
00:50:50,240 --> 00:50:54,400
orphans what is buffing so he can kind

1506
00:50:52,559 --> 00:50:56,400
of have an idea like okay i need an

1507
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:58,480
action i want to attack i want to deal

1508
00:50:56,400 --> 00:51:00,480
damage okay these are my two options i'm

1509
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:02,319
going to do this yeah

1510
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:04,000
but we've done it together

1511
00:51:02,319 --> 00:51:07,359
and that is the only thing that will

1512
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:10,400
bring you as a playing group strong

1513
00:51:07,359 --> 00:51:12,400
and will keep you strong if you do stuff

1514
00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:15,040
together you're going to stay together

1515
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:16,880
and it's doing the stuff where you play

1516
00:51:15,040 --> 00:51:18,880
the story where you play d d but it's

1517
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:20,880
also doing the stuff where you help each

1518
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:21,760
other with problems and it's also doing

1519
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:24,079
the stuff

1520
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:25,440
that are not dnd related my players are

1521
00:51:24,079 --> 00:51:27,440
my friends

1522
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:29,359
even if i didn't know them before and

1523
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:31,040
now they are my friends because we also

1524
00:51:29,359 --> 00:51:32,480
play other games together

1525
00:51:31,040 --> 00:51:33,920
because we do land parties together

1526
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:35,680
because we game together because we do

1527
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:36,960
drinking games together we do a lot of

1528
00:51:35,680 --> 00:51:38,240
things together

1529
00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:40,480
yep with uh

1530
00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:42,240
three of my players well we did when we

1531
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:43,680
could do it they had board game night

1532
00:51:42,240 --> 00:51:45,359
every other week

1533
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:47,760
the week that d d was off

1534
00:51:45,359 --> 00:51:50,400
now ultimately that ball game is

1535
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:51,839
a dungeon crawler so yeah i'll leave it

1536
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:53,520
to the the audience to decide how

1537
00:51:51,839 --> 00:51:56,400
different that is and experience but

1538
00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:58,480
it's uh it was it was different enough

1539
00:51:56,400 --> 00:52:00,640
for my perspective but yeah i get it it

1540
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:02,559
is meeting halfway i'm not you know this

1541
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:05,200
isn't me putting down an iron fist or at

1542
00:52:02,559 --> 00:52:08,319
least so that's not what i intended it

1543
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:09,680
to be it was probably just a a less

1544
00:52:08,319 --> 00:52:11,920
elegant way of

1545
00:52:09,680 --> 00:52:13,280
saying here's my structure and here's

1546
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:16,400
what i need

1547
00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:20,800
to be happy now i can ask them you know

1548
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:22,559
what do you need to do that i fear that

1549
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:24,720
their answer will be nothing because i

1550
00:52:22,559 --> 00:52:27,680
don't want to do it so

1551
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:29,040
i'm maybe presuming too much but

1552
00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:30,640
at least for one or two of them that's

1553
00:52:29,040 --> 00:52:33,200
what i imagine it'll it might end up

1554
00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:34,720
being which if of course then

1555
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:36,800
the outcome is

1556
00:52:34,720 --> 00:52:39,599
predetermined to a certain extent which

1557
00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:41,440
is what i've tried to foreshadow in real

1558
00:52:39,599 --> 00:52:43,359
life weirdly i'm better at foreshadowing

1559
00:52:41,440 --> 00:52:46,720
in real life than i am in the game

1560
00:52:43,359 --> 00:52:48,720
uh of what might happen yeah that's

1561
00:52:46,720 --> 00:52:49,760
because of the responsibility you have

1562
00:52:48,720 --> 00:52:52,000
when you

1563
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:53,839
work in a way that you try to make the

1564
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:56,559
game empowering for everyone in it then

1565
00:52:53,839 --> 00:52:58,720
you people get a responsibility for that

1566
00:52:56,559 --> 00:53:01,200
game and that's what i mean

1567
00:52:58,720 --> 00:53:02,960
when we're together with our players we

1568
00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:04,960
are both responsible for the fun we have

