Feb. 18, 2022

Motion


This full house episode I'm joined by the cast of The Fourth Leg podcast: Joe, Hunter, & Kelci. And we talk all about motion, momentum, and movement in your TTRPGs. One way you can keep the game moving as both a GM and player, is to engage with those "B" and "C" plots, which often come in the form of backstories. That being said, don't be afraid from abstaining from action, as this can still result in character growth. Often it's considered a GMs worst nightmare, when the characters do nothing, but there are always consequences, which are great springboards for storylines and development. One more classic GM tool is, perhaps counterintuitively, just telling the players The Important Thing. It's easy as a GM to want to hold all the cards, but often this is overkill and just being transparent with the players can really get the ball rolling!

  • 02:50 - Moving Player Characters
  • 25:21 - Collaborative Storytelling
  • 32:27 - Analysis Paralysis: A Charcuterie Solution
  • 46:04 - Leveraging Other Disciplines
  • 52:57 - The Power of the GM

Find The Fourth Leg on:

Find me on:

References:

Patrons:

Intro Music: 'Local Forecast' by Kevin MacLeod
Intermission Music: 'Chill' by Kevin MacLeod
Outro Music: 'Local Forecast - Elevator' by Kevin MacLeod

Transcript

1
00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:06,720
welcome thinkers to season 3 episode 17

2
00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:08,870
of thinking critically today's episode

3
00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:17,350
is motion

4
00:00:08,870 --> 00:00:17,540
[Music]

5
00:00:17,350 --> 00:00:27,840
[Applause]

6
00:00:17,540 --> 00:00:31,199
[Music]

7
00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:32,880
and today i'm joined by the cast of the

8
00:00:31,199 --> 00:00:34,559
fourth leg podcast thank you ever so

9
00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:36,239
much for joining us today guys can you

10
00:00:34,559 --> 00:00:38,399
tell us a little bit about yourselves

11
00:00:36,239 --> 00:00:42,079
i'm joe i'm kelsey

12
00:00:38,399 --> 00:00:44,879
and i'm hunter we are the hosts and i am

13
00:00:42,079 --> 00:00:46,719
the editor of the fourth leg we're a

14
00:00:44,879 --> 00:00:49,440
tabletop gaming show all about giving

15
00:00:46,719 --> 00:00:52,239
new gm's a like to stand on and the

16
00:00:49,440 --> 00:00:55,760
entire purpose of our show is to

17
00:00:52,239 --> 00:00:59,440
provide a comprehensive a to b segmented

18
00:00:55,760 --> 00:01:01,760
show about how to get started as a gm

19
00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:03,520
starting in simple topics like session

20
00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:06,400
zeros and coming up with king pain

21
00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:08,640
concepts and then finally eventually

22
00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:10,400
getting into more abstract stuff like

23
00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:13,200
what is real

24
00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:15,119
so give us a listen amazing thank you so

25
00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:18,320
much i'm i'm very much looking forward

26
00:01:15,119 --> 00:01:19,040
to this episode and you guys are gonna

27
00:01:18,320 --> 00:01:21,840
be

28
00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:23,360
exceptionally qualified for today's

29
00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:26,080
weird-ish

30
00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:28,880
topic based on what you just described

31
00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:30,880
uh today's topic on that note is

32
00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:33,200
motion so i'm going to open the floor

33
00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:34,240
and say what is that

34
00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:35,759
notion

35
00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:38,880
if your pardon the

36
00:01:35,759 --> 00:01:40,400
notion of the motion the last minute pun

37
00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:42,079
yeah that jumped into my head and for a

38
00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:44,159
minute i was like should i say that is

39
00:01:42,079 --> 00:01:45,920
that funny or is that lame and you know

40
00:01:44,159 --> 00:01:47,439
i took a gambit uh

41
00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:50,720
steer into the skin

42
00:01:47,439 --> 00:01:51,759
so what does that mean to you in the dnd

43
00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:53,119
framework

44
00:01:51,759 --> 00:01:55,360
if somebody else wants to go first

45
00:01:53,119 --> 00:01:58,479
because my brain immediately went to art

46
00:01:55,360 --> 00:02:00,320
because um my day job is being a comic

47
00:01:58,479 --> 00:02:02,159
artist so motion

48
00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:04,560
is a very different implication for me

49
00:02:02,159 --> 00:02:06,479
in that respect

50
00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:08,720
yeah so i think there are several

51
00:02:06,479 --> 00:02:11,120
different ways you can look at motion uh

52
00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:13,200
in a ttrpg

53
00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,879
mindset there's you know moving around

54
00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:17,120
the board in any kind of game that

55
00:02:14,879 --> 00:02:19,520
embraces any style of tactics but

56
00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:21,599
there's also you know moving the story

57
00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:23,840
or the plot forward

58
00:02:21,599 --> 00:02:24,640
which can make for some some interesting

59
00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,319
or

60
00:02:24,640 --> 00:02:29,120
difficult moments depending on the group

61
00:02:26,319 --> 00:02:29,120
that you have with you

62
00:02:29,599 --> 00:02:34,160
yeah one one thing

63
00:02:31,920 --> 00:02:36,319
that i thought was very very interesting

64
00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:38,319
in my

65
00:02:36,319 --> 00:02:40,160
research for today's

66
00:02:38,319 --> 00:02:42,959
topic and we will loop back around to

67
00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:44,480
kelsey because i am not very much not an

