Dec. 11, 2020

Emotion


Another international episode! I found my "Dungeon Master Friend" in Manny, a.k.a Growed Up Geek, who's enthusiasm is infectious. We cover the gamut from DM loneliness and anxiety, all the way up to eliciting those emotional responses from your players. A topic we've talked about plenty before, is the the positive feedback loop in D&D where the more you put in, the more you get out, and Manny puts it really well in this one. I can't effectively communicate it kind of nuance of human experience that we cover in this session. If you're feeling lonely or frustrated with your game, take a listen and find comfort in the fact you're not alone.

  • 03:23 - D&D - an intrinsically human experience
  • 07:40 - Player emotions
  • 15:28 - TTRPGs versus VGRPGs
  • 24:44 - Emotion in combat
  • 30:40 - Why people play; scratching that itch
  • 37:55 - No DM is an island - emotional responsibility
  • 45:46 - Published adventures - emotional investment
  • 53:39 - Subverting expectations to surprise and enthral
  • 58:47 - Differences in player desires

Find Manny (@Growedupgeek) on:

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Intro Music: 'Local Forecast' by Kevin MacLeod
Intermission Music: 'Chill' by Kevin MacLeod
Outro Music: 'Local Forecast - Elevator' by Kevin MacLeod

Transcript

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[Music]

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hello and welcome to another episode of

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thinking critically a d d discussion my

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name is danilo a d d investigator and i

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like all kinds of games and the crunchy

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mechanics that make them tick i am also

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now available on facebook and instagram

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so just have a search for thinking

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critically dnd and drop a little follow

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and like

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the topic of today is emotion

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and i'm joined by manny aka the growed

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up geek thank you

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ever so much for coming on can you tell

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us a bit about yourself

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yeah hi i'm manny

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i'm 42 year old predominant dungeon

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master from uh united states and i've

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been playing d d most of my life dungeon

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mastering mostly and i just feel like

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it's the part that i gravitate towards

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the most and

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have the most

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fun with as well as i think a space for

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real discussion players are kind of a

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very personal thing and dungeon master i

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think is like a much bigger broader

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concept that uh should be discussed it's

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a it's a cool thing and it's a it's a

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big responsibility and i think you owe

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it to your players and to yourself to to

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do it right and have conversations like

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this

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yeah for sure i've said in previous

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podcasts that like there's a

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responsibility on both players and dms

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but for sure it's it's a different

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responsibility that there is one but

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it's it's a different one

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yeah it's a it's a relationship that two

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people have or engage in that you

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everybody has their end they're not the

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same but everybody has a responsibility

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so that it's mutually beneficial can i

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put it better myself and that's a really

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good start for the topic of today which

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is emotion

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so what do you think of when you hear

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the word emotion within the dnd context

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within dnd i feel like it's this

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idea

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that everybody has maybe in the back of

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their minds but i think it's a

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it's a much bigger thing in all facets

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of the game than people really think

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about or maybe even acknowledge that

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the motivation for anything is

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based on a feeling on you know feeling

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unsafe get out of the way all these

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things and i feel like everybody wants

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to do the cool thing

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fight the dragon defeat the lich but i

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feel like the best

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dungeons and dragons comes from a much

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more emotional

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place and that's what separates just

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playing dungeons and dragons and oh i

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slayed the dragon yeah it was fun and

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you know oh man it was it was amazing

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and then you tell people about it

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it's the emotion is what is what your

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catch is to

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really be invested and even

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express it outwardly that you felt this

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thing and you want to tell people about

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it

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well we are really starting with some

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really juicy stuff this is great and

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you've touched on so many really good

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points there so for starters you've

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basically said it's it's a human

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experience right it's it's a bunch of

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humans playing together and it's almost

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a microcosm of life

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in a way that you can't really get

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elsewhere so you mentioned there about

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you know people want to do the cool

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thing like kill the dragon slay the lich

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which is great but

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you know you can do that in many many

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many video games where you're playing

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with or against them a machine

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so you're kind of lacking the the human

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element there on the other side of the

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table what dnd gives you is that the

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whole experience

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is

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inherently emotionally driven

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yeah i mean

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like i think

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maybe it's a little easier to understand

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on the players and the player characters

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and

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you are personifying this person paladin

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cleric whatever and you

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personally have come up with this

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character you are not you know an actor

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on a tv show who is personifying a

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character that somebody in the writer's

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room came up yes you're invested it's

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your job and you want to be you know if

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you're kid harrington you want to be the

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best jon snow that you can but to a

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certain extent jon snow is not kit

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harrington's character it's george rr

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martin's filtered through the tv writers

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down to kit harrington

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where with dungeons and dragons your

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character is your own you are the writer

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executive producer and the actor

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you know in the

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grand sense that brings that character

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to life and the more invested you are in

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that character

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you get down to not just oh my cleric

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can do this that's really cool you get

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into the the nuts and bolts of who that

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character is

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and your decisions as that character are

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made ideally in my world as the dungeon

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master made from an emotional place you

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inhabit this character so much that its

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emotions

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motivate its slash your actions

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and yeah you know from a player that's

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that's a little easier to understand i

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think from my perspective as the dungeon

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master

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my goal is to

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put you in situations

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that will elicit an emotion and you know

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you watch critical role or any of the

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bigger stream games that they have clips

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on youtube of crazy things that happen

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and their reactions and

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even without context if you see those

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you watch and you watch this group of

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people have this crazy spontaneous

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natural reaction

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that you go all right these people are

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definitely invested in it emotionally

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for that reaction

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and then from my perspective on the

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other side of the screen is the dungeon

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master you know in my own kind of

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maniacal puppet master way

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my belief is i

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set these wheels in motion for you to

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have this reaction and this emotional

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outburst if you will and that's what i

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live for you have lived that your

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character has achieved something or

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overcome something and that's your

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emotional thing

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mine is watching the players

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do it

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and at the end of the day i think that

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kind of

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reaction and that moment is what i and

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ideally i'd like to believe most dungeon

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masters live for not just oh i set this

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thing up they chased down all the clues

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they slayed the dragon yay but all the

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obstacles they overcame how invested the

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players are

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and the more everybody is invested

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emotionally into whatever you're doing i

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just have a hard time believing that

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that's not the best way to achieve the

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best end result of whatever it is that

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you're looking for yeah i completely

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agree and

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you know you always

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i always feel like you have to be so

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careful nowadays to say you know

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everybody's games their own and and so

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on and so on but i am i completely agree

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with you and i'm a strong proponent of

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you know get invested because the more

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you put in

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the more

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you'll get out and those emotional

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payoffs those gut punches those tear

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jerkers are gonna be what sets it apart

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from

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playing diablo 3 on the couch for

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example like video games are an

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interesting example let's take something

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a little more rpg-ish like dragon age

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any of the dragon age games is there an

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inherent freedom similar to that of

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dungeons and dragons yes kind of

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but at the same time your character

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choices aside from aesthetically usually

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are limited you're the mage and your

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story is set by bioware

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and if the story that bioware is telling

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hooks you

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then

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you know a good for you i'm happy that

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they hit their mark with you but that

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doesn't achieve it for everybody

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you know these characters i might not

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relate to granted i can play three of

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them however i want but even within the

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scope of what they've offered me i'm not

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really emotionally invested i'm a

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passenger on this

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thing you know i just get to watch it

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unfold where i help

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but in dungeons and dragons because it

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is so personal

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that i feel like your investment into

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your character and its well-being and

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its achievements and everything

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should be almost a default starting

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point for

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for players

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people who are really into it i mean not

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everybody has to be super invested and

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it's fine if you just want to come out

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and roll some dice and

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talk with your friends that's great too

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you know i have a couple of those guys

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in my group and i'm glad to have them

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they're my friends we have a good time

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yeah he needed a balance

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yeah and i have a couple of players in

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my group who are super invested and when

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we started our campaign because there

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was so many first timers i told them i

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was like look here's the deal you know

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gave him the big overview you know the

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selling points and then said

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now that we've established what this

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game is going to be and you have an idea

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of your character you have the option do

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you want a super in-depth

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character arc in this campaign that i

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will work in

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uh yes cool i'm gonna need ammo for that

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so give me a backstory and two of the

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guys did two of them didn't they were

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perfectly content much more of a live in

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the moment kind of a thing

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and you know at the time it was cool and

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looking back on it part of me wondered

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you know oh man are these are these guys

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going to be invested they don't want an

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overarching story they just want to live

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in the moment whatever that means and i

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know my entire group uh we've been

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friends for years uh two of them i've

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known for uh ten or more years wow

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um and so from knowing them personally

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outside of the context of dungeons and

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dragons i knew these guys i know what

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makes them tick i know where i can poke

269
00:10:37,279 --> 00:10:43,440
at him to aggravate the person and

270
00:10:41,839 --> 00:10:44,959
dungeons dragons you know the idea with

271
00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:47,920
your characters you basically either

272
00:10:44,959 --> 00:10:50,560
play you or not you

273
00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:52,959
and most of them played a heroic version

274
00:10:50,560 --> 00:10:55,920
of themselves which is totally great my

275
00:10:52,959 --> 00:10:57,680
character is a riff on myself and so

276
00:10:55,920 --> 00:11:00,240
that helped me know

277
00:10:57,680 --> 00:11:01,200
what emotional buttons i could push with

278
00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:03,680
them

279
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:06,079
what was going to motivate

280
00:11:03,680 --> 00:11:08,800
them to do something

281
00:11:06,079 --> 00:11:11,519
how i could and this is going to sound

282
00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:14,079
kind of evil but how i could knowingly

283
00:11:11,519 --> 00:11:16,399
manipulate their emotions into doing

284
00:11:14,079 --> 00:11:18,640
something that was against

285
00:11:16,399 --> 00:11:21,760
the best interests of their character

286
00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:24,320
because i know them as a person yeah

287
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:26,480
give them money they will do anything

288
00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:28,560
without thought of consequence and that

289
00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:31,360
led to a whole thing where one of my

290
00:11:28,560 --> 00:11:32,320
players basically killed the only living

291
00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,800
family

292
00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:36,160
that uh he had left because he was

293
00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:39,200
presented with an opportunity to make

294
00:11:36,160 --> 00:11:40,240
money real quick with no work

295
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:43,360
and then

296
00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:45,760
with that comes once it plays out

297
00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:48,959
that his sisters had died from a

298
00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:52,000
poisoning in a horrible fashion

299
00:11:48,959 --> 00:11:55,040
there was a genuine like emotional

300
00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:57,920
response from him and

301
00:11:55,040 --> 00:12:00,560
i'd set it up this wasn't an accident

302
00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:04,000
but at the same time he was so invested

303
00:12:00,560 --> 00:12:05,600
in that component of his backstory

304
00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:07,760
knowing that he was the one who

305
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:10,399
sabotaged it

306
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:12,320
was emotionally devastating maybe even

307
00:12:10,399 --> 00:12:14,000
unfairly so

308
00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:17,040
you know the consequences of him being

309
00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:19,200
impulsive were probably a little harsh

310
00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:20,639
and i got this genuine reaction like we

311
00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:23,040
had to take us you know we had to take a

312
00:12:20,639 --> 00:12:24,880
break from the table he had to go gather

313
00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:26,480
himself and

314
00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,880
part of me goes that was some great

315
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:31,920
dungeon mastering you know i enlisted an

316
00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:34,160
emotion like a very visceral strong one

317
00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:36,480
that's what you want but then the

318
00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:39,279
consequences thereof

319
00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:41,200
is that i manipulated a friend of mine

320
00:12:39,279 --> 00:12:42,959
into doing something that was going to

321
00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:45,120
hurt him

322
00:12:42,959 --> 00:12:47,040
his character and possibly even his

323
00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:49,440
enjoyment for the game

324
00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:52,800
because i wanted this

325
00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:55,680
illicit emotional response and

326
00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:57,279
it's a thing that even now we don't we

327
00:12:55,680 --> 00:12:59,440
don't even really kind of joke about it

328
00:12:57,279 --> 00:13:01,519
wow it's still a sore subject

329
00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:03,360
and you know i have to live with my end

330
00:13:01,519 --> 00:13:06,480
of it that i like i said i feel bad i

331
00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:09,040
set a friend of mine up to do this

332
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:11,519
but on the other side that helps me

333
00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:13,600
sleep at night is

334
00:13:11,519 --> 00:13:16,560
he was so invested in this character and

335
00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:19,120
the character's needs at that moment

336
00:13:16,560 --> 00:13:20,959
that he did something against his

337
00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:23,519
characters probably better judgment and

338
00:13:20,959 --> 00:13:25,519
the players better judgment because he

339
00:13:23,519 --> 00:13:27,360
wanted to see his character's emotional

340
00:13:25,519 --> 00:13:28,720
needs met

341
00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,160
and

342
00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:32,560
you know like i said the consequences

343
00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:33,519
were awful and i do still feel bad about

344
00:13:32,560 --> 00:13:36,639
it

345
00:13:33,519 --> 00:13:40,079
but i like i said executed better i feel

346
00:13:36,639 --> 00:13:42,399
like that kind of scenario is what every

347
00:13:40,079 --> 00:13:45,839
dungeon master and player should want

348
00:13:42,399 --> 00:13:48,560
from their dynamic yeah it's difficult

349
00:13:45,839 --> 00:13:50,160
to do really well i think and i'm not i

350
00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:51,680
don't want to sound like i'm talking

351
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:53,600
from experience or anything this is all

352
00:13:51,680 --> 00:13:55,600
kind of speculation on my part but it's

353
00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:57,839
easy to do really badly and difficult to