1569
00:53:02,960 --> 00:53:06,880
on at the table yeah we are both

1570
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:08,480
responsible for the structure and we are

1571
00:53:06,880 --> 00:53:10,480
both responsible to take care of each

1572
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:12,720
other you're telling your players i need

1573
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:14,559
you to take care of me and

1574
00:53:12,720 --> 00:53:16,319
if they don't

1575
00:53:14,559 --> 00:53:19,280
then that's their responsibility and

1576
00:53:16,319 --> 00:53:20,640
that act is going to have consequences

1577
00:53:19,280 --> 00:53:22,480
and that's okay

1578
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:24,240
yeah for sure it's one of those you know

1579
00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:25,839
you said earlier on to be cruel to be

1580
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:29,040
kind kind of thing

1581
00:53:25,839 --> 00:53:31,200
wow i mean from starting with such a

1582
00:53:29,040 --> 00:53:33,040
benign word like structure i really

1583
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:34,720
didn't think i'd be

1584
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:35,599
having this heart to heart at the end of

1585
00:53:34,720 --> 00:53:37,359
it but

1586
00:53:35,599 --> 00:53:39,200
i'm very glad that is where the

1587
00:53:37,359 --> 00:53:41,440
discussion has taken us

1588
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:44,000
do you have anything in particular you

1589
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:45,119
wanted to cover around the topic of

1590
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:46,000
structure that we haven't covered

1591
00:53:45,119 --> 00:53:47,760
already

1592
00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:50,480
we haven't really talked about the

1593
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:52,960
structure of the rules of the dnd 5v

1594
00:53:50,480 --> 00:53:54,880
system but to me that's not as important

1595
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:56,720
because it's the same as everything i've

1596
00:53:54,880 --> 00:53:59,040
said before you create a structure you

1597
00:53:56,720 --> 00:54:00,720
need and then you go from there on so

1598
00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:02,559
your rules are there to set the

1599
00:54:00,720 --> 00:54:05,280
structure but you can use them in the

1600
00:54:02,559 --> 00:54:08,559
way you want and that feels naturally to

1601
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:10,559
you some people need set dc's beforehand

1602
00:54:08,559 --> 00:54:12,640
i personally don't i don't like to play

1603
00:54:10,559 --> 00:54:14,960
with set dc's beforehand because if i'm

1604
00:54:12,640 --> 00:54:17,920
running a written game and i see okay

1605
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:20,079
it's a dc25 or it's a dc12 or whatever i

1606
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:21,599
know i'm going to change it in my head

1607
00:54:20,079 --> 00:54:22,960
yeah depending on the situation with

1608
00:54:21,599 --> 00:54:25,440
players so

1609
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:27,040
but some people need that um yeah and

1610
00:54:25,440 --> 00:54:28,960
that's just the nature of the dming

1611
00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:30,800
styles we were talking about earlier on

1612
00:54:28,960 --> 00:54:32,319
about short form pre-generated

1613
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:34,240
adventures versus

1614
00:54:32,319 --> 00:54:36,240
homebrew sandbox it's probably the the

1615
00:54:34,240 --> 00:54:37,760
two kind of extremes

1616
00:54:36,240 --> 00:54:40,480
i think that

1617
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:42,640
their rules as a structure do about as

1618
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:44,160
good as a job as it can of hitting that

1619
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:47,200
middle ground of

1620
00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:49,359
enabling collaborative storytelling but

1621
00:54:47,200 --> 00:54:51,440
also facilitating

1622
00:54:49,359 --> 00:54:53,760
rpg leveling

1623
00:54:51,440 --> 00:54:56,000
and you know xp and

1624
00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:57,839
dice rolling i think yeah it's you know

1625
00:54:56,000 --> 00:55:00,400
there are some shortcomings but to have

1626
00:54:57,839 --> 00:55:03,119
a game of that vastness and that breadth

1627
00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:05,520
there are of course going to be