68
00:02:42,959 --> 00:02:46,000
artist so i'm very interested to see

69
00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:49,239
what you have to say on that topic there

70
00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:49,239
but um

71
00:02:50,239 --> 00:02:55,200
um so so the webster's dictionary

72
00:02:52,720 --> 00:02:58,239
defines motion uh as

73
00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:59,680
the process of moving or being moved

74
00:02:58,239 --> 00:03:00,560
which i think

75
00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,879
when i

76
00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:06,560
apply that to a ttrpg

77
00:03:02,879 --> 00:03:08,560
setting it immediately rings not alarm

78
00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:10,800
bells in my head but it is really

79
00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:12,959
triggering my my synapses from a dm's

80
00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,000
perspective in terms of like

81
00:03:12,959 --> 00:03:16,080
how to

82
00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:18,239
essentially put things in motion when

83
00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:22,800
you are inherently

84
00:03:18,239 --> 00:03:24,959
not in control of that motion as a dm so

85
00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:27,519
with that in mind what do you got what

86
00:03:24,959 --> 00:03:29,360
are your guys's take on that oh that is

87
00:03:27,519 --> 00:03:30,879
a good question hey

88
00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:33,599
if you don't mind me hopping in here

89
00:03:30,879 --> 00:03:36,319
first i

90
00:03:33,599 --> 00:03:39,599
really enjoy as a gm

91
00:03:36,319 --> 00:03:43,840
taking my players and forcing situations

92
00:03:39,599 --> 00:03:46,080
in their uh immediate vicinity right so

93
00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:48,879
we'll just take a true life stance on

94
00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:50,560
this real quick and we'll say

95
00:03:48,879 --> 00:03:52,640
if you're driving a car

96
00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:55,360
and you pull up and you

97
00:03:52,640 --> 00:03:57,120
legally stop at a light or a sign or

98
00:03:55,360 --> 00:04:00,319
you're going the speed limit

99
00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:02,159
and somebody else hits your car

100
00:04:00,319 --> 00:04:04,080
you did everything right and something

101
00:04:02,159 --> 00:04:06,640
still happened to you something still

102
00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:09,519
exerted itself onto you right

103
00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:12,799
so as a gm i think that it is well

104
00:04:09,519 --> 00:04:12,799
within our rights to

105
00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:19,919
tastefully uh impose certain things onto

106
00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:21,759
or around our players in order to

107
00:04:19,919 --> 00:04:23,040
push them towards a certain direction or

108
00:04:21,759 --> 00:04:24,880
push them towards the direction of the

109
00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:25,919
plot in this case

110
00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:29,440
so

111
00:04:25,919 --> 00:04:31,600
if your players walk into a new town

112
00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:33,280
and there's a person being harassed on

113
00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:34,479
the sidewalk there are a couple of

114
00:04:33,280 --> 00:04:36,320
different things that you can do about

115
00:04:34,479 --> 00:04:37,840
that either they are compelled to go

116
00:04:36,320 --> 00:04:40,160
help that person because this is

117
00:04:37,840 --> 00:04:42,639
happening in their vicinity or if they

118
00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:44,479
don't help that person then

119
00:04:42,639 --> 00:04:46,800
they could get a negative reputation

120
00:04:44,479 --> 00:04:48,000
among certain people in the town or and

121
00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:50,000
there's a lot of different directions

122
00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,040
you can go with that but no matter what

123
00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:53,040
you're

124
00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:55,280
just one marble kind of starting this

125
00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:57,280
whole thread of possible scenarios just

126
00:04:55,280 --> 00:04:58,479
by putting that one thing in their range

127
00:04:57,280 --> 00:05:01,759
of vision

128
00:04:58,479 --> 00:05:04,400
so i think as a as a gm when you're

129
00:05:01,759 --> 00:05:06,560
causing the party to move

130
00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:08,560
it needs to be a little bit more on that

131
00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:10,479
subtle end because you can't be a bull

132
00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:13,199
in a china shop about it otherwise it's

133
00:05:10,479 --> 00:05:14,720
not really a game anymore it's just

134
00:05:13,199 --> 00:05:16,560
you're you're forcing them to be

135
00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:18,720
characters in your story

136
00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:20,720
but you can definitely

137
00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,320
just kind of very gently push them in a

138
00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:24,960
certain direction and a lot of times

139
00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:26,720
players have this um

140
00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:29,840
especially in d d where the whole point

141
00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:31,680
is to be like this fantasy epic hero

142
00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:34,720
the players have this kind of

143
00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:37,039
preconceived notion of heroism about

144
00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:40,400
them so they're more likely to go and do

145
00:05:37,039 --> 00:05:42,560
the heroic thing which kind of helps you

146
00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:43,440
adjust what you're going to throw their

147
00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:45,520
way

148
00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:47,520
oh yeah absolutely

149
00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:49,600
that when you said uh doing something

150
00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:53,600
extreme like a bowl in a china shop my

151
00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:55,440
first reaction was um there was one gm

152
00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:57,360
who recommended hey do you need to get

153
00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:59,280
your plot moving steal something from

154
00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:01,680
the party and i'm like well that's a way

155
00:05:59,280 --> 00:06:04,160
to do it

156
00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:06,400
i'm not sure that that's how i would do