354
00:13:55,600 --> 00:14:00,639
do really well so it's very easy to pull

355
00:13:57,839 --> 00:14:01,600
the rug out of your players as a dm

356
00:14:00,639 --> 00:14:04,000
funnily enough i think i was reading

357
00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:05,760
yesterday was about you should never

358
00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,360
ever everything should be foreshadowed

359
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:09,279
so you shouldn't have a trap which is

360
00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,880
just like the hill you know the hills

361
00:14:09,279 --> 00:14:12,639
are alive and

362
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:14,240
the players if they fail a roll they

363
00:14:12,639 --> 00:14:15,040
he'll eat them and they die that's no

364
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:17,040
fun

365
00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:20,320
but it's a piece of cake to orchestrate

366
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:22,959
as a dm you can do that same way with

367
00:14:20,320 --> 00:14:25,120
kind of soft attacks so emotional attack

368
00:14:22,959 --> 00:14:27,839
says it's a busy cake to set up some

369
00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:29,920
contrived thing that causes the players

370
00:14:27,839 --> 00:14:31,440
to accidentally kill their kid or

371
00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:34,720
something like that or something like a

372
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:36,639
horrible grim nasty outcome but to do it

373
00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,800
in a way that is

374
00:14:36,639 --> 00:14:40,959
the payoff is genuine but you know isn't

375
00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:43,120
gonna make you lose sleep

376
00:14:40,959 --> 00:14:45,600
it's probably one of the hardest things

377
00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:48,000
to do like setting up combat encounters

378
00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,680
is can be tricky but it's mechanical

379
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,639
it's maths at the end of the day it's

380
00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:55,519
math yeah it's you can you can do it but

381
00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:57,440
what isn't maths uh humans and emotions

382
00:14:55,519 --> 00:15:00,880
at the most the opposite end of

383
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:04,959
you can get any further away so yeah i

384
00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:07,120
envy you in a way and i have set up a

385
00:15:04,959 --> 00:15:09,040
number of really long burn

386
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,639
emotional

387
00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:13,120
payoffs

388
00:15:10,639 --> 00:15:15,680
i just hope that will elicit a fraction

389
00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:18,320
of the response that your player got

390
00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:20,000
from the the things that i've set up

391
00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:22,880
you mentioned uh when we talk about

392
00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:24,160
video games and dragon age and things

393
00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:25,279
like that and

394
00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:26,800
he was saying about it can be

395
00:15:25,279 --> 00:15:29,279
potentially hard to get invested in

396
00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:30,880
those characters because

397
00:15:29,279 --> 00:15:33,360
i'm thinking of more rpgs where you're

398
00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:35,519
playing a

399
00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:38,000
more of a character that's like um deus

400
00:15:35,519 --> 00:15:40,560
ex for example you're playing i forget

401
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:42,399
the name of the main character but um

402
00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:44,399
yeah cool haircut sunglasses yeah that's

403
00:15:42,399 --> 00:15:46,560
the dude a cool dude

404
00:15:44,399 --> 00:15:48,399
he's very flavorful he's full of

405
00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:50,639
character he's clearly

406
00:15:48,399 --> 00:15:52,639
a cyberpunk aesthetic kind of thing so

407
00:15:50,639 --> 00:15:54,399
there you're already limited with how

408
00:15:52,639 --> 00:15:56,560
invested you can get just like you said

409
00:15:54,399 --> 00:15:59,440
i don't want to play a cool haircut

410
00:15:56,560 --> 00:16:01,040
sunglasses cyberpunk dude i want to play

411
00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:02,880
something else so even there there's

412
00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,480
barriers to entry but video games are

413
00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:06,560
kind of damned if they do and damned if

414
00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:09,120
they don't because the alternative to

415
00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:11,040
that is making almost a silent

416
00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,959
protagonist or

417
00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:15,600
someone who is just such a blank slate

418
00:16:12,959 --> 00:16:17,680
so fire emblem is a good example of that

419
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:21,120
awakening where you're just playing some

420
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:23,680
amnesiac who wakes up who can uh how

421
00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:25,279
very jrpg exactly yeah i think you've

422
00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,959
gone through some time portal or

423
00:16:25,279 --> 00:16:29,920
something and you're from the future

424
00:16:26,959 --> 00:16:31,360
full-on jrpg tropes but you're you're a

425
00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:32,880
blank slate and then it's like oh i

426
00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,639
don't know how i got here i don't know

427
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:37,040
this world i am in so i'm just a

428
00:16:34,639 --> 00:16:39,120
complete vanilla blank slate which is

429
00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:42,560
great in a way the player can put their

430
00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:44,880
stamp on it but you're so vanilla it's

431
00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:47,040
it's kind of just like uh to everything

432
00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:48,480
how do you feel about this well

433
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:51,279
i don't know

434
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:53,839
with the the deus ex example i think the

435
00:16:51,279 --> 00:16:56,560
hard or the kind of double-edged sword

436
00:16:53,839 --> 00:16:57,680
with the investment especially as far as

437
00:16:56,560 --> 00:17:00,000
that being

438
00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:02,160
you know such an established character

439
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,199
that doesn't get a lot of wiggle room is

440
00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:05,600
that

441
00:17:03,199 --> 00:17:07,679
through the marketing and kind of

442
00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:10,559
everything about it the people who are

443
00:17:07,679 --> 00:17:13,120
going to play it are the people who are

444
00:17:10,559 --> 00:17:16,079
that aesthetic or however it's marketed

445
00:17:13,120 --> 00:17:18,079
like appeals to you know before you play

446
00:17:16,079 --> 00:17:20,160
it that that game is what you're about

447
00:17:18,079 --> 00:17:23,039
and you're going to have a good time and

448
00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:23,760
you inherit the character by default

449
00:17:23,039 --> 00:17:26,720
with

450
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:28,640
deus ex is kind of a niche game when you

451
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:31,039
got into things like fire emblem which

452
00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:33,440
you said was you know the opposite

453
00:17:31,039 --> 00:17:35,120
that's a and i don't want this to sound

454
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,840
like in a bad way but a very lowest

455
00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:41,440
common denominator of how you appeal to

456
00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:43,760
somebody this person that you play could

457
00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:45,840
be anybody so there's your starting

458
00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:48,000
point that's why you're invested is that

459
00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:51,679
you could be anything but then as the

460
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:54,480
story progresses and the gaps get filled

461
00:17:51,679 --> 00:17:55,280
in you're back to the dragon age thing

462
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:56,880
where

463
00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:59,120
just because you've started it doesn't

464
00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:03,280
mean you're gonna finish it because

465
00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:06,000
eventually pieces fall into place and at

466
00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:07,600
10 hours 15 hours at some point

467
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,400
you might realize that this character

468
00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:13,440
does not appeal to you or you can relate

469
00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:15,679
to it and i don't know between those two

470
00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:17,600
comparisons which is better do i look at

471
00:18:15,679 --> 00:18:19,520
deus ex and go i don't really care for

472
00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:22,320
that so i'm not even gonna buy it and

473
00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:25,200
then maybe i miss out on something if i

474
00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:27,200
play fire emblem with the idea of man

475
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:29,679
this thing's gonna be anything and then

476
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:32,960
15 hours in i go

477
00:18:29,679 --> 00:18:35,440
yeah i've achieved an emotional reaction

478
00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:38,960
probably being underwhelmed if that's a

479
00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:42,480
thing or i was never given a hook

480
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:44,320
to really buy in i tentatively bought in

481
00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:47,919
and played it until i realized it was

482
00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:50,640
nothing and those things are why people

483
00:18:47,919 --> 00:18:53,039
are wishy-washy about things like oh i

484
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:54,240
heard you got fire emblem how was it

485
00:18:53,039 --> 00:18:56,960
it's okay

486
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:59,039
like it's a game it works you know your

487
00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:01,440
your xbox didn't catch fire

488
00:18:59,039 --> 00:19:03,200
but you know that's the bare minimum and

489
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:04,720
it's the same thing with dungeons and

490
00:19:03,200 --> 00:19:06,480
dragons after

491
00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:09,360
you know after i play on a stream on

492
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:12,160
monday nights and after i'm done my wife

493
00:19:09,360 --> 00:19:13,679
will ask me how was it and you know

494
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:16,080
depending on how i'm feeling how the

495
00:19:13,679 --> 00:19:18,240
session was it was either it was okay

496
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:20,960
which means everybody did their part

497
00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:24,000
nobody caught fire yeah we played

498
00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:25,919
dungeons and dragons and it was fun

499
00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,480
which is the bare minimum i don't want

500
00:19:25,919 --> 00:19:31,360
to give this game up i would like to

501
00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:34,240
play again yeah and it's just this thing

502
00:19:31,360 --> 00:19:36,799
where on the days where things are crazy

503
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:38,799
it's hey how was your session oh man

504
00:19:36,799 --> 00:19:41,120
baby blah blah blah and this that and

505
00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:44,160
the other and from a place you were

506
00:19:41,120 --> 00:19:47,520
starting from is an emotional one you

507
00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:49,679
felt this cool thing however long ago

508
00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:52,240
and it was so cool

509
00:19:49,679 --> 00:19:55,120
that i would like to share it with my

510
00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:57,280
wife you know my best friend yeah and

511
00:19:55,120 --> 00:19:58,720
you know she doesn't have context but

512
00:19:57,280 --> 00:20:00,799
like i said there's the difference and

513
00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:02,880
she knows there's a difference maybe not

514
00:20:00,799 --> 00:20:04,080
why but the difference between it was

515
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:06,400
okay and

516
00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:08,559
me just blurting words at her for 20

517
00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:10,240
minutes yeah incoherently there's an

518
00:20:08,559 --> 00:20:12,559
emotional thing in there one of them

519
00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:15,440
made me feel something i could be that

520
00:20:12,559 --> 00:20:17,120
excited about my character dying given a

521
00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:20,320
context you know it was great it was

522
00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:22,080
heroic or i get the opposite emotion my

523
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:24,480
character died

524
00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:27,360
i'm sad yeah and it could be either one

525
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:29,280
of those but i felt something and

526
00:20:27,360 --> 00:20:31,679
that is what you could see in a

527
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:33,200
reflection of when you asked me how was

528
00:20:31,679 --> 00:20:36,240
your game

529
00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:39,039
and i i like that and i feel like that

530
00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:40,559
is the k it's the key to anything movies

531
00:20:39,039 --> 00:20:42,880
music tv

532
00:20:40,559 --> 00:20:45,120
everything is you went to a concert it

533
00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:46,400
was fine they played music they weren't

534
00:20:45,120 --> 00:20:47,840
out of tune

535
00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:49,919
didn't make you feel anything it was

536
00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:52,799
just there and then you go to something

537
00:20:49,919 --> 00:20:54,320
you really enjoy and there's a uh

538
00:20:52,799 --> 00:20:56,960
emotional connection it could be any

539
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:59,360
emotion depending on the band whatever

540
00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,880
and that's what separates good from bad

541
00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:03,440
in anything

542
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,840
and in this space like i said i think

543
00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:07,679
everybody wants to do the cool thing

544
00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:10,159
it's easy nobody wants to set up a

545
00:21:07,679 --> 00:21:12,640
campaign about exploring the emotional

546
00:21:10,159 --> 00:21:15,360
growth of their dwarf cleric

547
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:16,720
that's a byproduct of you playing this

548
00:21:15,360 --> 00:21:19,440
thing but

549
00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:21,760
that emotional growth and the the play

550
00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:24,880
on emotion i think is just as important

551
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:26,720
as the meeting the npcs and going on a

552
00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:29,039
quest and saving the dragon and getting

553
00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,480
loot that's what makes it you know just

554
00:21:29,039 --> 00:21:33,760
a bunch of people who just sit around

555
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:35,600
yeah i swing my sword and all right

556
00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:38,559
people are really into it standing up at

557
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:39,919
the table yes yeah you know this these

558
00:21:38,559 --> 00:21:41,919
non-verbal

559
00:21:39,919 --> 00:21:43,919
cues aside from somebody just going man

560
00:21:41,919 --> 00:21:46,320
that was really good but you know they

561
00:21:43,919 --> 00:21:48,080
stand up or everybody's like watching

562
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:51,280
the person whose turn it is to see how

563
00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:54,000
they roll the gasp yeah it's you know i

564
00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:56,640
i gamble so i i've seen people at a

565
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,120
craps table for 30 minutes and listen to

566
00:21:56,640 --> 00:22:01,760
it and just the highs and the lows it's

567
00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:03,919
cool i'm not even a part of it and just

568
00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:05,440
watching those people have that time

569
00:22:03,919 --> 00:22:07,919
it's great to see

570
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:09,760
and i can't control it but in a dungeons

571
00:22:07,919 --> 00:22:12,960
and dragons game i can

572
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:14,640
and i you know i i want to make sure

573
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,120
that it's not just oh how was your

574
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:19,120
session with mandy it was okay you know

575
00:22:17,120 --> 00:22:21,200
yeah whatever i want everybody to go

576
00:22:19,120 --> 00:22:24,480
back to their partners who are whoever

577
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:27,200
asked them about it and say man you know

578
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:30,159
blah blah blah and it'd be so good and

579
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:32,320
their emotional attachment be such that

580
00:22:30,159 --> 00:22:33,840
they will explain something without any

581
00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:37,360
context to somebody who doesn't

582
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:38,559
understand yeah the emotion is so strong

583
00:22:37,360 --> 00:22:40,240
that they don't care whether you

584
00:22:38,559 --> 00:22:43,600
understand it they just have to express

585
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:45,840
it yeah and what's quite quaint is that

586
00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:47,039
my partner is

587
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:49,780
i feel like there should be a support

588
00:22:47,039 --> 00:22:51,280
group for dm partners who can

589
00:22:49,780 --> 00:22:53,200
[Laughter]