1628
00:55:03,119 --> 00:55:08,400
shortcomings i can i can maybe end with

1629
00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:10,559
a little tip for new dm's or dm's who

1630
00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:12,720
are figuring out how much structure do i

1631
00:55:10,559 --> 00:55:15,040
need to run my game i would say run a

1632
00:55:12,720 --> 00:55:17,760
couple of one shots where you go into

1633
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:20,400
everything written out in detail from

1634
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:22,640
nothing written and you just roll

1635
00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:24,319
with random tables and then you'll

1636
00:55:22,640 --> 00:55:26,559
easily figure out how much structure you

1637
00:55:24,319 --> 00:55:28,400
need and what the benefits are of a

1638
00:55:26,559 --> 00:55:30,559
larger structure those benefits are of a

1639
00:55:28,400 --> 00:55:33,119
smaller structure and how this can

1640
00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:35,040
benefit or influence your players

1641
00:55:33,119 --> 00:55:36,960
and by doing that you'll also get an

1642
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:39,520
idea of how quickly

1643
00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:41,359
players progress through the structure

1644
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:42,960
which is something i found can rubber

1645
00:55:41,359 --> 00:55:44,559
band you know players can take a lot

1646
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:46,079
longer to get through stuff and even now

1647
00:55:44,559 --> 00:55:47,680
i'm still like okay i'm actually

1648
00:55:46,079 --> 00:55:50,079
prepared now for the next six months

1649
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:51,760
because of the velocity of

1650
00:55:50,079 --> 00:55:53,040
players through a structure so yeah

1651
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:54,240
that's that's a really good tip really

1652
00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:57,359
good advice

1653
00:55:54,240 --> 00:55:59,119
just getting that experience of dming

1654
00:55:57,359 --> 00:56:01,280
and and where you

1655
00:55:59,119 --> 00:56:03,520
find your own comfort zone of

1656
00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:05,520
okay yeah i can black that on the fly

1657
00:56:03,520 --> 00:56:07,760
and it makes sense and my players won't

1658
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:09,760
notice versus okay no this needs to be

1659
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:12,079
here because somebody better than me

1660
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:14,559
told me it should be a dc 15 and that

1661
00:56:12,079 --> 00:56:17,599
makes sense yeah just don't be afraid to

1662
00:56:14,559 --> 00:56:19,920
experiment with it oh for sure for sure

1663
00:56:17,599 --> 00:56:23,680
i personally take a lot of

1664
00:56:19,920 --> 00:56:25,280
uh artistic license when it comes to

1665
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:26,559
making decisions on the fly and i'm

1666
00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:28,799
exactly the same school of thought of

1667
00:56:26,559 --> 00:56:30,880
yours of making that dc up on the fly if

1668
00:56:28,799 --> 00:56:34,480
only for the fact of

1669
00:56:30,880 --> 00:56:37,520
when somebody sets a dc that's set in

1670
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:40,640
stone you know it's frozen in time

1671
00:56:37,520 --> 00:56:42,400
under those specific circumstances but

1672
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:44,799
maybe when you come to run it

1673
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:47,359
the players are

1674
00:56:44,799 --> 00:56:48,960
town heroes for some reason so maybe the

1675
00:56:47,359 --> 00:56:51,040
dc should actually be lower because the

1676
00:56:48,960 --> 00:56:53,280
town loved these guys whereas if you're

1677
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:54,960
running it blow for blow that dc might

1678
00:56:53,280 --> 00:56:56,480
be unusually high if all the players are

1679
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,839
trying to do is you know get a discount

1680
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:59,520
on on something you might want to get

1681
00:56:57,839 --> 00:57:01,839
rid of the dc completely in that

1682
00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:03,920
instance but it's it's because it's the

1683
00:57:01,839 --> 00:57:05,040
nature of the game that it can change

1684
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:07,440
going through

1685
00:57:05,040 --> 00:57:09,440
is what keeps me coming back

1686
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:13,119
yeah i think it's important to keep some