157
00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:09,280
it but it is certainly a way if you are

158
00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:11,520
stuck on how to get the party moving or

159
00:06:09,280 --> 00:06:13,120
going in a particular direction just

160
00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:14,720
have an npc

161
00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:16,960
steal something from the party and then

162
00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:19,600
the party has to try and find it that's

163
00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:22,000
not necessarily something that i like

164
00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:23,199
making my players do

165
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:25,680
a lot of

166
00:06:23,199 --> 00:06:27,680
the motion in the campaign that i'm

167
00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:30,400
currently running is pretty dependent on

168
00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:32,000
the players but the players are pretty

169
00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:32,960
active agents

170
00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:34,639
like

171
00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:36,400
maybe they're not like super duper

172
00:06:34,639 --> 00:06:38,800
heroic okay maybe one of them is super

173
00:06:36,400 --> 00:06:40,479
duper hero like it's the tiefling bard

174
00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:42,240
is the one that's like i'm going to be

175
00:06:40,479 --> 00:06:43,840
friendly and i'm going to help everybody

176
00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:46,400
and i'm going to be friends with

177
00:06:43,840 --> 00:06:48,800
everyone and i'm like okay so you are

178
00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:51,919
going to be the active agent so i'm

179
00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:52,800
going to throw all kinds of stuff

180
00:06:51,919 --> 00:06:55,199
that

181
00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:57,280
might upset you

182
00:06:55,199 --> 00:06:59,440
but that's also just like the challenge

183
00:06:57,280 --> 00:07:01,039
as a dm is like knowing the

184
00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:04,240
personalities of your players and being

185
00:07:01,039 --> 00:07:05,840
like okay so this player is playing a

186
00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:09,520
character that's

187
00:07:05,840 --> 00:07:13,120
kind of quiet but also quietly driven in

188
00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:16,160
their quest to search for something so

189
00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:18,080
let's pepper in a few things like maybe

190
00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:20,240
they'll notice in a subtle way and then

191
00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:22,400
as soon as they notice it have them

192
00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:24,080
react to it and there's

193
00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,120
there's been times in other campaigns

194
00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:27,680
where

195
00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:29,440
i've had other quiet players

196
00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:31,840
who will just sit there and they'll let

197
00:07:29,440 --> 00:07:34,240
the loud characters do their loud thing

198
00:07:31,840 --> 00:07:35,360
and then i'll pepper in a little like

199
00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:37,759
sprinkle

200
00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:40,639
of their backstory somewhere and then

201
00:07:37,759 --> 00:07:42,880
that quiet player suddenly becomes very

202
00:07:40,639 --> 00:07:45,440
loud and they're just like i'll be right

203
00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:48,080
back and then they'd leave and i'm like

204
00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,650
oh this is interesting so that's emotion

205
00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:50,720
right there

206
00:07:48,650 --> 00:07:51,440
[Laughter]

207
00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,039
and

208
00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:54,720
if you don't mind me tagging back in

209
00:07:53,039 --> 00:07:55,599
before you come on joe

210
00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:56,639
sure

211
00:07:55,599 --> 00:07:58,240
i

212
00:07:56,639 --> 00:08:00,879
want to give it a little bit from the

213
00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:02,639
players perspective too because you know

214
00:08:00,879 --> 00:08:05,440
we we talk on our show all the time

215
00:08:02,639 --> 00:08:07,919
about gm's perspective and you know how

216
00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:10,319
to for lack of a better term manage your

217
00:08:07,919 --> 00:08:12,160
players into getting a result that is

218
00:08:10,319 --> 00:08:13,919
within the realm of what you want right

219
00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:15,520
oh yeah so

220
00:08:13,919 --> 00:08:18,000
as a player

221
00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:20,319
one of the ways that you can engage the

222
00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:22,000
rest of your party into motion

223
00:08:20,319 --> 00:08:24,479
is to

224
00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:27,039
kind of engage with your own backstory i

225
00:08:24,479 --> 00:08:29,919
guess is the best way to say it so you

226
00:08:27,039 --> 00:08:31,840
know things about yourself as a player

227
00:08:29,919 --> 00:08:33,200
that nobody else at the table is going

228
00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:36,080
to know

229
00:08:33,200 --> 00:08:37,279
so i played in a star wars game last

230
00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:39,360
night

231
00:08:37,279 --> 00:08:41,519
and one of the ways that i engaged with

232
00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:44,720
my own backstory with my own character

233
00:08:41,519 --> 00:08:47,120
was uh i'm a computer guy i'm a tech

234
00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:48,560
nerd you know i'm a mechanic

235
00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:49,360
and

236
00:08:48,560 --> 00:08:51,279
my

237
00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,240
comms got hacked

238
00:08:51,279 --> 00:08:54,240
right

239
00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:56,080
which was not a good thing but i was

240
00:08:54,240 --> 00:08:58,560
able to isolate it to just me so i was

241
00:08:56,080 --> 00:09:00,000
like okay this is damage control and

242
00:08:58,560 --> 00:09:01,760
when i got back to the party i figured

243
00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,720
out that one of them had stolen a droid

244
00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,640
from

245
00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,920
the enemy and i'm like there are so many

246
00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:08,160
things that they could have put in that

247
00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:11,440
droid that you did not know to check for