590
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:55,440
because i'll say i'll put her in touch

591
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:57,600
with my wife if nothing else that could

592
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,600
just be the two of them yeah because she

593
00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:02,240
is also has to listen to me

594
00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:04,559
wax lyrical about oh my god i've got

595
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:06,240
this planned and they did this and it

596
00:23:04,559 --> 00:23:08,240
was rad and they don't know that i've

597
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,919
got this other thing that's planned and

598
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:11,679
she just kind of sits there dutifully

599
00:23:09,919 --> 00:23:13,600
just mm-hmm

600
00:23:11,679 --> 00:23:16,159
i'm glad your hand's gone

601
00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:18,559
yep like i said it's you know across the

602
00:23:16,159 --> 00:23:20,960
pond my house is exactly the same thing

603
00:23:18,559 --> 00:23:22,799
you know she's very supportive and i

604
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,880
think she sees it that we're in a

605
00:23:22,799 --> 00:23:28,080
pandemic we don't get to do a lot of

606
00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:30,559
things i go to work every day and in

607
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:32,320
this time it's it's you have to find joy

608
00:23:30,559 --> 00:23:34,480
in anything whatever whatever it is that

609
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,880
you want to do you know find joy in it

610
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:38,960
and yeah it's a lot of work yeah she

611
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:41,440
goes to sleep while i'm writing until

612
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:44,159
one o'clock in the morning or doing god

613
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,960
knows what uh inside my own head yeah

614
00:23:44,159 --> 00:23:47,679
but

615
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:49,279
you know when she sees it and

616
00:23:47,679 --> 00:23:50,720
when i'm done writing or when i run

617
00:23:49,279 --> 00:23:53,039
something by her

618
00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:56,000
she could tell that like i care about it

619
00:23:53,039 --> 00:23:57,520
and to her it's you know i played

620
00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:00,000
pretend

621
00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:01,600
craps with like my friends over the

622
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,360
internet

623
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,760
and that's the context for her but the

624
00:24:03,360 --> 00:24:08,240
fact is that it makes me happy and she

625
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:10,559
sees how hard i work at it and that she

626
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:12,640
knows all my friends in my home game

627
00:24:10,559 --> 00:24:14,640
and we used to get together they would

628
00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:16,159
talk to her about it like she like she

629
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,600
was part of the group because she you

630
00:24:16,159 --> 00:24:18,559
know she's my wife

631
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:20,320
and

632
00:24:18,559 --> 00:24:22,880
i don't think she understands she has a

633
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:24,400
rough idea of how you know he works but

634
00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:26,159
to to see

635
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:28,799
like my friends talk about it and when

636
00:24:26,159 --> 00:24:30,960
we're you know at a cookout or something

637
00:24:28,799 --> 00:24:33,279
talking about it she you know it must be

638
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:35,919
important and she she enjoys that part

639
00:24:33,279 --> 00:24:38,080
of it even if she doesn't understand

640
00:24:35,919 --> 00:24:40,240
how it works and everything yeah it

641
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,400
speaks for itself in a way

642
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:44,960
and one thing you mentioned there about

643
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:47,200
rolling dice and at the table and i hit

644
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:49,200
this thing okay great i hit it move on

645
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,400
that's one thing i really

646
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,799
want to

647
00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,240
the d d can be its own beast this this

648
00:24:52,799 --> 00:24:55,919
special magical

649
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:58,480
beast that can have these

650
00:24:55,919 --> 00:25:00,720
special responses even in combat so when

651
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,799
you when you distill combat down you

652
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:04,960
could just plug the numbers in an excel

653
00:25:02,799 --> 00:25:06,880
spreadsheet press run encounter come out

654
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:08,559
the other side and have it roll all the

655
00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:10,720
dice behind the scenes and go okay sorry

656
00:25:08,559 --> 00:25:12,159
players you come out the other side and

657
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,400
you took four points of damage and you

658
00:25:12,159 --> 00:25:16,400
took three points of damage because the

659
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,840
combat can just be dice rolling against

660
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,080
each other which is

661
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,440
no one wants to see just dice roll like

662
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:22,960
that's that's boring especially when

663
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,960
it's the dm rolling against himself

664
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,960
that's super boring so

665
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:29,039
what's really good is to have those

666
00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:30,880
emotive moments of

667
00:25:29,039 --> 00:25:32,559
okay i swing my great sword at this

668
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:34,799
gelatinous cube

669
00:25:32,559 --> 00:25:37,120
and then as a dm i'm always like tell me

670
00:25:34,799 --> 00:25:38,480
how man but this is great tell me are

671
00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:40,960
you going to cut it in twain are you

672
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:44,240
going to smush it into the ground like

673
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:46,080
really try and amp the crowd in a way to

674
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:48,480
get people invested and to get people

675
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:50,400
talking about it and those epic comeback

676
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:52,960
encounters because

677
00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:55,200
i can bet you that no one remembers

678
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:57,520
at a combat encounter in dragon age with

679
00:25:55,200 --> 00:26:00,400
some mooks on the road yeah and the paws

680
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:02,960
and everything yeah yeah i feel combat

681
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:05,360
is one at least from my experience to my

682
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:09,279
home group one of the first places that

683
00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:11,440
i felt like the new players really

684
00:26:09,279 --> 00:26:13,520
began to role play

685
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:16,080
i don't know okay

686
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:18,240
it's just i i feel like ever whether

687
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:21,360
you've imagined yourself as a wizard in

688
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:24,720
water deep solving a crime

689
00:26:21,360 --> 00:26:27,120
everybody has imagined or physically

690
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:29,679
played out swinging a sword

691
00:26:27,120 --> 00:26:30,640
with a tree branch or whatever

692
00:26:29,679 --> 00:26:32,480
and

693
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:35,039
depending on

694
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:36,400
what motivated you to come to d d in the

695
00:26:35,039 --> 00:26:38,480
first place

696
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:41,440
i think a lot of first-timers maybe do

697
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:43,840
come for the combat aspect of it

698
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,720
and if that's what you came for

699
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:46,640
when

700
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,760
it actually happens

701
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:49,840
even if you don't understand your

702
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:52,400
character's motivations or whatever this

703
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:54,000
is what you came to the game for you

704
00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:56,400
want to smash things with a sword or hit

705
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:59,039
things with a fireball and

706
00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,799
the first time that

707
00:26:59,039 --> 00:27:04,159
not the first time you do combat because

708
00:27:00,799 --> 00:27:06,960
it is kind of stilted and odd but once

709
00:27:04,159 --> 00:27:09,120
you understand at least your character's

710
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:11,440
aspects of combat

711
00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:12,880
then i always felt like they got into it

712
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,640
because

713
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:17,360
they didn't want to just

714
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:20,720
swing a sword this is what they came to

715
00:27:17,360 --> 00:27:23,600
the game for so they are going to you

716
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,880
know flourishes and suddenly everybody

717
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:27,039
is conan

718
00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:29,200
from guys that had still talked about

719
00:27:27,039 --> 00:27:31,520
their characters in the third person

720
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:33,919
during social encounters um it's not i

721
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:36,000
did this it was you know and the first

722
00:27:33,919 --> 00:27:38,000
time i remember registering is like wow

723
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:40,240
your first role play was really with

724
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:41,679
combat wow because that's what they had

725
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:44,240
come to the game for that was their

726
00:27:41,679 --> 00:27:45,679
emotional draw and when it presented

727
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,399
themselves that's what they were going

728
00:27:45,679 --> 00:27:50,159
to take advantage of and it was it's

729
00:27:48,399 --> 00:27:52,320
cool because if you take a bunch of new

730
00:27:50,159 --> 00:27:54,480
timers especially mixed in with a couple

731
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:56,000
of real veterans that i have the

732
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:58,480
dichotomy between the two is pretty

733
00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:00,960
clear for sure who's new and who's

734
00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:03,120
experienced and it was the first time

735
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,960
when i remember going okay they're going

736
00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:07,039
to be okay you know this isn't going to

737
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:09,120
be just a it was fun for a little bit

738
00:28:07,039 --> 00:28:11,360
but you know we got other things

739
00:28:09,120 --> 00:28:14,240
one of them plays a cleric one of them

740
00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:17,120
plays a dragonborn sorcerer and so it

741
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,880
was very much of like sorcerer your

742
00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:22,080
magic's an eight so it was very much

743
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:23,919
kind of casual and almost flippant in

744
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:26,559
the way that he would you know light his

745
00:28:23,919 --> 00:28:29,279
hands up and the cleric wanted to be the

746
00:28:26,559 --> 00:28:31,600
big bad protector so

747
00:28:29,279 --> 00:28:34,559
you know he was hitting things extra

748
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:37,039
hard because he wanted to protect

749
00:28:34,559 --> 00:28:38,559
whatever and whether they knew it or not

750
00:28:37,039 --> 00:28:41,840
and whether they made the conscientious

751
00:28:38,559 --> 00:28:44,960
decision or not this was their chance to

752
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:46,480
do what they came to do at least at

753
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,399
first and

754
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:51,039
they got into it and

755
00:28:48,399 --> 00:28:53,440
that's when i kind of realized that

756
00:28:51,039 --> 00:28:55,760
your emotional investment at the

757
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:57,600
beginning of a campaign is not the same

758
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:59,120
after three sessions after 10 sessions

759
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,919
after 15

760
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:04,720
that you can come to it for one thing

761
00:29:01,919 --> 00:29:06,720
get it get that itch scratched

762
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:08,720
and then go wow that was fun there's a

763
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:10,720
lot more to this what are the other

764
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,880
things and then

765
00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:15,600
you just have to feel like

766
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:17,840
some emotional itch other than i really

767
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:20,080
like hanging out and drinking beers with

768
00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:22,080
my friends gets scratched and if it's

769
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:24,240
that you are

770
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:26,880
really descriptive in your combat and

771
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:29,120
maybe you landed the killing blow

772
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,559
and i as the dungeon master get to say

773
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:32,799
something like all right how do you

774
00:29:30,559 --> 00:29:34,000
finish it off which is you know my

775
00:29:32,799 --> 00:29:36,000
verbal cue

776
00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:38,240
and then some of them would just go into

777
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:41,360
this just great description where you're

778
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:43,760
just like all right man cool you can

779
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:44,799
invest in this emotionally

780
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:47,039
now

781
00:29:44,799 --> 00:29:48,559
let me see what else what else i can get

782
00:29:47,039 --> 00:29:52,840
you to bite on

783
00:29:48,559 --> 00:29:55,120
and if nothing else i would keep giving

784
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:57,279
you scenarios

785
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:59,760
where the one itch you know you can

786
00:29:57,279 --> 00:30:01,760
scratch that you know makes you happy or

787
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:03,039
whatever it does to your you know your

788
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:05,279
brain

789
00:30:03,039 --> 00:30:06,320
i will give you that within a reasonable

790
00:30:05,279 --> 00:30:08,399
amount

791
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:10,799
but if that's what it takes on my end to

792
00:30:08,399 --> 00:30:13,120
keep you emotionally invested or at

793
00:30:10,799 --> 00:30:16,000
least emotionally invested in this part

794
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:17,279
until something else can hook you that's

795
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,399
what i'll do

796
00:30:17,279 --> 00:30:19,919
i think it's just the basic

797
00:30:18,399 --> 00:30:23,360
responsibility of a dungeon master keep

798
00:30:19,919 --> 00:30:25,120
your players invested in whatever it is

799
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,640
that they're invested in like it might

800
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:28,240
not be the thing that's important to you

801
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:29,279
but if they're invested in something you

802
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:32,000
got to give it to them you got to

803
00:30:29,279 --> 00:30:34,480
nurture them nurture it so that they'll

804
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:37,919
keep playing and potentially grow or

805
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:39,520
have these other things happen to them

806
00:30:37,919 --> 00:30:41,360
yeah something i probably need to spend

807
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,039
a little bit more time thinking about

808
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:43,919
myself i

809
00:30:43,039 --> 00:30:47,039
have

810
00:30:43,919 --> 00:30:48,960
an ebb and flow to the campaign so

811
00:30:47,039 --> 00:30:50,880
there'll be periods of traditional

812
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,960
dungeon delving where there'll be

813
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,880
lots more combat for example that kind

814
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:56,960
of scratches that itch but then

815
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:58,320
there's a bit of a the tide's gonna wash

816
00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:00,159
out a little bit and it's gonna calm

817
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,679
down and you're gonna go back to town

818
00:31:00,159 --> 00:31:03,440
and kind of collect your thoughts and

819
00:31:01,679 --> 00:31:06,320
have that opportunity to go and pray to

820
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:08,159
gods or to visit the local homeless

821
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:10,320
shelter and donate some of your earnings

822
00:31:08,159 --> 00:31:13,120
and that kind of stuff and i probably

823
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:15,440
need to pay a little bit more attention

824
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:18,159
to the moment-to-moment plays of that to

825
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:20,880
work out precisely which one of the six

826
00:31:18,159 --> 00:31:23,519
players is resonating with each one of

827
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:25,760
those bits now combat it's easier to

828
00:31:23,519 --> 00:31:27,600
spot because it's quite clear to see

829
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,600
when people get amped up with ah we're

830
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,279
rolling initiative okay

831
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,960
immediately i've perked up and i'm

832
00:31:31,279 --> 00:31:34,720
psyched it's like okay well there's your

833
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:36,880
trigger got that

834
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:39,200
let me build up

835
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:41,919
more of a preamble towards the next

836
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:43,840
combat for example but for the more

837
00:31:41,919 --> 00:31:44,720
subtle things i think it's a bit harder

838
00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:46,480
to

839
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:48,320
maybe just for myself to