1687
00:57:09,440 --> 00:57:15,280
parts of the game fluid yes for sure and

1688
00:57:13,119 --> 00:57:17,680
how fluent you want your game to be

1689
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:20,640
depends on the m2dm

1690
00:57:17,680 --> 00:57:24,640
exactly cool all right that brings us

1691
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:26,079
pretty much to the end and that was been

1692
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:28,240
yeah quite an

1693
00:57:26,079 --> 00:57:30,240
introspection of

1694
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:31,920
me as a dm which is

1695
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:33,839
which is nice to have you know to have

1696
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:35,680
that sounding board at to that level to

1697
00:57:33,839 --> 00:57:38,720
you know see where and i'm always

1698
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:40,960
looking where to improve so i

1699
00:57:38,720 --> 00:57:43,200
personally thank you very much but i'm

1700
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:44,160
hoping that through the discussion we've

1701
00:57:43,200 --> 00:57:46,000
had

1702
00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:47,359
there's no hope about it i know through

1703
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:49,359
the discussion we've had there's been so

1704
00:57:47,359 --> 00:57:52,240
many little nuggets of

1705
00:57:49,359 --> 00:57:55,760
advice and tips and you know just food

1706
00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:57,280
for thought for both players and dms and

1707
00:57:55,760 --> 00:57:59,440
the fact that that's come from a

1708
00:57:57,280 --> 00:58:00,960
springboard of the word structure

1709
00:57:59,440 --> 00:58:03,359
is just fantastic and i couldn't be

1710
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:05,599
happier so thank you ever so much for

1711
00:58:03,359 --> 00:58:08,000
coming on thank you for having me it was

1712
00:58:05,599 --> 00:58:10,640
a it was a pleasure thank you uh is

1713
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:13,440
there anything you would like to plug

1714
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:15,520
oh okay um yeah so right now we have uh

1715
00:58:13,440 --> 00:58:17,680
an adventure on the dm's guild um it's

1716
00:58:15,520 --> 00:58:19,119
called the nine of him doll it's the

1717
00:58:17,680 --> 00:58:21,359
kind of adventure i talked about in the

1718
00:58:19,119 --> 00:58:24,079
beginning kind of the spider web sandbox

1719
00:58:21,359 --> 00:58:26,000
structure it's an 8 to 12 hour story but

1720
00:58:24,079 --> 00:58:29,119
you can change it in a way you won as a

1721
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:30,799
dm there's also in the beginning of the

1722
00:58:29,119 --> 00:58:33,760
of the adventure there's a part about

1723
00:58:30,799 --> 00:58:35,440
empowering the game master in which i

1724
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:37,200
tell you how you can change up the

1725
00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:41,119
different acts of the story

1726
00:58:37,200 --> 00:58:43,599
to put out a heavier spot on the

1727
00:58:41,119 --> 00:58:46,000
pillar of adventure you like so combat

1728
00:58:43,599 --> 00:58:48,640
role play or investigation yeah go have

1729
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:49,760
a look um it's on dm's guild right now

1730
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:51,280
i'm gonna have to check that out and

1731
00:58:49,760 --> 00:58:52,799
possibly steal that thing at the front

1732
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:54,640
because one thing i've been struggling

1733
00:58:52,799 --> 00:58:58,000
with when writing mine is to try and

1734
00:58:54,640 --> 00:58:59,680
explain that stance of dm just do what

1735
00:58:58,000 --> 00:59:02,400
you feel is right

1736
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:03,440
throughout so that sounds like very good

1737
00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:06,079
advice

1738
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:07,680
to everybody at home thank you all for

1739
00:59:06,079 --> 00:59:10,720
listening if you've got any thoughts or

1740
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:12,960
comments on today's topic feel free to

1741
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:17,180
drop me a tweet at download underscore

1742
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:22,340
dnd otherwise thank you and good night

1743
00:59:17,180 --> 00:59:22,340
[Music]