248
00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:13,120
and it caused some pretty mild conflict

249
00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:16,240
but it drove the story forward because

250
00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:19,360
it engaged everybody in that dialogue of

251
00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:21,279
what if there is something wrong here

252
00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:23,040
what if like there's there's a plant

253
00:09:21,279 --> 00:09:24,080
what if there's somebody who's turned

254
00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,680
their backs on us what if there's

255
00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:27,360
somebody who's betrayed us and just

256
00:09:25,680 --> 00:09:29,440
because i was like oh

257
00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:30,880
i was able to isolate it to mind but i

258
00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:32,160
brought it to the party that there was

259
00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:35,519
an issue

260
00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:38,240
with my communicator with this droid and

261
00:09:35,519 --> 00:09:40,640
it was just a snowball effect of

262
00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:42,399
asking a question from the perspective

263
00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,560
of my own story

264
00:09:42,399 --> 00:09:45,519
and then engaging everybody else in that

265
00:09:44,560 --> 00:09:46,720
question

266
00:09:45,519 --> 00:09:48,640
yes

267
00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:50,160
i'm gonna put the hat on and play

268
00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:52,080
devil's advocate for a second i would

269
00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:54,800
even argue that

270
00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:56,640
personal development is still motion

271
00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:59,040
you may not be moving like the

272
00:09:56,640 --> 00:10:00,800
overarching plot forward but like

273
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:02,240
there are plenty of shows where you know

274
00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:05,680
we get a

275
00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:07,680
10 to 15 minute b plot or c plot where

276
00:10:05,680 --> 00:10:09,760
you know a character grows and and

277
00:10:07,680 --> 00:10:11,920
learns a lesson or

278
00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:13,839
becomes something more i mean a lot of

279
00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:16,240
zuko's stuff in avatar which we've

280
00:10:13,839 --> 00:10:19,120
referenced several times is like b and c

281
00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:20,800
plot at times but he ends up becoming

282
00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,000
you know a more credible part of the

283
00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:23,440
main group

284
00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,640
after that important character

285
00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:27,360
development

286
00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:28,399
yeah thank you for mentioning avatar

287
00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:29,920
because

288
00:10:28,399 --> 00:10:32,560
it's amazing

289
00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:34,399
and since eco especially is fantastic so

290
00:10:32,560 --> 00:10:37,440
no i it's very interesting when you put

291
00:10:34,399 --> 00:10:39,279
you know use that comparison i've never

292
00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,800
thought about it in that way before but

293
00:10:39,279 --> 00:10:42,000
it is true with that as you said like

294
00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:44,480
the b and the c

295
00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:46,399
stories but then eventually

296
00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:47,760
like he's a fan favorite for every

297
00:10:46,399 --> 00:10:48,720
reason right

298
00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:50,480
yeah

299
00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:52,720
and also throwing that up and throwing

300
00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:54,480
this out here um my roommate and i have

301
00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:56,959
actually been watching the original

302
00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,800
cowboy bebop on netflix

303
00:10:56,959 --> 00:10:59,519
not the live-action remake the original

304
00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:02,240
one

305
00:10:59,519 --> 00:11:06,399
and that show is nothing but

306
00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:07,760
b plots and c plots and just characters

307
00:11:06,399 --> 00:11:08,560
doing their thing

308
00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:10,640
so

309
00:11:08,560 --> 00:11:13,839
if you want like a pretty good example

310
00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:16,720
of that sort of thing just it's only 26

311
00:11:13,839 --> 00:11:18,560
episodes long it's not that long

312
00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:20,079
and actually cowboy bebop is a great

313
00:11:18,560 --> 00:11:21,680
thing to bring up here because when

314
00:11:20,079 --> 00:11:23,200
we're talking about

315
00:11:21,680 --> 00:11:24,720
motion especially in a long-term

316
00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:26,720
campaign

317
00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:28,560
like dan brought up before we started

318
00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:29,519
recording that he's in a long-term dnd

319
00:11:28,560 --> 00:11:32,000
campaign

320
00:11:29,519 --> 00:11:34,160
i am as well that's been going on for

321
00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:36,880
about a year and a half now

322
00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:38,079
and well congratulations oh thank you

323
00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:39,279
very much

324
00:11:38,079 --> 00:11:40,800
um

325
00:11:39,279 --> 00:11:42,800
one of the ways that i've kept that

326
00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:45,440
interesting is by

327
00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:47,920
engaging those b and c plots and making

328
00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:49,519
those the main threads of the story

329
00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:52,480
until

330
00:11:49,519 --> 00:11:53,519
the actual story has time to mature

331
00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:54,560
right

332
00:11:53,519 --> 00:11:57,600
so

333
00:11:54,560 --> 00:11:59,519
in cowboy be pop the main story is

334
00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:01,360
pretty much exclusively told through

335
00:11:59,519 --> 00:12:02,560
flashback until the last three or four

336
00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:04,000
episodes

337
00:12:02,560 --> 00:12:06,079
and it's such an interesting

338
00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:07,839
storytelling mechanic because you get to

339
00:12:06,079 --> 00:12:10,240
focus so much on the characters and

340
00:12:07,839 --> 00:12:12,959
their development and how they grow

341
00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:16,079
towards the inevitable climax