840
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:51,279
extract that out of the players and be

841
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:53,120
like what what makes you tick why do you

842
00:31:51,279 --> 00:31:54,960
keep coming back

843
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,000
there must be some reason right and

844
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:58,559
perhaps i'm at the point where i just

845
00:31:56,000 --> 00:32:00,640
need to flower ask them

846
00:31:58,559 --> 00:32:02,000
why are you here in the in the nicest

847
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,080
possible way

848
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:05,600
yeah like i said i are they friends of

849
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,200
yours are you familiar with them or is

850
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:09,039
this kind of a let's get together and

851
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:11,519
let's do this thing as the common

852
00:32:09,039 --> 00:32:14,399
element um so they are all in my in my

853
00:32:11,519 --> 00:32:17,360
primary game colleagues from my place of

854
00:32:14,399 --> 00:32:19,120
work so we've been working together in

855
00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:21,919
you know varying levels of

856
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:23,519
day-to-day office work for approximately

857
00:32:21,919 --> 00:32:25,440
about two years

858
00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:26,799
some of which i was closer

859
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,960
with than others one of which is

860
00:32:26,799 --> 00:32:31,200
actually my my line manager at work so

861
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,679
it's a it's quite an interesting

862
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,559
dynamic reversal when we start playing

863
00:32:33,679 --> 00:32:36,080
the game

864
00:32:34,559 --> 00:32:37,440
i'd be lying if i said there wasn't a

865
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:39,600
small amount of guilty pleasure to be

866
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:42,159
had there but that's what's life without

867
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:44,799
some guilty pleasures i totally yeah i'm

868
00:32:42,159 --> 00:32:47,360
with you tormenting your boss yes yeah

869
00:32:44,799 --> 00:32:49,360
yeah and um yeah so about two years give

870
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:51,120
or take so yeah we've got there's it's

871
00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:53,919
definitely not going in ice cold to say

872
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:55,600
the least and you know like i said i you

873
00:32:53,919 --> 00:32:58,080
know my home group i'm gonna find out

874
00:32:55,600 --> 00:33:00,799
what it's like to dungeon master for

875
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,720
relative strangers uh here pretty soon

876
00:33:00,799 --> 00:33:05,200
but like i said i've i've known all of

877
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:07,679
them for quite a long time two of them

878
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,360
actually were in my original campaign so

879
00:33:07,679 --> 00:33:11,760
those guys were easy i knew what made

880
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:13,519
them tick whatever they gave me as far

881
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:15,360
as their characters i knew they were

882
00:33:13,519 --> 00:33:17,039
going to be invested in i just had to do

883
00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:18,640
it so they were good

884
00:33:17,039 --> 00:33:20,880
the other guys

885
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:22,960
like i said i used my knowledge of them

886
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:25,840
in a familiar sense of like hey you're

887
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:27,840
my friend greg to kind of weasel my way

888
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:29,120
into their heads and i i feel like this

889
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,480
is going to be like a psychological

890
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:32,480
profile for

891
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:34,559
like somebody at some point about like

892
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:37,519
emotional manipulation

893
00:33:34,559 --> 00:33:39,760
but i knew greg the person and so i

894
00:33:37,519 --> 00:33:41,760
realized his character was going to be

895
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:43,519
craig the sorcerer

896
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,840
it's a little easier and i know the

897
00:33:43,519 --> 00:33:47,120
things that i could do to antagonize

898
00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:49,200
greg or

899
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:51,600
what he the person

900
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:54,240
enjoys in life and

901
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:56,320
i didn't know for sure that greg the

902
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:58,240
sorcerer would buy into the same thing

903
00:33:56,320 --> 00:34:00,240
that greg the chef does

904
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:02,799
but you give it a shot and when you when

905
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:05,200
they react the same way that the person

906
00:34:02,799 --> 00:34:06,880
would you go okay these are the little

907
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:09,919
things and then

908
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:12,000
i use those things and i feel like

909
00:34:09,919 --> 00:34:14,079
that's an advantage of groups that are

910
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,200
familiar with each other have sure but

911
00:34:14,079 --> 00:34:19,200
it's a little harder in the you know hey

912
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:22,800
i'm starting this game everybody come

913
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:25,919
and play which i think in that situation

914
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:27,599
i think just asking them it's a i don't

915
00:34:25,919 --> 00:34:29,119
want to say like a business transaction

916
00:34:27,599 --> 00:34:31,760
but it is kind of a

917
00:34:29,119 --> 00:34:33,760
formal arrangement especially when you

918
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:34,800
get into people you don't know as your

919
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:38,399
friends

920
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:40,960
that i think setting expectations from

921
00:34:38,399 --> 00:34:43,119
you know me and then for the players to

922
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:45,359
give them their best experience what are

923
00:34:43,119 --> 00:34:47,599
you here for and if you're here you like

924
00:34:45,359 --> 00:34:51,359
smashing stuff with a sword cool cheers

925
00:34:47,599 --> 00:34:52,560
i got you if you want some big emotional

926
00:34:51,359 --> 00:34:55,919
story arc

927
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:58,560
also great i love that you tell me give

928
00:34:55,919 --> 00:34:59,440
me as much or as little as you want and

929
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:03,040
i

930
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:05,200
will work just as hard to fit your

931
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:08,160
personal little thing into this big

932
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:11,200
campaign as i did with the campaign as a

933
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:14,000
whole because the two are intertwined

934
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:16,160
and yes killing the giants at the end of

935
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:18,960
storm king's thunder is probably going

936
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:21,440
to be cool yes i don't believe and i

937
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:23,440
don't want that to be the thing

938
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:25,040
that my friends talk about when they

939
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:27,440
tell the story about our dungeons and

940
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:30,160
dragons campaign i don't want them to be

941
00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:32,400
excited or tell other people about the

942
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:34,000
stuff that chris perkins wrote for

943
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:36,720
wizards of the coast

944
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:38,800
when they tell the story i want it to be

945
00:35:36,720 --> 00:35:40,640
oh manny set me up for this thing and

946
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,480
blah blah blah and you should have seen

947
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:44,640
what he did to luke's character and how

948
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:46,240
he messed him up emotionally

949
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:48,240
those are the things that i want and in

950
00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:49,920
order to get that i have to work for it

951
00:35:48,240 --> 00:35:52,480
and i enjoy it

952
00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:54,800
you know i'm i'm adapting to published

953
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,599
modules for my stream games

954
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,880
and

955
00:35:55,599 --> 00:35:59,200
mechanically

956
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:00,800
they're very good i do not mess with the

957
00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:02,240
mechanics at all mostly because i don't

958
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:03,920
want to yeah i don't want to crunch

959
00:36:02,240 --> 00:36:06,720
numbers i don't want to do spreadsheets

960
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:09,680
um if this is what it is then fine i

961
00:36:06,720 --> 00:36:13,359
will bend the narrative of the module

962
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:15,599
itself or the little niche within

963
00:36:13,359 --> 00:36:18,240
the overarching narrative for you know

964
00:36:15,599 --> 00:36:20,400
one of my players characters and that's

965
00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:23,680
that's the enjoyment out of it for me

966
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:26,400
and when prep gets tedious or you know

967
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:28,400
you just stare at a blank screen it's

968
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:30,960
not that i don't have any ideas it's

969
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:32,800
that i'm worried that

970
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:35,760
my players are not going to be

971
00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:36,560
emotionally invested like i want them to

972
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:37,680
be

973
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:38,480
yes

974
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,520
and

975
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:41,839
are they going to have a good time

976
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:44,640
slaying the giants yeah probably they're

977
00:36:41,839 --> 00:36:46,000
big you know they they're level 11 now

978
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:49,599
so they've been with these characters

979
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:51,040
for a while and their triumphs are the

980
00:36:49,599 --> 00:36:53,680
players triumphs

981
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:55,520
and that's great yay we did the thing we

982
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:57,440
killed the giants or whatever

983
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:59,119
yeah but like i said the idea is that i

984
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,560
don't want that to be their takeaway i

985
00:36:59,119 --> 00:37:02,160
don't remember

986
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:05,119
because at the end of every module you

987
00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:06,880
slayed whatever the bag bad was probably

988
00:37:05,119 --> 00:37:09,520
if you didn't

989
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:11,520
then your emotional like attachment to

990
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:13,680
it is the fact that you you did not

991
00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:16,079
succeed and that's what you talk about

992
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:17,440
and that comes from a place of you spend

993
00:37:16,079 --> 00:37:20,720
all this time on a module and a

994
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:21,920
character and however many months and at

995
00:37:20,720 --> 00:37:25,200
the end

996
00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:27,119
you did not succeed and disappointment

997
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:29,520
you know like a healthy kind it's it's

998
00:37:27,119 --> 00:37:32,000
yes it's yeah you know getting getting

999
00:37:29,520 --> 00:37:34,720
to find out the bad guy wins sometimes

1000
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:37,359
is a reward in and of itself

1001
00:37:34,720 --> 00:37:39,599
it's closure either way in of itself is

1002
00:37:37,359 --> 00:37:41,040
is something that we're all after and i

1003
00:37:39,599 --> 00:37:42,400
think as i said in the previous session

1004
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:44,480
that you can then use that as a

1005
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:46,800
springboard for

1006
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:51,079
chapter two campaign two what happens

1007
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:51,079
when the bad guy wins kind of thing

1008
00:37:52,140 --> 00:37:55,480
[Music]

1009
00:37:59,119 --> 00:38:04,079
when we used to play in brighter days

1010
00:38:01,599 --> 00:38:06,320
when we used to play in person still i

1011
00:38:04,079 --> 00:38:08,800
remember those days yeah way back when

1012
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:10,160
uh there'd be seven of us sat around the

1013
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:12,160
table and

1014
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:14,720
a couple of memories have been

1015
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:16,079
crystallized in my brain of

1016
00:38:14,720 --> 00:38:17,200
we used to play on one of the guy's

1017
00:38:16,079 --> 00:38:18,560
house at a huge table in the

1018
00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:20,480
conservatory

1019
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:22,000
and you know has a several colleagues so

1020
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:24,000
we all kind of like when's everyone

1021
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:26,160
finishing today let's clock off together

1022
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,400
let's let's drive to this guy's house

1023
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:29,599
rock up we play from say

1024
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,839
six till

1025
00:38:29,599 --> 00:38:34,640
maybe as late as you know 11 at some

1026
00:38:31,839 --> 00:38:37,040
point on a school night and so

1027
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:38,800
some of my memories are just me you know

1028
00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:41,359
that's where i lend the session

1029
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:43,440
packing up saying goodbye to everybody

1030
00:38:41,359 --> 00:38:45,119
hopping in the car driving home for 10

1031
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:46,400
minutes just

1032
00:38:45,119 --> 00:38:48,800
wired

1033
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:51,920
from the session just like running on

1034
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:53,440
adrenaline at like 11 15 at night when

1035
00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:55,200
i've got work and

1036
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:56,320
you know seven hours or something and

1037
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,560
i'm just like

1038
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:59,760
buzzing as i'm driving down an empty

1039
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:01,920
motorway

1040
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:04,079
it's just this crystal image of music

1041
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:06,480
probably a bit too loud you know wired

1042
00:39:04,079 --> 00:39:07,760
to the brim of oh i can't believe that's

1043
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,359
happened and

1044
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,720
what do i have to do now and oh i can

1045
00:39:09,359 --> 00:39:12,800
think about this and oh maybe if i come

1046
00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:14,560
at it from from that angle and oh

1047
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:16,000
they're gonna love it if if this thing

1048
00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:18,320
happens

1049
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:21,040
yeah um one of my favorite parts of the

1050
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:24,400
session oddly enough is when it's over

1051
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:26,400
and everybody kind of drops the curtain

1052
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:29,200
on that

1053
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:31,119
dual dynamic of them and then their

1054
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,480
character you know once i go okay that's

1055
00:39:31,119 --> 00:39:35,119
where we're going to leave it for a day

1056
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:37,359
everybody's characters kind of stop and

1057
00:39:35,119 --> 00:39:39,280
they go back to being my friends packing

1058
00:39:37,359 --> 00:39:40,240
up their bags and you know getting ready

1059
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:42,800
to go

1060
00:39:40,240 --> 00:39:44,079
and that's when you know everybody kind

1061
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:47,040
of drops the

1062
00:39:44,079 --> 00:39:48,160
illusion and we're back to being a group

1063
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:49,680
of friends

1064
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:51,920
and like i said i don't get to

1065
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:53,520
participate in their conversations the

1066
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:56,000
same way that they do

1067
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:59,280
but sitting there listening to greg talk

1068
00:39:56,000 --> 00:40:01,040
to louis about how this session went and

1069
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,720
how much fun they had

1070
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:04,720
those are the things that get me and

1071
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:06,800
then you know i get my quiet little bit

1072
00:40:04,720 --> 00:40:09,040
of reflection and then i have to drive

1073
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:10,319
40 i used to have to drive 45 minutes

1074
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:11,839
home

1075
00:40:10,319 --> 00:40:12,800
from where i played

1076
00:40:11,839 --> 00:40:16,400
and

1077
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:18,800
it was a very cool kind of solitary

1078
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:20,160
drive i can't talk to them about the end

1079
00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:23,760
of the session because i'm the dungeon

1080
00:40:20,160 --> 00:40:25,440
master i drive 45 minutes home and then

1081
00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:28,319
my poor wife has to hear it when i come

1082
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:30,560
through the door and just blurt words at

1083
00:40:28,319 --> 00:40:33,119
her and she was like have you

1084
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:34,400
been like this for the entire drive home

1085
00:40:33,119 --> 00:40:35,680
and i was like well it's actually worse

1086
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:38,240
because i don't have anybody to talk to