342
00:12:12,959 --> 00:12:18,160
without ever really touching on the main

343
00:12:16,079 --> 00:12:20,639
flow of the story

344
00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:22,560
as it stands and it has that time to

345
00:12:20,639 --> 00:12:24,399
mature and you ask all of these

346
00:12:22,560 --> 00:12:27,120
questions in the back of your mind until

347
00:12:24,399 --> 00:12:29,279
finally they're all answered in like a

348
00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:31,680
rush and it's so interesting it's one of

349
00:12:29,279 --> 00:12:34,160
the reasons cowboy bebop is one of if

350
00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:37,200
not the greatest anime ever made uh at

351
00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:39,839
least in its genre yes so

352
00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:42,480
don't be afraid as a storyteller or even

353
00:12:39,839 --> 00:12:44,959
as a player to engage with those b and c

354
00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:47,920
plots your main story does not need to

355
00:12:44,959 --> 00:12:50,880
be your main story for the entire run of

356
00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:54,079
your campaign you can engage with that

357
00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:57,519
when it's convenient or when it makes

358
00:12:54,079 --> 00:12:59,519
sense without losing momentum

359
00:12:57,519 --> 00:13:01,680
yep and sometimes you won't even know

360
00:12:59,519 --> 00:13:04,880
what your a plot is until you get all of

361
00:13:01,680 --> 00:13:07,200
your player characters together

362
00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:10,000
and then you have your first session or

363
00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:12,160
your session zero and you actually

364
00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:14,480
bounce around ideas and then

365
00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:17,440
an a plot solidifies i've had that

366
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:18,959
happen before too absolutely

367
00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:20,880
yeah there's

368
00:13:18,959 --> 00:13:22,240
i i like this train of thought because

369
00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:23,920
there is often

370
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:25,519
it's a double-edged sword now i'm saying

371
00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:27,200
it out loud because i wanted to talk

372
00:13:25,519 --> 00:13:29,760
about earlier on how

373
00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:32,800
as i opened this questioning with you

374
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:35,040
know as a gm one of your roles in a way

375
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:37,200
is to make sure or to

376
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:39,040
ensure there's some kind of forward

377
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,560
momentum

378
00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,920
but i also and

379
00:13:40,560 --> 00:13:43,279
the reason why that's a bit of a taboo

380
00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,959
subject is because it's like lack of

381
00:13:43,279 --> 00:13:46,320
agency and railroading and you go down

382
00:13:44,959 --> 00:13:48,560
that kind of

383
00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:50,320
road of discussion but then on the same

384
00:13:48,560 --> 00:13:52,480
on the other side of the coin it's you

385
00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:54,480
have the players as well who are just as

386
00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:55,680
that's the ironic thing right

387
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,720
in a way that

388
00:13:55,680 --> 00:14:01,440
their agency is in their own hands

389
00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:03,040
to pull on those those b and c plots oh

390
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,279
yeah to put on the you know those

391
00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:06,720
backstory threads to bring them to the

392
00:14:05,279 --> 00:14:07,760
forefront and that's

393
00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:09,680
you know any

394
00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:12,240
you know a dm should be willing to

395
00:14:09,680 --> 00:14:13,839
accommodate that and making that the

396
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:15,360
prime focus of that session or however

397
00:14:13,839 --> 00:14:17,519
many sessions it might be

398
00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:20,399
absolutely and there's a very big

399
00:14:17,519 --> 00:14:23,199
difference between say

400
00:14:20,399 --> 00:14:25,360
writing a story for a

401
00:14:23,199 --> 00:14:26,160
tabletop rpg

402
00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:29,120
that

403
00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:31,360
engages players versus

404
00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:33,519
writing a story that you adapt into a

405
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:35,920
novel or a comic or something because

406
00:14:33,519 --> 00:14:38,800
that was an adjustment

407
00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:40,720
even a video game like you uh

408
00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:43,360
you have a lot of stuff where and that's

409
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:44,639
something you run into with with gm who

410
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,639
have players complaining about lack of

411
00:14:44,639 --> 00:14:47,760
agency it's like oh well you know we're

412
00:14:46,639 --> 00:14:49,360
going to go over there we don't really

413
00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:50,720
want to engage with that oh well you

414
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,000
can't go over there

415
00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:53,279
because

416
00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:54,480
x y and z

417
00:14:53,279 --> 00:14:57,279
like i think

418
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:59,120
with hunters like events like you you

419
00:14:57,279 --> 00:15:01,120
toss the event out the event is the only

420
00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,199
scripted thing and then whatever the

421
00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:05,760
players do or how they respond to it is

422
00:15:03,199 --> 00:15:07,839
totally up to them

423
00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:09,920
yeah the event is going to happen no

424
00:15:07,839 --> 00:15:12,000
matter what but the players are in full

425
00:15:09,920 --> 00:15:14,240
and complete control over how they

426
00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,399
engage in the moment and how they react

427
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:19,199
afterward they don't necessarily have to

428
00:15:16,399 --> 00:15:21,680
follow up on that event in in any way

429
00:15:19,199 --> 00:15:23,120
but typically speaking again leaning on

430
00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:25,839
that heroic

431
00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:27,199
preconception of themselves that these

432
00:15:25,839 --> 00:15:28,959
characters have

433
00:15:27,199 --> 00:15:30,399
typically they're going to engage with

434
00:15:28,959 --> 00:15:32,959
one of these

435
00:15:30,399 --> 00:15:34,399
area altering events in a in a heroic

436
00:15:32,959 --> 00:15:35,920
way

437
00:15:34,399 --> 00:15:37,519
so there are certain things that you can

438
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:39,759
predict but there are definitely things

439
00:15:37,519 --> 00:15:41,680
that are going to catch you out of left

440
00:15:39,759 --> 00:15:42,780
field because if there's like an

441
00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,000
invasion from

442
00:15:42,780 --> 00:15:44,959
[Music]

443
00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:47,360
i don't know

444
00:15:44,959 --> 00:15:50,000
let's just use a dnd classic and say an

445
00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:51,519
orcish tribe invades a small town that

446
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:53,120
you're in

447
00:15:51,519 --> 00:15:55,440
typically speaking

448
00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:56,480
a d d party is going to stand up against

449
00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,720
this

450
00:15:56,480 --> 00:16:00,560
these tribesmen and try to save people

451
00:15:58,720 --> 00:16:01,680
right or try to drive them out

452
00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:04,160
completely

453
00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:05,680
typically yes yes yeah

454
00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:07,519
every now and again you're going to get

455
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,040
that party that's like

456
00:16:07,519 --> 00:16:11,360
i don't know man i've always thought

457
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:14,480
orcs were pretty cool and then be like

458
00:16:11,360 --> 00:16:16,079
hey let's help these boys out

459
00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,759
and then you'll have parties like mine

460
00:16:16,079 --> 00:16:19,440
where i played a half work druid who

461
00:16:17,759 --> 00:16:21,519
just came up to the orcs and was like

462
00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:24,000
hey my dudes how you doing what's going

463
00:16:21,519 --> 00:16:26,320
on why are you down here causing a fuss

464
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,320
man

465
00:16:27,759 --> 00:16:30,880
because that actually happened once in a

466
00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,880
session

467
00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:33,839
but that's i mean that's part of agency

468
00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:36,000
like that's

469
00:16:33,839 --> 00:16:38,079
that's an opportunity to move the story

470
00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,920
forward it may not be in uh

471
00:16:38,079 --> 00:16:40,800
let's knock out all the orcs and you

472
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:43,199
know

473
00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:46,320
kick him out of town but it is driving

474
00:16:43,199 --> 00:16:48,480
the story forward it is yeah absolutely

475
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:50,480
the story can drive forward regardless

476
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:52,240
of how it turns out like i mentioned

477
00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:53,839
this in a previous episode of the fourth

478
00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:56,000
leg which you can totally listen to by

479
00:16:53,839 --> 00:16:58,079
the way hinting twink wink but

480
00:16:56,000 --> 00:17:00,560
um that yeah shameless plug out of the

481
00:16:58,079 --> 00:17:02,800
way but in an episode i had mentioned

482
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:05,600
that there was a

483
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:07,120
segment where my player characters had

484
00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:10,079
gone into a world

485
00:17:07,120 --> 00:17:13,679
and a tiger came out of the woods and

486
00:17:10,079 --> 00:17:17,679
attacked them out of self-defense and

487
00:17:13,679 --> 00:17:19,839
i fully expected like a combat encounter

488
00:17:17,679 --> 00:17:20,720
and then the bard ruled really really

489
00:17:19,839 --> 00:17:22,640
high

490
00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:24,000
on her persuasion check and was like no

491
00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:26,240
no no we don't want to fight we don't

492
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:27,360
want to fight you we want to be friends

493
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:29,760
and

494
00:17:27,360 --> 00:17:32,240
i being the dm i was like okay

495
00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:33,679
so i let's get into the tiger's head for

496
00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:36,000
a second what would the tiger do next

497
00:17:33,679 --> 00:17:38,880
and then i was like and then the tiger

498
00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,880
starts crying

499
00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:46,000
the situation changed from like a combat

500
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:48,720
encounter to they befriended the tiger

501
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:51,520
and the tiger led the party to his

502
00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:53,360
secret hideout and that can be emotion

503
00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:55,520
in its own way because it's like hey

504
00:17:53,360 --> 00:17:57,360
instead of having the players like do

505
00:17:55,520 --> 00:17:59,200
investigation checks to try to find this

506
00:17:57,360 --> 00:18:03,360
hideout maybe they just befriend the

507
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:06,160
tiger and persuade the tiger to lead him

508
00:18:03,360 --> 00:18:08,400
where it is that he goes

509
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,679
so you mentioned in during that

510
00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:11,919
discussion there

511
00:18:09,679 --> 00:18:14,960
two kinds of parties

512
00:18:11,919 --> 00:18:16,799
uh regarding the invasion of this town

513
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,640
uh the ones that are you know quote

514
00:18:16,799 --> 00:18:20,799
unquote typically heroic and you know

515
00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:23,200
rally to the defense of the town and you

516
00:18:20,799 --> 00:18:25,039
know welcome to cheers and praise and

517
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:27,280
the townsfolk and then you have the ones

518
00:18:25,039 --> 00:18:28,640
that are like no no let's let's see what

519
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:30,559
it is from the other side let's see if

520
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:32,720
we can end this

521
00:18:30,559 --> 00:18:33,760
in a compromise or whatever it may be

522
00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:36,799
now

523
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:38,480
or you might have a party party c in