1087
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:40,319
so i've just been seething for 45

1088
00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:41,280
minutes and you were the first person

1089
00:40:40,319 --> 00:40:42,640
and

1090
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:44,560
you know like i said that comes from the

1091
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:47,359
emotional investment it's a lot of work

1092
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:49,440
to go play dungeons dragons in person

1093
00:40:47,359 --> 00:40:51,040
yes for sure

1094
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,480
a couple of my players they lived in the

1095
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,560
complete opposite direction so they were

1096
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:56,000
traveling up to an hour actually at that

1097
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:58,880
time at night it was a lot quicker it's

1098
00:40:56,000 --> 00:41:00,319
about 45 minutes but um yeah so you know

1099
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,839
if we're finishing at 11 they're not

1100
00:41:00,319 --> 00:41:03,920
getting home

1101
00:41:01,839 --> 00:41:05,359
until quarter to midnight but it's that

1102
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,520
as you said it's that emotional

1103
00:41:05,359 --> 00:41:08,960
investment and that they're willing to

1104
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:11,920
do that because

1105
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:13,520
down low's got some goofy idea

1106
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:15,200
tonight yeah

1107
00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:16,880
you know and it's just

1108
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,480
it's a weird thing because

1109
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:21,520
like i said you're the dungeon master

1110
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:22,800
you the perception is that you are in

1111
00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:25,760
control

1112
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:27,280
and part of the deal of being a player

1113
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,760
is you know this is where we're gonna

1114
00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:32,000
get into the psychological profile stuff

1115
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:32,880
is submitting to

1116
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:34,800
the

1117
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:36,960
the will of the dungeon master within

1118
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:38,560
the confines of the game yeah that

1119
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,800
you've created this character you're

1120
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:43,119
invested in that i'd like to believe you

1121
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:46,480
care very deeply for

1122
00:41:43,119 --> 00:41:49,200
that they trust with you

1123
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:51,599
to fulfill whatever emotional need that

1124
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:55,200
character represents for them

1125
00:41:51,599 --> 00:41:57,520
is it redemption after a failure is it

1126
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,599
vengeance against you know dead parents

1127
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:01,440
but you are the means for them to

1128
00:41:59,599 --> 00:42:03,839
achieve it

1129
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:05,599
and it's not like a huge responsibility

1130
00:42:03,839 --> 00:42:08,000
it's not only somebody watch your kid

1131
00:42:05,599 --> 00:42:10,240
but within the confines of this game

1132
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:13,040
you have this very personal thing your

1133
00:42:10,240 --> 00:42:14,880
character that you are specifically

1134
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:18,480
emotionally invested in

1135
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:20,079
and you turn its fate over for three

1136
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,880
four hours at a time

1137
00:42:20,079 --> 00:42:23,359
to

1138
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:25,200
a willing person who there has to be

1139
00:42:23,359 --> 00:42:27,520
some trust and some back and forth

1140
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:30,000
dynamic established with

1141
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:31,680
and at the end of the three hours here's

1142
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:34,319
your character back

1143
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:35,200
and we'll do this again you know next

1144
00:42:34,319 --> 00:42:37,920
week

1145
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:40,240
and to keep showing up week after week

1146
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:42,839
with this character who you love who for

1147
00:42:40,240 --> 00:42:47,040
the three hours where they exist in a

1148
00:42:42,839 --> 00:42:48,640
world of consequence and other things

1149
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:50,400
and then to take it back and go man i

1150
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:51,839
survived and then to show up again next

1151
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,359
week all right man that was great please

1152
00:42:51,839 --> 00:42:55,520
don't kill him again but i'll probably i

1153
00:42:53,359 --> 00:42:58,319
could be mad at you if you do

1154
00:42:55,520 --> 00:43:00,480
it's a weird kind of emotional dynamic

1155
00:42:58,319 --> 00:43:02,480
between two people

1156
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:04,480
i trust you with this imaginary thing

1157
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:06,240
that means the world to me

1158
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:08,560
and i'm gonna do it over and over again

1159
00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:10,839
and part of that is the idea that your

1160
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:13,599
thing might die

1161
00:43:10,839 --> 00:43:15,839
and you know like hey man i'm you know

1162
00:43:13,599 --> 00:43:17,599
i'm sorry if it's a pet you know i need

1163
00:43:15,839 --> 00:43:20,400
you to watch my pet and you you know you

1164
00:43:17,599 --> 00:43:22,000
let somebody's cat run out the door yeah

1165
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:24,720
you're a horrible person

1166
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,839
and and rightly so in this granted it's

1167
00:43:24,720 --> 00:43:30,000
not a tangible real thing but people

1168
00:43:27,839 --> 00:43:30,800
could be invested in it just the same

1169
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:32,880
way

1170
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:35,920
and they could give it to you

1171
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:38,560
at four o'clock in the afternoon and by

1172
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:40,400
6 30 you've killed it and they watched

1173
00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:42,960
you do it yeah and they'd be like hey

1174
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:45,200
man i hope you had fun and would you

1175
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:47,680
explain it like that it's a weird it's a

1176
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:49,680
weird idea it is

1177
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:52,240
yeah you know when you put it

1178
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:54,319
like that it is super if you if you went

1179
00:43:52,240 --> 00:43:56,480
to new players and explained to the game

1180
00:43:54,319 --> 00:43:59,040
to them in that way i think there'd be a

1181
00:43:56,480 --> 00:44:00,800
lot less new players uh

1182
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:02,319
just because of that weird dynamic but

1183
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:04,800
it ties back into what we're talking

1184
00:44:02,319 --> 00:44:06,400
about earlier on about the trust of the

1185
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,240
dm and how i was saying like it's a

1186
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:10,800
piece of cake to kill the players but

1187
00:44:08,240 --> 00:44:13,280
you the players are trusting the dm not

1188
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,079
to do that arbitrarily not to just be

1189
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:17,200
like

1190
00:44:14,079 --> 00:44:20,160
a dragon comes out this guy and blasts

1191
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:22,480
20 d6 that you fire breath

1192
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:24,960
just because that would be a laugh

1193
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:27,520
so it is that weird kind yeah that weird

1194
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:29,599
kind of like okay we're in the same boat

1195
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:32,079
together and we're kind of going in the

1196
00:44:29,599 --> 00:44:33,520
same direction except

1197
00:44:32,079 --> 00:44:36,160
one of you is kind of occasionally

1198
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:38,160
rocking the boat as the dm maybe that's

1199
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:40,240
a bit of a strange metaphor but it it

1200
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:42,160
kind of made more sense in my head

1201
00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:44,079
it's and it's not even like accidentally

1202
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:46,880
rocking the boat it's you know in

1203
00:44:44,079 --> 00:44:48,880
essence rocking the boat as part of

1204
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,960
my deal of being a passenger on this

1205
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:52,640
thing we're all passengers together my

1206
00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:54,880
responsibility is different and my

1207
00:44:52,640 --> 00:44:57,680
responsibility is to place adversity in

1208
00:44:54,880 --> 00:45:00,400
front of you and see how you react so

1209
00:44:57,680 --> 00:45:02,400
i'm going to rock this boat just because

1210
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,680
i want to see what you guys do about it

1211
00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:06,240
like i said when you explain like that

1212
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:08,400
yeah it's it's it's a weird

1213
00:45:06,240 --> 00:45:10,480
dynamic when you boil it down to its

1214
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,240
very basics and

1215
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,680
getting ready for this i was wondering i

1216
00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:15,040
was like oh you're going to talk about

1217
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:17,359
emotion

1218
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:19,920
well that's that's an awesome thing and

1219
00:45:17,359 --> 00:45:22,319
then it's also well shouldn't everybody

1220
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:25,440
have kind of an emotional investment or

1221
00:45:22,319 --> 00:45:26,400
take in this thing dungeon master or

1222
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,640
player

1223
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:30,880
and is this kind of

1224
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:32,960
subject unnecessary everybody's like oh

1225
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:35,119
yeah yeah manny being emotionally

1226
00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:36,400
invested thanks bro that was a good hour

1227
00:45:35,119 --> 00:45:37,200
listen

1228
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:38,800
and

1229
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:41,440
i feel like i haven't seen anybody

1230
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:43,680
discuss this and then

1231
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:46,400
when you get to things like wizards of

1232
00:45:43,680 --> 00:45:48,400
the coast their publications all their

1233
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:50,160
job is about doing the thing yeah it's

1234
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:52,319
hard to get emotionally invested it's

1235
00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:54,240
almost back to the video game analogy

1236
00:45:52,319 --> 00:45:56,960
yeah where for sure this is why the

1237
00:45:54,240 --> 00:45:59,599
character needs to care about this thing

1238
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:02,319
and all right man cool i need to destroy

1239
00:45:59,599 --> 00:46:05,440
the curse in icelandale so it's not dark

1240
00:46:02,319 --> 00:46:08,000
for two years okay that's the thing why

1241
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:10,400
why are you gonna do it why do you care

1242
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:11,760
yeah i think um if i'm being honest it's

1243
00:46:10,400 --> 00:46:13,040
probably one of the reasons why i have

1244
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,800
not played too many of the published

1245
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:16,720
modules you've probably answered the

1246
00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:18,800
question that i haven't been brave

1247
00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:21,599
enough to ask myself which is because

1248
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:23,839
i'm not a fan maybe of that implicit

1249
00:46:21,599 --> 00:46:26,240
attachment it's that you have to care

1250
00:46:23,839 --> 00:46:26,960
about ice and dale because we're playing

1251
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:29,599
it

1252
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:30,960
rather than i guess what i like more is

1253
00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:33,040
make something you care about because

1254
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:35,119
you want to care about it and make them

1255
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:37,280
have an objective that i can tie into

1256
00:46:35,119 --> 00:46:39,520
the wider objective

1257
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:42,560
and then everybody wins

1258
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:44,640
no one's had to pander to a published

1259
00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:46,319
adventure which makes it sound really

1260
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:48,319
harsh and makes it sound like i know i

1261
00:46:46,319 --> 00:46:49,760
hate them and i'm talking from ignorance

1262
00:46:48,319 --> 00:46:51,440
here so please take that with a pinch of

1263
00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:54,160
salt of course but i think it's just one

1264
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:55,760
of the things that's inherent about

1265
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:58,160
wizards and we go back to the fire

1266
00:46:55,760 --> 00:47:00,079
emblem thing is that they want to make

1267
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:03,920
it as appealing

1268
00:47:00,079 --> 00:47:06,240
to every body because at my most cynical

1269
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:09,680
they want you to buy their product

1270
00:47:06,240 --> 00:47:12,240
and if you get too specific then we get

1271
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:15,119
into the deus ex thing if

1272
00:47:12,240 --> 00:47:17,440
the story of rhyme of the frost maiden

1273
00:47:15,119 --> 00:47:20,000
is told from the perspective of

1274
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:22,240
somebody who lives in ice wind dale and

1275
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:24,240
they're gonna save their homeland

1276
00:47:22,240 --> 00:47:27,760
your niche is too small for somebody who

1277
00:47:24,240 --> 00:47:30,319
wants to play you know wolfgar from the

1278
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:32,400
salvatore novels they're perfect like if

1279
00:47:30,319 --> 00:47:34,880
that's your thing that's your cyberpunk

1280
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,920
cool haircut cool sunglasses aesthetic

1281
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:37,760
and you're in

1282
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:40,640
you know wizards has to go the opposite

1283
00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:43,680
way they have to make it so that anybody

1284
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:47,040
could possibly want to

1285
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:49,680
do this and so when i when i adapt uh

1286
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:52,720
modules i basically just keep the

1287
00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:53,839
mechanics the encounters the locations

1288
00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:54,960
like i said it's mostly stuff i don't

1289
00:47:53,839 --> 00:47:56,880
want to mess with

1290
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:58,559
even down to

1291
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:01,119
the beginning

1292
00:47:58,559 --> 00:48:02,960
plot hooks if i have to i i took the

1293
00:48:01,119 --> 00:48:06,400
narrative for dragon heist completely

1294
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:09,920
apart kept maybe 20 of it i could not

1295
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:12,640
get my group to believe

1296
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:14,880
in this idea as it was written for them

1297
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:17,599
to become emotionally invested

1298
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:19,760
and if i just read it as it was written

1299
00:48:17,599 --> 00:48:21,760
there's a reward some money's missing

1300
00:48:19,760 --> 00:48:23,280
blah blah blah

1301
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:25,359
it's not cool enough for everybody to

1302
00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:27,680
pretend to be ocean's 11.

1303
00:48:25,359 --> 00:48:30,000
so it's got to be more of your standard

1304
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:31,599
fantasy trope i need you to be invested

1305
00:48:30,000 --> 00:48:34,160
about why you care

1306
00:48:31,599 --> 00:48:36,400
and because they were new players i made

1307
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:38,720
it about money it was just the easiest

1308
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:40,720
one everybody wants it you're level one

1309
00:48:38,720 --> 00:48:43,200
you probably have your eye on something

1310
00:48:40,720 --> 00:48:44,400
level three four you need money make it

1311
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:46,319
about money

1312
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:48,240
and that's the beginning and

1313
00:48:46,319 --> 00:48:49,680
rhyme of the frostbane is the same thing

1314
00:48:48,240 --> 00:48:50,559
the curse has been going on for two

1315
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:51,280
years

1316
00:48:50,559 --> 00:48:54,079
so

1317
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:56,880
the idea that somebody a level one

1318
00:48:54,079 --> 00:48:59,680
adventurer is going to suddenly decide

1319
00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:02,000
after two years you know what i've had

1320
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:03,839
enough of this i'm gonna march up to

1321
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:05,920
iceland dale and i'm gonna do something

1322
00:49:03,839 --> 00:49:07,680
about it yeah it's impossible and

1323
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,440
basically that's where wizards want you

1324
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:12,160
to begin with

1325
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:14,319
my level one adventurer after two years

1326
00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:16,160
finally says i can't take this anymore

1327
00:49:14,319 --> 00:49:18,160
i'm gonna go do something about it i'm

1328
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:20,800
gonna start costing spouses

1329
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:22,880
yeah you know i i learned okay i learned

1330
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:25,200
you know i got a couple of can trips i'm

1331
00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:27,680
ready to go two years i got this and

1332
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:29,520
those things are hard and it's a little

1333
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:33,119
preposterous when you really think about

1334
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:36,720
it yeah so i was back to okay how do i

1335
00:49:33,119 --> 00:49:38,000
get people to care about this in order

1336
00:49:36,720 --> 00:49:40,240
to

1337
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:41,440
to to do the thing you could just say

1338
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:42,800
all right you know we're going to play

1339
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,160
this game we're playing rhyme of the

1340
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:45,760
frost maiden we're going to go do the

1341
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:48,079
thing all right

1342
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:49,520
nobody's invested nobody cares it's just

1343
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:52,079
you're doing it because that's what it

1344
00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:54,720
says for you to do yes so

1345
00:49:52,079 --> 00:49:56,880
you you take it apart and

1346
00:49:54,720 --> 00:49:58,960
like i said i look for emotional moments

1347
00:49:56,880 --> 00:50:00,960
i don't i don't know that i judge things

1348
00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:02,880
by like the mechanics of it i appreciate

1349
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:04,800
them but i don't go i'm gonna use this

1350
00:50:02,880 --> 00:50:07,280
because mechanically it's cool

1351
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:10,720
so you just find all right what what

1352
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:13,280
emotional things could bring anybody

1353
00:50:10,720 --> 00:50:15,680
to icewind dale to deal with this

1354
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:18,160
money's always the first one

1355
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:20,480
you wait for you know my group to get

1356
00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:22,800
figured out who's gonna play and then

1357
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:25,520
the next thing is character backstory is

1358
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:29,599
there a nugget in your backstory

1359
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:31,599
that would make you go up there yeah and

1360
00:50:29,599 --> 00:50:33,920
if there is great that's a little less

1361
00:50:31,599 --> 00:50:36,319
work and if not

1362
00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:38,000
i'll create one

1363
00:50:36,319 --> 00:50:40,319
i need you to i need you to be patient

1364
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:42,079
and understand that i've done the work

1365
00:50:40,319 --> 00:50:43,520
your weird little payoff that you don't

1366
00:50:42,079 --> 00:50:45,599
know what you want

1367
00:50:43,520 --> 00:50:48,160
uh it's coming you just have to stick

1368
00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:51,200
with me until you get there

1369
00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:53,680
but ideally i hope it will be worth it

1370
00:50:51,200 --> 00:50:56,000
yeah and you know when you go back to

1371
00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:58,880
asking them what they want that's part

1372
00:50:56,000 --> 00:51:00,960
of it too is that before this game gets

1373
00:50:58,880 --> 00:51:02,880
set what do you guys want out of this do

1374
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:05,520
you want survival horror john

1375
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:08,319
carpenter's the thing 30 days of night

1376
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:10,000
okay cool we could do that do you want

1377
00:51:08,319 --> 00:51:13,119
the last couple of seasons of game of

1378
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:15,520
thrones not a lot of things going on

1379
00:51:13,119 --> 00:51:18,400
but the emotional turmoil of all the

1380
00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:21,359
seasons added up on the characters do

1381
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:22,880
you want that and whatever it is like i

1382
00:51:21,359 --> 00:51:25,680
said find out what they want give it to

1383
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:27,520
them it's yeah it's it's that simple and

1384
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:29,280
you can give them smashing dragons but

1385
00:51:27,520 --> 00:51:31,440
everybody has that

1386
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:33,359
give them the thing that they may not be

1387
00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:35,520
able to express that they want

1388
00:51:33,359 --> 00:51:37,920
but is going to make them come back

1389
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:40,240
make them feel something go yeah man

1390
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:42,480
that was cool or man this place really

1391
00:51:40,240 --> 00:51:44,559
sucks i feel for these people i can't

1392
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:46,480
let them live like this whatever it is

1393
00:51:44,559 --> 00:51:48,079
feel something and let that be your

1394
00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:51,119
driving force

1395
00:51:48,079 --> 00:51:54,720
or do i've stupidly done and just have a

1396
00:51:51,119 --> 00:51:56,720
campaign so vast and big that it just

1397
00:51:54,720 --> 00:51:59,920
incidentally covers every

1398
00:51:56,720 --> 00:52:02,800
every conceivable notion of heists of

1399
00:51:59,920 --> 00:52:05,359
gritty realism of body horror of

1400
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:07,520
of goofy whimsical adventures in the

1401
00:52:05,359 --> 00:52:09,280
faye and just never see it finished

1402
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:10,960
because it will take five years to get

1403
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:12,559
through

1404
00:52:10,960 --> 00:52:15,440
and you know those are

1405
00:52:12,559 --> 00:52:17,520
that's on your end just you know kind of

1406
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:19,599
covering all your bases if if

1407
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:21,920
everybody's in for like the big meta

1408
00:52:19,599 --> 00:52:24,079
experience and you know that all of

1409
00:52:21,920 --> 00:52:26,880
these things are very dungeons and

1410
00:52:24,079 --> 00:52:29,920
dragons the heist the chase

1411
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:32,559
and if you're into a bigger experience

1412
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:34,960
then this will scratch all those itches

1413
00:52:32,559 --> 00:52:36,960
even if your character's background is

1414
00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:39,280
vengeance for you know dead parents or

1415
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:41,359
whatever yeah there are other emotional

1416
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:43,119
itches that you don't know you need

1417
00:52:41,359 --> 00:52:44,319
scratch that will get scratched along

1418
00:52:43,119 --> 00:52:46,640
the way

1419
00:52:44,319 --> 00:52:49,200
and finding those things and presenting

1420
00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:50,800
as many options as they can

1421
00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:52,880
i think it's good done drink mastering

1422
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:54,160
is it efficient dungeon mastering no

1423
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:55,760
because you're going to write a ton of

1424
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:57,839
stuff that they're never going to come

1425
00:52:55,760 --> 00:53:01,280
across and and that's just the byproduct

1426
00:52:57,839 --> 00:53:03,680
and it it's hard it is it's it's hard

1427
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:04,960
man i'm not gonna lie sucks i've worked

1428
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:06,720
really hard on this thing you guys are

1429
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:07,839
never gonna see well let's see it no

1430
00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:09,100
because i'm gonna save it for somebody

1431
00:53:07,839 --> 00:53:11,119
else who will see it

1432
00:53:09,100 --> 00:53:12,640
[Laughter]

1433
00:53:11,119 --> 00:53:15,839
that indignant

1434
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:17,440
indignancy of the dm sounds like a good

1435
00:53:15,839 --> 00:53:18,319
title for a book or a podcast or

1436
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:21,520
something

1437
00:53:18,319 --> 00:53:25,040
yeah i said good day sir you know

1438
00:53:21,520 --> 00:53:26,480
and it's it's like i said from the meta

1439
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:28,880
dungeon master

1440
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:29,680
concept i love it i think it's great

1441
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:32,079
that

1442
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:33,520
you are giving this effort

1443
00:53:32,079 --> 00:53:35,440
to

1444
00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:36,960
like i said scratch whatever itch they

1445
00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:40,640
need scratched whether they know it or

1446
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:42,720
not yeah i did an auction once for magic

1447
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:44,319
items that yeah i didn't want like a

1448
00:53:42,720 --> 00:53:47,839
magic store i just i think they're

1449
00:53:44,319 --> 00:53:50,720
cliche so i did magic items and i found

1450
00:53:47,839 --> 00:53:52,400
a thing on dm's guild about mechanics

1451
00:53:50,720 --> 00:53:55,359
for an auction

1452
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:57,200
and i did an auction i hate shopping i

1453
00:53:55,359 --> 00:53:58,800
don't want them just wander around magic

1454
00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:00,880
store and just buy whatever they want

1455
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:02,800
with the assumption that it's there so i

1456
00:54:00,880 --> 00:54:04,319
pulled a list of a couple of magic items

1457
00:54:02,800 --> 00:54:06,160
i knew the math they didn't have enough

1458
00:54:04,319 --> 00:54:07,119
for everything so they had to pick and

1459
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:08,079
choose

1460
00:54:07,119 --> 00:54:09,359
and

1461
00:54:08,079 --> 00:54:10,880
you know just like with a regular

1462
00:54:09,359 --> 00:54:13,119
auction they have i printed them out a

1463
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:16,480
little catalog a little picture art from

1464
00:54:13,119 --> 00:54:17,520
the um oh wow from the dmg and i gave it

1465
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:20,400
to him and i was like all right here's

1466
00:54:17,520 --> 00:54:21,920
your here's your auction catalog here's

1467
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:23,440
everything that it does descriptions

1468
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:24,800
were straight out of the uh the dungeon

1469
00:54:23,440 --> 00:54:25,599
masters guide

1470
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:27,359
and

1471
00:54:25,599 --> 00:54:28,559
you know you get this thing you're like

1472
00:54:27,359 --> 00:54:29,359
all right we're going shopping and all

1473
00:54:28,559 --> 00:54:30,160
they think is they're going to do is

1474
00:54:29,359 --> 00:54:32,960
just

1475
00:54:30,160 --> 00:54:34,880
i spend 3 000 i get this thing no yeah

1476
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:36,960
and then now it's this competitive thing

1477
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:40,000
because one of the mechanics is that

1478
00:54:36,960 --> 00:54:42,240
there is people bidding against you

1479
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:43,680
and so it's not just oh here's a catalog

1480
00:54:42,240 --> 00:54:45,200
these are the things we can get i want

1481
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:47,760
this you take that

1482
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:50,160
there was also the added kind of stress

1483
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:53,040
of hey you could want this all you want

1484
00:54:50,160 --> 00:54:55,359
if this dice mechanic for

1485
00:54:53,040 --> 00:54:57,200
a competing bidder

1486
00:54:55,359 --> 00:54:59,119
just rolls higher than you you're not

1487
00:54:57,200 --> 00:55:00,640
going to get it you thought 10 minutes

1488
00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:02,000
ago that this was going to be a cakewalk

1489
00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:03,920
i'm going to get these boots of elven

1490
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:07,440
speed and be done

1491
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:09,119
sorry man you were outbid and it was fun

1492
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:11,440
they got they only got outbid on one

1493
00:55:09,119 --> 00:55:13,359
thing i think

1494
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:16,240
but it like i said it turned a shopping

1495
00:55:13,359 --> 00:55:17,200
trip into uh like a bit of competition

1496
00:55:16,240 --> 00:55:18,960
they

1497
00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:22,079
you know and then there's the anxiety of

1498
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:24,240
man i really wanted this thing and now

1499
00:55:22,079 --> 00:55:26,240
you know i keep rolling fours

1500
00:55:24,240 --> 00:55:28,000
and because of that i don't get this

1501
00:55:26,240 --> 00:55:29,839
thing and

1502
00:55:28,000 --> 00:55:31,359
when they do win the bid you know

1503
00:55:29,839 --> 00:55:32,720
everybody's really excited just like at

1504
00:55:31,359 --> 00:55:33,920
a real auction

1505
00:55:32,720 --> 00:55:37,200
when they lost the bid they were

1506
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:38,960
genuinely upset and it was this way of

1507
00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:40,160
injecting and like i said i had no idea

1508
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:42,000
it was going to turn into this i just

1509
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:43,760
didn't want to do shopping but as a

1510
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:46,000
happy coincidence it turned into this

1511
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:48,160
really kind of emotional day and i'm

1512
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:49,599
almost positive the whole session was

1513
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:52,720
the auction

1514
00:55:49,599 --> 00:55:53,920
that they they were just into it and i

1515
00:55:52,720 --> 00:55:55,920
thought that they were at some point

1516
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:57,599
just going to make little paddles so

1517
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:58,880
that be sitting across the table from

1518
00:55:57,599 --> 00:56:00,880
them they were going to you know hold up

1519
00:55:58,880 --> 00:56:03,440
a paddle like they were yeah bidding at

1520
00:56:00,880 --> 00:56:05,680
christie's or whatever

1521
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:07,200
and it was cool it was this accidental

1522
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:09,359
like little odd thing that i thought

1523
00:56:07,200 --> 00:56:11,200
would be fun an auction and it turned

1524
00:56:09,359 --> 00:56:12,799
into this really cool thing that they

1525
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:14,319
enjoyed that

1526
00:56:12,799 --> 00:56:16,400
as long as i've known them if you'd

1527
00:56:14,319 --> 00:56:18,319
asked me ahead of time hey are you guys

1528
00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:19,440
really going to enjoy this auction i'd

1529
00:56:18,319 --> 00:56:20,640
have been like no they're going to

1530
00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:22,640
priest through it get their stuff and

1531
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:24,319
then be on their way and yeah it was

1532
00:56:22,640 --> 00:56:25,920
cool they they didn't know they wanted

1533
00:56:24,319 --> 00:56:27,680
an auction they didn't know competitive

1534
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:29,839
bidding in dungeons and dragons was

1535
00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:31,520
going to be fun yep but it worked out

1536
00:56:29,839 --> 00:56:33,119
and you know when you talk about all the

1537
00:56:31,520 --> 00:56:35,520
things that you've written that they

1538
00:56:33,119 --> 00:56:37,440
might not ever see yeah but when they do

1539
00:56:35,520 --> 00:56:38,799
see it and like i said the auction thing

1540
00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:40,319
was a throwaway