524
00:18:36,799 --> 00:18:40,160
this hypothetical situation which

525
00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:43,039
happens to be very similar to mine in

526
00:18:40,160 --> 00:18:45,360
some cases where

527
00:18:43,039 --> 00:18:47,600
they abstain and

528
00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:49,840
go well not my problem i don't it's not

529
00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:52,720
my town it's not my friends and

530
00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:54,640
basically have zero emotion in that

531
00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:56,559
given instance so

532
00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:57,440
this is a this is an open question then

533
00:18:56,559 --> 00:18:59,360
for you

534
00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:01,679
half for the show and half for my own

535
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:03,760
benefit

536
00:19:01,679 --> 00:19:06,320
on what you know how do you deal with

537
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:08,720
that those situations when

538
00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:10,799
the party or

539
00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:12,960
particularly charismatic player

540
00:19:10,799 --> 00:19:15,200
characters or indeed players

541
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:17,760
have persuaded the motion of the party

542
00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,880
to essentially stop for whatever reason

543
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,640
maybe

544
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:23,039
nine times out of ten it'll be benign

545
00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:25,919
you know they're unaware that

546
00:19:23,039 --> 00:19:27,840
this is going to hamper storytelling but

547
00:19:25,919 --> 00:19:30,080
how do you how do you

548
00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:33,120
work with that situation

549
00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:35,360
i think uh and again i think i know that

550
00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:37,440
it's not uh it's not motion in the the

551
00:19:35,360 --> 00:19:38,720
direction of the conflict that you've

552
00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,720
set up

553
00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:43,280
but uh again that's still the still

554
00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:44,960
valid motion away from something like

555
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:46,640
there are times where the party is going

556
00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:48,400
to see a conflict and be like oh no

557
00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:50,080
we're way out class or we don't want to

558
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:52,000
deal with xyz because it's going to

559
00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:54,080
cause us a bunch of problems like and

560
00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:56,240
they run away like

561
00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:57,520
it sucks but it's part of the story i

562
00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:59,120
mean uh

563
00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:01,120
take uh

564
00:19:59,120 --> 00:20:02,640
last jedi i think

565
00:20:01,120 --> 00:20:04,559
where uh

566
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:06,559
they're going to to get this guy off

567
00:20:04,559 --> 00:20:08,400
this plane this gambler off this planet

568
00:20:06,559 --> 00:20:10,000
and finn's like yeah

569
00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,679
i don't think i'm gonna come back like

570
00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:13,840
i'm i'm good

571
00:20:11,679 --> 00:20:15,600
like he's uh he's that coward that

572
00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,200
coward player who's like yeah i don't

573
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:19,039
really know and that's that's still an

574
00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,120
opportunity for that growth

575
00:20:19,039 --> 00:20:22,559
um now there may be some consequences

576
00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:24,240
within the game world because they

577
00:20:22,559 --> 00:20:26,640
didn't interfere

578
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:28,080
uh but i mean at the end of the day

579
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,280
again still character growth still

580
00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:32,320
motion

581
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:35,280
yeah so there was actually a situation

582
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:38,159
in another campaign that i had run it

583
00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:40,960
didn't last super duper long because

584
00:20:38,159 --> 00:20:43,039
at one point we got a guest player in

585
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:44,640
who proved to be a problem and it and

586
00:20:43,039 --> 00:20:46,320
the group just kind of fell apart after

587
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:49,039
that but before

588
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:51,200
that problem character came in

589
00:20:49,039 --> 00:20:54,000
the party that i had

590
00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:55,760
i started up the campaign and i was

591
00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:58,320
actually revisiting

592
00:20:55,760 --> 00:21:00,880
a campaign that i had run

593
00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:02,320
two years prior because i wanted to

594
00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:04,080
polish up the world a little bit and

595
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,159
possibly make it into a module and i was

596
00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:07,919
like oh cool a new set of player

597
00:21:06,159 --> 00:21:09,200
characters let's go ahead and have them

598
00:21:07,919 --> 00:21:10,400
interact with this world and see what

599
00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:11,760
happens next

600
00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:15,600
and

601
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:18,960
there were very obvious like plot

602
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:21,679
arrows pointing in specific directions

603
00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:24,000
and the players were not jumping on any

604
00:21:21,679 --> 00:21:25,200
of the hooks and so i was like okay

605
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:28,080
time

606
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:30,799
to initiate plan b which was

607
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:32,080
tapping into one of the player

608
00:21:30,799 --> 00:21:34,640
characters

609
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:37,360
background story hooks and being like ah

610
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:40,480
okay so this player character

611
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:43,679
has a kind of revenge boner going on and

612
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:45,440
they spot somebody who is part of the

613
00:21:43,679 --> 00:21:46,320
cavalcade of people who took down his

614
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:47,600
people

615
00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,520
so

616
00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:52,240
i'm gonna have this uh

617
00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:54,000
bad guy antagonist from this guy's

618
00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:55,679
background just

619
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:58,080
going by

620
00:21:55,679 --> 00:22:00,960
just out the edge of his vision and then

621
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:03,440
as soon as that guy saw that the plot

622
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:08,000
started happening

623
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:10,480
i like to imagine rpg plots as

624
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:13,360
just this big grassy hill

625
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:15,919
right and this is probably just a deeply