1541
00:56:38,799 --> 00:56:42,640
and they loved it you're like all right

1542
00:56:40,319 --> 00:56:45,839
man this is my incentive to maybe

1543
00:56:42,640 --> 00:56:46,799
push your expectations a little more

1544
00:56:45,839 --> 00:56:49,839
and

1545
00:56:46,799 --> 00:56:52,079
get me out of this kind of go here do

1546
00:56:49,839 --> 00:56:54,319
this thing go back to here bigger

1547
00:56:52,079 --> 00:56:56,559
problem bigger problem bigger problem

1548
00:56:54,319 --> 00:56:59,200
that components that are

1549
00:56:56,559 --> 00:57:01,440
just as important to them or

1550
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:03,839
you know mean as much to them can be

1551
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:05,920
these odd little side

1552
00:57:03,839 --> 00:57:09,040
ideas

1553
00:57:05,920 --> 00:57:10,960
i have to say um great minds because

1554
00:57:09,040 --> 00:57:13,280
it's it's weird how well to collide

1555
00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:15,200
because i also did an auction a little

1556
00:57:13,280 --> 00:57:17,599
while ago funnily enough similar

1557
00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:20,160
reasoning in that i like to subvert

1558
00:57:17,599 --> 00:57:21,359
expectations similar kind of thing of

1559
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:24,000
you know i didn't want just to be an

1560
00:57:21,359 --> 00:57:26,640
item shop and it was part of a

1561
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:28,799
masquerade ball or you know like a

1562
00:57:26,640 --> 00:57:30,480
philanthropist's house party kind of

1563
00:57:28,799 --> 00:57:31,839
thing so it's like a ding ding ding

1564
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:33,839
we're gonna do the auction now can

1565
00:57:31,839 --> 00:57:35,839
everyone make your way to the uh the

1566
00:57:33,839 --> 00:57:37,280
west wing and we'll do the auction and

1567
00:57:35,839 --> 00:57:38,960
it was a bit of more of a fanciful

1568
00:57:37,280 --> 00:57:41,520
affair of

1569
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:44,400
local celebrities and dignitaries voting

1570
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:46,960
but the gimmick for mine was that the

1571
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:49,040
items were they were all the aesthetic

1572
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:50,480
items from xamathar's guide to

1573
00:57:49,040 --> 00:57:52,559
everything so all the ones which are

1574
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:55,280
ostensibly magic but uh

1575
00:57:52,559 --> 00:57:57,359
just for show in a way so the gleaming

1576
00:57:55,280 --> 00:58:00,240
armor that can't get dirty

1577
00:57:57,359 --> 00:58:01,680
the cane that turns into a sword i think

1578
00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:04,640
there's like a pair of pants that looks

1579
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:07,119
like they're on fire yeah yeah

1580
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:09,839
bits and bobs like that yeah so you know

1581
00:58:07,119 --> 00:58:12,160
nice nice to have and i foolishly did

1582
00:58:09,839 --> 00:58:14,160
not stand on the shoulders of giants and

1583
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:16,400
just tried to make my own

1584
00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:17,839
head cannon up of how this person is

1585
00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:19,520
gonna bid and who they're bidding

1586
00:58:17,839 --> 00:58:21,359
against and stuff and i think two items

1587
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:24,240
were bought in the end it was the armor

1588
00:58:21,359 --> 00:58:26,480
of gleaming and the

1589
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:28,240
uh the wand of conducting where you can

1590
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:29,920
it's a bit like a wind waker where you

1591
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:30,799
can just wave the wand and music starts

1592
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:33,040
playing

1593
00:58:30,799 --> 00:58:35,359
nice yeah which was a nice touch

1594
00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:37,200
hell for me to do an auction on the fly

1595
00:58:35,359 --> 00:58:38,240
because i'm an idiot and didn't prepare

1596
00:58:37,200 --> 00:58:40,480
and

1597
00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:43,200
copy from them better than it yeah yeah

1598
00:58:40,480 --> 00:58:44,480
yeah i think so i think it might be

1599
00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:46,640
my my

1600
00:58:44,480 --> 00:58:48,000
i don't want to say problem my challenge

1601
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:49,520
is

1602
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:53,520
six players

1603
00:58:49,520 --> 00:58:56,559
with potentially quite unaligned desires

1604
00:58:53,520 --> 00:58:58,640
so we have the whole gamut from

1605
00:58:56,559 --> 00:59:01,440
maths maths maths i've multi-classed

1606
00:58:58,640 --> 00:59:03,520
here because that gives me plus x

1607
00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:06,240
here which means that i can do y a lot

1608
00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:07,680
better in this certain situation i get

1609
00:59:06,240 --> 00:59:10,240
one more language and one more

1610
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:14,079
proficiency yeah like that makes me

1611
00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:16,880
happy that i've chiseled this character

1612
00:59:14,079 --> 00:59:18,400
to be this efficient killing machine all

1613
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:20,319
the way up to

1614
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:22,640
a warlock who

1615
00:59:20,319 --> 00:59:26,480
made a page and a half

1616
00:59:22,640 --> 00:59:28,480
backstory with time skips and ties into

1617
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:30,160
their patrons and

1618
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:31,680
we've talked before about his home life

1619
00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:33,280
and where his family live on the world

1620
00:59:31,680 --> 00:59:35,359
map after i provided it with them and

1621
00:59:33,280 --> 00:59:38,240
stuff and and he's into it for a lot

1622
00:59:35,359 --> 00:59:40,559
more of the juicy kind of inter-party

1623
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:41,760
relationships and friction whereas

1624
00:59:40,559 --> 00:59:43,200
you've got that other player who

1625
00:59:41,760 --> 00:59:45,599
basically doesn't give him any of that

1626
00:59:43,200 --> 00:59:48,640
because he's very stoic and like i go

1627
00:59:45,599 --> 00:59:50,799
here i do this but eventually and you'd

1628
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:53,920
like to hope that this would be the case

1629
00:59:50,799 --> 00:59:56,720
after about 45 sessions or so everyone's

1630
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:58,880
slowly starting to smush together and

1631
00:59:56,720 --> 01:00:01,839
those lines of

1632
00:59:58,880 --> 01:00:04,799
min max there versus rpl are starting to

1633
01:00:01,839 --> 01:00:06,640
blur and cross which is great that's

1634
01:00:04,799 --> 01:00:08,640
what i'm after that's perfect because

1635
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:11,280
then that unlocks

1636
01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:13,440
those emotional payoffs it unlocks those

1637
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:16,000
well hey that guy didn't save your life

1638
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:16,880
when you were fighting last time

1639
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:18,960
does that

1640
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:22,000
is that not infuriating like he was

1641
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:22,000
going to let you die man

1642
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:26,319
like i said i i think and it's also part

1643
01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:27,520
of just how long your group has been

1644
01:00:26,319 --> 01:00:30,480
together

1645
01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:32,319
that the kind of walls and everything

1646
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:34,240
fall and

1647
01:00:32,319 --> 01:00:36,319
you know your situation's very similar

1648
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:38,640
to mine with your group dynamic is that

1649
01:00:36,319 --> 01:00:40,160
everybody is at least familiar with each

1650
01:00:38,640 --> 01:00:42,960
other and

1651
01:00:40,160 --> 01:00:45,680
whether you guys are super close

1652
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:49,119
in work outside of work the time spent

1653
01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:51,520
together builds that bond amongst if not

1654
01:00:49,119 --> 01:00:52,960
the people who become more familiar with

1655
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:54,559
each other we always sit next to each

1656
01:00:52,960 --> 01:00:56,559
other during the game and then that

1657
01:00:54,559 --> 01:00:58,960
bleeds into the characters yeah or the

1658
01:00:56,559 --> 01:01:00,799
opposite is you the player can make the

1659
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:02,640
conscientious decision for your

1660
01:01:00,799 --> 01:01:04,480
character to

1661
01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:06,640
make the effort to make the group a

1662
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:08,319
little more cohesive and that's fine too

1663
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:10,319
you know any group project anybody who

1664
01:01:08,319 --> 01:01:11,599
works in a kind of collaborative field

1665
01:01:10,319 --> 01:01:13,200
eventually you're going to come across

1666
01:01:11,599 --> 01:01:15,119
that one person who's just going to be

1667
01:01:13,200 --> 01:01:17,440
like all right look for this work for

1668
01:01:15,119 --> 01:01:18,160
everybody we have to do you know x y and

1669
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:21,280
z

1670
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:23,040
yeah for sure yeah and that's totally

1671
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:24,559
fine you know not everybody has to kind

1672
01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:26,400
of stumble through the dark to find

1673
01:01:24,559 --> 01:01:29,200
everything and you know we're adults

1674
01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:31,440
we're at this thing that is you know not

1675
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:33,520
the easiest to manage time for so

1676
01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:36,160
there's no reason for us to not be as

1677
01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:38,480
efficient about it and if you know one

1678
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:41,520
of the end goals is party cohesion at

1679
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:43,839
least amongst the characters then just

1680
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:45,920
unilaterally making the decision to work

1681
01:01:43,839 --> 01:01:47,280
towards that is totally fine because in

1682
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:49,040
a real world dynamic that would

1683
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:51,040
absolutely happen somebody would just go

1684
01:01:49,040 --> 01:01:52,480
all right let's go around the room let's

1685
01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:54,400
meet each other real quick we got to

1686
01:01:52,480 --> 01:01:55,599
work together let's do this and that's

1687
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:58,319
fine too

1688
01:01:55,599 --> 01:02:00,319
however that goal of everybody blending

1689
01:01:58,319 --> 01:02:02,240
together the characters at least the

1690
01:02:00,319 --> 01:02:04,640
players ideally

1691
01:02:02,240 --> 01:02:06,720
but at least the characters is that you

1692
01:02:04,640 --> 01:02:08,799
guys have to get on the same page

1693
01:02:06,720 --> 01:02:11,200
and enjoy

1694
01:02:08,799 --> 01:02:13,359
or do your thing while doing the

1695
01:02:11,200 --> 01:02:15,039
collective get your little emotional

1696
01:02:13,359 --> 01:02:17,520
bits while everybody's working towards

1697
01:02:15,039 --> 01:02:19,920
this big thing some of you will all get

1698
01:02:17,520 --> 01:02:22,240
emotional bits all at once some of you

1699
01:02:19,920 --> 01:02:25,280
one at a time couple you know two at a

1700
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:27,839
time depending on where they overlap but

1701
01:02:25,280 --> 01:02:29,680
and like i said over time that min max

1702
01:02:27,839 --> 01:02:31,760
because my two experienced players you

1703
01:02:29,680 --> 01:02:34,480
know they they came in with uh optimized

1704
01:02:31,760 --> 01:02:37,680
characters which is fine yeah i i i

1705
01:02:34,480 --> 01:02:39,839
don't like being bad at something that

1706
01:02:37,680 --> 01:02:41,520
i'm trying to do as a diversion so i

1707
01:02:39,839 --> 01:02:42,960
don't play golf i don't want to go out

1708
01:02:41,520 --> 01:02:44,880
and be bad at something that's supposed

1709
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:47,280
to be fun so if you want to come in with

1710
01:02:44,880 --> 01:02:48,799
an optimized character that's fine you

1711
01:02:47,280 --> 01:02:50,480
know what your character is going to do

1712
01:02:48,799 --> 01:02:52,079
you want to be good at it there's

1713
01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:55,039
absolutely nothing wrong with that and

1714
01:02:52,079 --> 01:02:56,559
then the rpers are much more of the

1715
01:02:55,039 --> 01:02:59,520
they focus on the things that their

1716
01:02:56,559 --> 01:03:01,520
character can't do well and that's cool

1717
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:04,319
too the group i play in has a grave

1718
01:03:01,520 --> 01:03:06,319
cleric with a negative con modifier

1719
01:03:04,319 --> 01:03:08,000
like you're you're you're the you're the

1720
01:03:06,319 --> 01:03:11,520
healer and you're supposed to be the

1721
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:13,359
stout hearty one and like somehow you're

1722
01:03:11,520 --> 01:03:15,440
the healer but you're the fragile one

1723
01:03:13,359 --> 01:03:18,480
but still has a clarity and then we also

1724
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:19,920
have a war forged battle master very

1725
01:03:18,480 --> 01:03:23,119
stoic who

1726
01:03:19,920 --> 01:03:25,119
in the course of our role play together

1727
01:03:23,119 --> 01:03:28,960
has become very

1728
01:03:25,119 --> 01:03:31,680
defensive of the cleric for a her role

1729
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:34,400
in the party as you know the healer but

1730
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:37,680
also the character knowing that he's

1731
01:03:34,400 --> 01:03:40,079
this automated metal thing

1732
01:03:37,680 --> 01:03:42,559
and she is a

1733
01:03:40,079 --> 01:03:44,559
somewhat frail janassi that his

1734
01:03:42,559 --> 01:03:46,480
character's motivation is to be

1735
01:03:44,559 --> 01:03:49,119
protective of her

1736
01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:51,520
and so they share this really cool kind

1737
01:03:49,119 --> 01:03:54,160
of two-person role-playing dynamic

1738
01:03:51,520 --> 01:03:56,000
that's very interesting and it's cool to

1739
01:03:54,160 --> 01:03:57,680
watch i'm not a part of it i don't have

1740
01:03:56,000 --> 01:04:00,880
an emotional need being scratched right

1741
01:03:57,680 --> 01:04:03,119
now but watching the two of them

1742
01:04:00,880 --> 01:04:05,200
do it it's almost voyeuristic like i'm

1743
01:04:03,119 --> 01:04:07,039
watching this thing that i'm a part of

1744
01:04:05,200 --> 01:04:09,200
but not really a part of i'm in the

1745
01:04:07,039 --> 01:04:10,720
party i'm on screen but the scene

1746
01:04:09,200 --> 01:04:13,440
doesn't concern me

1747
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:15,520
and that's captivating to me even though

1748
01:04:13,440 --> 01:04:17,119
i'm not doing anything with my player

1749
01:04:15,520 --> 01:04:19,680
watching these

1750
01:04:17,119 --> 01:04:22,799
genuinely well played out emotional

1751
01:04:19,680 --> 01:04:24,319
exchanges is riveting even though

1752
01:04:22,799 --> 01:04:27,119
i'm not getting really anything

1753
01:04:24,319 --> 01:04:29,520
emotionally out of it

1754
01:04:27,119 --> 01:04:31,440
yeah for sure do you have anything

1755
01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:34,559
specific you wanted to cover

1756
01:04:31,440 --> 01:04:36,079
just players dungeon masters just

1757
01:04:34,559 --> 01:04:37,520
try to be like i said you know we've

1758
01:04:36,079 --> 01:04:40,160
basically hit on the same note all day

1759
01:04:37,520 --> 01:04:43,280
the more you're emotionally invested in

1760
01:04:40,160 --> 01:04:48,079
this and the more you care about

1761
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:49,680
the emotions of the other players and

1762
01:04:48,079 --> 01:04:51,359
the characters and the dungeon master

1763
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:53,119
like you know they have emotional needs

1764
01:04:51,359 --> 01:04:55,760
to be scratched too even if they're

1765
01:04:53,119 --> 01:04:58,799
somewhat sinister in presentation

1766
01:04:55,760 --> 01:05:00,160
you know that if there's anything with

1767
01:04:58,799 --> 01:05:01,680
this kind of

1768
01:05:00,160 --> 01:05:04,319
i don't want to say resurgence of

1769
01:05:01,680 --> 01:05:05,599
dungeons dragons but the idea of a

1770
01:05:04,319 --> 01:05:07,680
renaissance

1771
01:05:05,599 --> 01:05:08,880
yeah it being where it is in its

1772
01:05:07,680 --> 01:05:11,760
lifespan

1773
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:13,599
that there's a whole new group of people

1774
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:14,799
that don't know about it and learn about

1775
01:05:13,599 --> 01:05:16,799
it every day

1776
01:05:14,799 --> 01:05:19,760
and because of things like critical role

1777
01:05:16,799 --> 01:05:22,480
or any you know online stream game it's

1778
01:05:19,760 --> 01:05:26,000
a lot more than just rolling dice and

1779
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:27,920
killing dragons or wizards or whatever

1780
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:30,880
that there is this

1781
01:05:27,920 --> 01:05:33,440
space for more than just

1782
01:05:30,880 --> 01:05:35,039
a tangible achievement i killed the

1783
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,720
dragon that

1784
01:05:35,039 --> 01:05:38,720
you know even if you're not an actor you

1785
01:05:36,720 --> 01:05:39,680
didn't do drama in high school or

1786
01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:42,640
whatever

1787
01:05:39,680 --> 01:05:45,440
that there is a space for you

1788
01:05:42,640 --> 01:05:47,520
and the hardest part is to do the role

1789
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:49,200
play the role play is hard you're you're

1790
01:05:47,520 --> 01:05:50,960
with your friends you're going to do a

1791
01:05:49,200 --> 01:05:53,280
voice you're going to basically pray

1792
01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:54,319
pretend as an adult yeah it's a hard

1793
01:05:53,280 --> 01:05:56,559
thing to

1794
01:05:54,319 --> 01:05:57,280
a hard hurdle to get over

1795
01:05:56,559 --> 01:06:00,079
but

1796
01:05:57,280 --> 01:06:01,760
once you are on the other side of it the

1797
01:06:00,079 --> 01:06:04,480
emotional

1798
01:06:01,760 --> 01:06:08,079
thing that you receive from this game is

1799
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:10,000
just so much more once you've invested i

1800
01:06:08,079 --> 01:06:12,000
promise you it will give it will give

1801
01:06:10,000 --> 01:06:13,920
you more back than whatever effort you

1802
01:06:12,000 --> 01:06:16,960
put into your part of emotional

1803
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:19,039
investment for sure a million times over

1804
01:06:16,960 --> 01:06:20,799
i agree with you it's a it's like a

1805
01:06:19,039 --> 01:06:22,160
positive feedback loop you keep getting

1806
01:06:20,799 --> 01:06:23,440
more in and you keep getting more out

1807
01:06:22,160 --> 01:06:26,079
and everybody

1808
01:06:23,440 --> 01:06:27,839
everybody wins and it's just it reaches

1809
01:06:26,079 --> 01:06:30,000
critical mass and it just and then at

1810
01:06:27,839 --> 01:06:32,400
some point it almost even if you're not

1811
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:35,280
nurturing it every single day

1812
01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:37,039
you've given it enough that

1813
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:39,680
during a slow session when you know

1814
01:06:37,039 --> 01:06:41,920
either narratively or just because of

1815
01:06:39,680 --> 01:06:43,520
whatever things don't happen it's not

1816
01:06:41,920 --> 01:06:44,960
like everything comes to a screeching

1817
01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:47,039
halt well that's it for my emotional

1818
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:49,200
investment i'm out it's

1819
01:06:47,039 --> 01:06:50,799
if you give you know as much as you can

1820
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:52,400
every day for the days when you can't

1821
01:06:50,799 --> 01:06:53,760
the dungeon master can't the group just

1822
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:56,799
seems flat

1823
01:06:53,760 --> 01:06:59,359
you still have enough pent up in you

1824
01:06:56,799 --> 01:07:02,400
yeah to know this is this is still great

1825
01:06:59,359 --> 01:07:04,079
even though this today wasn't everything

1826
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:06,000
i wanted it to be

1827
01:07:04,079 --> 01:07:08,000
yeah just as in life you have ups and

1828
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:09,680
you have downs and that's the ride that

1829
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:12,000
we're on together and it's that kind of

1830
01:07:09,680 --> 01:07:15,200
group bonding experience that we've

1831
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:17,440
talked about before and one thing that i

1832
01:07:15,200 --> 01:07:18,799
want to end it on is

1833
01:07:17,440 --> 01:07:20,559
again a little bit of an emotional

1834
01:07:18,799 --> 01:07:22,640
rollercoaster is we touched it earlier

1835
01:07:20,559 --> 01:07:26,400
on it's that kind of dm

1836
01:07:22,640 --> 01:07:29,119
loneliness of sitting in your car just

1837
01:07:26,400 --> 01:07:31,760
like god i've got all these ideas but

1838
01:07:29,119 --> 01:07:33,200
i i don't have anyone to talk to and

1839
01:07:31,760 --> 01:07:35,200
that that's a pain i think every every

1840
01:07:33,200 --> 01:07:37,359
dm goes through at some point because of

1841
01:07:35,200 --> 01:07:39,839
course the the people you want to talk

1842
01:07:37,359 --> 01:07:42,880
to about it most are the ones you can't

1843
01:07:39,839 --> 01:07:44,319
ever talk about it to for lack of

1844
01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:45,839
whipping the emotional rug out from

1845
01:07:44,319 --> 01:07:48,799
under their feet and having nothing to

1846
01:07:45,839 --> 01:07:52,319
fall back on so what i'm very happy to

1847
01:07:48,799 --> 01:07:55,680
have found in in yourself is a

1848
01:07:52,319 --> 01:07:57,280
dm foil for me to bounce ideas off of

1849
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:58,880
perhaps next time i have a

1850
01:07:57,280 --> 01:08:00,319
an auction for

1851
01:07:58,880 --> 01:08:02,240
for items i know who i'm going to come

1852
01:08:00,319 --> 01:08:04,799
and talk to yeah you know they always

1853
01:08:02,240 --> 01:08:06,799
say shrinks have uh psychiatrists have

1854
01:08:04,799 --> 01:08:09,119
psychiatrists that they can talk to

1855
01:08:06,799 --> 01:08:10,880
and it's not the same thing but i i

1856
01:08:09,119 --> 01:08:13,839
always feel like a dungeon master should

1857
01:08:10,880 --> 01:08:15,359
have like a dungeon master friend

1858
01:08:13,839 --> 01:08:16,560
you know everybody has a concept of what

1859
01:08:15,359 --> 01:08:18,640
it means to be a dungeon master but

1860
01:08:16,560 --> 01:08:21,359
until you do it or that's what you kind

1861
01:08:18,640 --> 01:08:23,040
of have carved your niche out it is very

1862
01:08:21,359 --> 01:08:25,279
lonely and the only person that really

1863
01:08:23,040 --> 01:08:27,279
understands dungeon master problems are

1864
01:08:25,279 --> 01:08:28,319
other dungeon masters for a million

1865
01:08:27,279 --> 01:08:30,799
reasons

1866
01:08:28,319 --> 01:08:32,880
and it's good to have one or as many as

1867
01:08:30,799 --> 01:08:35,279
you want the you know the more you widen

1868
01:08:32,880 --> 01:08:37,520
your pool the more ideas or the more

1869
01:08:35,279 --> 01:08:39,920
collaboration or all these things

1870
01:08:37,520 --> 01:08:42,960
that keep your emotional investment in

1871
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:45,359
the actual act of dungeon mastering that

1872
01:08:42,960 --> 01:08:47,120
will then translate into your actual

1873
01:08:45,359 --> 01:08:48,960
game with it i think i think it's

1874
01:08:47,120 --> 01:08:51,279
important like you say it's just it's a

1875
01:08:48,960 --> 01:08:53,359
lonely thing otherwise

1876
01:08:51,279 --> 01:08:55,120
it's lonely at the top as they say

1877
01:08:53,359 --> 01:08:56,640
heavy's the head

1878
01:08:55,120 --> 01:08:58,719
all right well that's pretty much

1879
01:08:56,640 --> 01:09:01,120
brought us to the end so

1880
01:08:58,719 --> 01:09:03,120
is there anything you would like to plug

1881
01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:07,040
as you have the opportunity as of right

1882
01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:08,640
now i play algernon altano on mysteries

1883
01:09:07,040 --> 01:09:11,920
in the dale lands

1884
01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:14,239
monday night 7 30 eastern time on the

1885
01:09:11,920 --> 01:09:16,560
wily hobbit twitch channel

1886
01:09:14,239 --> 01:09:19,600
and then coming in january i will be

1887
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:22,319
dungeon mastering a greyhawk campaign on

1888
01:09:19,600 --> 01:09:24,799
sunday afternoons on that same channel

1889
01:09:22,319 --> 01:09:25,920
and then also that same month i will be

1890
01:09:24,799 --> 01:09:28,319
bringing

1891
01:09:25,920 --> 01:09:29,359
my rhyme of the frost main campaign to

1892
01:09:28,319 --> 01:09:30,080
stream

1893
01:09:29,359 --> 01:09:32,560
so

1894
01:09:30,080 --> 01:09:33,759
yes i do have things to plug and as soon

1895
01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:35,759
as we're done with this i'm going to go

1896
01:09:33,759 --> 01:09:37,839
back to the anxiety of getting both of

1897
01:09:35,759 --> 01:09:41,040
those ready

1898
01:09:37,839 --> 01:09:43,679
again another emotion i know only too

1899
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:46,080
well yes awesome sunday afternoons i am

1900
01:09:43,679 --> 01:09:48,560
typically free so i look forward to that

1901
01:09:46,080 --> 01:09:49,600
in the new year otherwise

1902
01:09:48,560 --> 01:09:51,640
thank you

1903
01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:55,440
ever ever so much your

1904
01:09:51,640 --> 01:09:56,800
enthusiasm is infectious and

1905
01:09:55,440 --> 01:09:57,920
i think that a lot of people are going

1906
01:09:56,800 --> 01:09:59,440
to listen to this and come out the other

1907
01:09:57,920 --> 01:10:01,520
side and go

1908
01:09:59,440 --> 01:10:03,920
i want to go and play d d now

1909
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:06,320
which i couldn't think of a better

1910
01:10:03,920 --> 01:10:07,120
outcome for an episode of the podcast so

1911
01:10:06,320 --> 01:10:09,040
yeah

1912
01:10:07,120 --> 01:10:10,400
thank you thank you ever so much thanks

1913
01:10:09,040 --> 01:10:12,400
for having me this was a like i said

1914
01:10:10,400 --> 01:10:15,440
this is a real cool thing that between

1915
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:17,440
this and your other um episodes i think

1916
01:10:15,440 --> 01:10:20,080
that these these topics these big

1917
01:10:17,440 --> 01:10:22,400
obscure kind of high-minded things need

1918
01:10:20,080 --> 01:10:24,400
to need a space for discussion and the

1919
01:10:22,400 --> 01:10:26,320
more people that listen to it and

1920
01:10:24,400 --> 01:10:28,640
participate in it i think it could only

1921
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:30,800
be good for for everybody if not just

1922
01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:33,520
the people who hear it thank you that

1923
01:10:30,800 --> 01:10:36,000
that means a lot if anyone has any

1924
01:10:33,520 --> 01:10:38,400
comments or thoughts on today's episodes

1925
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:40,640
or i don't know you might say emotions

1926
01:10:38,400 --> 01:10:42,960
please drop me a tweet at danielle

1927
01:10:40,640 --> 01:10:46,010
underscore dnd otherwise thank you all

1928
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:51,159
for listening and good night

1929
01:10:46,010 --> 01:10:51,159
[Music]