626
00:22:13,360 --> 00:22:19,039
locked memory for me from my childhood

627
00:22:15,919 --> 00:22:21,360
so bear with me for a minute okay but

628
00:22:19,039 --> 00:22:24,480
when you roll a rock down a hill

629
00:22:21,360 --> 00:22:25,600
it's inevitably going to stop somewhere

630
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,760
right

631
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,520
yeah that's not always going to be in a

632
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:31,280
straight line it's not always going to

633
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:33,440
be where you expect sometimes there are

634
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,240
pebbles along the path sometimes there

635
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:36,400
are

636
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:38,000
tiny bumps sometimes they're just

637
00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,840
heavier clumps of grass that are going

638
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:41,840
to divert that rock that you're rolling

639
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:44,000
down the hill to somewhere that you

640
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:46,880
didn't expect

641
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:48,720
but no matter what the rock is going to

642
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:52,880
keep going downhill

643
00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:55,840
it's just the nature of iraq right yeah

644
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,990
so i say all that to say that

645
00:22:55,840 --> 00:23:00,880
that was a sentence that made sense

646
00:22:57,990 --> 00:23:04,159
[Laughter]

647
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:05,840
i say all that because your party is is

648
00:23:04,159 --> 00:23:07,200
the rock

649
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,559
sometimes they're gonna hit a pebble

650
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:10,480
sometimes they're going to hit a snag

651
00:23:08,559 --> 00:23:11,600
but they're always going to keep moving

652
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:14,720
forward

653
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:15,840
as long as there's still more hill

654
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:16,799
right

655
00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:19,280
so

656
00:23:16,799 --> 00:23:21,280
let's take the orcs attacking that

657
00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:24,240
village for example

658
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:25,760
the party chooses to abstain from

659
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:28,159
engaging with the orcs they don't try

660
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,120
diplomacy they don't join them and they

661
00:23:28,159 --> 00:23:31,919
don't

662
00:23:29,120 --> 00:23:34,720
fight against them right which are

663
00:23:31,919 --> 00:23:37,440
the three main options right good

664
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:39,679
evil yeah the three immediate video game

665
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:41,440
options yeah exactly

666
00:23:39,679 --> 00:23:43,840
they choose to abstain and they just

667
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:45,039
stay in their their rooms in the inn

668
00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:46,799
well there are a couple of things that

669
00:23:45,039 --> 00:23:48,080
you can do there maybe the orcs aren't

670
00:23:46,799 --> 00:23:50,640
looking to capture the town they're

671
00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:52,960
looking to burn it to the ground now

672
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:54,240
right so you change your plan up really

673
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,320
quick and

674
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:58,799
now there's a fire in the inn you have

675
00:23:56,320 --> 00:24:00,000
to do something or you will burn with it

676
00:23:58,799 --> 00:24:01,120
right

677
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:02,400
or

678
00:24:01,120 --> 00:24:04,480
they don't burn the end down they

679
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:07,200
capture the town and now

680
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:10,960
you can't leave unless you fight sneak

681
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:14,720
away or dialogue with these orcs

682
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:16,000
and it's a full town of this orc tribe

683
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,120
so it's going to be really tough to

684
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,440
sneak away

685
00:24:17,120 --> 00:24:22,159
what do you do how are you engaging you

686
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:24,799
cannot exist the way that you have been

687
00:24:22,159 --> 00:24:25,840
there are consequences to neutrality

688
00:24:24,799 --> 00:24:28,960
in the real world and there are

689
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:30,320
consequences to neutrality in an rpg

690
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,720
game

691
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,840
the rock rolls down the hill

692
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:36,799
so

693
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:39,600
if i can uh sum it up at all it's as a

694
00:24:36,799 --> 00:24:41,760
gm don't feel bad for

695
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,000
doling out consequences to the player's

696
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:46,480
actions absolutely not

697
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,760
don't make them excessive either don't

698
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,760
make it like

699
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:51,520
oh you choose not to do anything okay

700
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:52,799
well roll up new characters because

701
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:55,360
there's no way you're gonna survive if

702
00:24:52,799 --> 00:24:56,159
you don't act or anything like that

703
00:24:55,360 --> 00:24:59,360
just

704
00:24:56,159 --> 00:25:01,840
change the scenario to encourage them to

705
00:24:59,360 --> 00:25:03,440
act because they don't have to run away

706
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:05,840
from a burning in

707
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:07,520
but it definitely is more positive if

708
00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:09,679
they do

709
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:11,279
yep it's a very good uh carrot on the

710
00:25:09,679 --> 00:25:14,320
end of the stick there is

711
00:25:11,279 --> 00:25:16,240
not being in a burning in it's a classic

712
00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:18,640
motivational

713
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:21,520
tactic there

714
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:24,240
i do my best

715
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:26,799
now thank you for bringing in that rock

716
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,480
metaphor because as part of my other

717
00:25:26,799 --> 00:25:30,720
research i was doing

718
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:33,840
that works really well because of

719
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:35,840
newton's first law of motion to sound

720
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:38,320
intelligent in their

721
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:40,080
ttr this is a podcast called thinking

722
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:41,520
critically indeed

723
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,720
it's about time i started to live up to

724
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,720
that name right that was

725
00:25:45,279 --> 00:25:48,799
i spent all that create that big the

726
00:25:47,279 --> 00:25:50,080
galaxy brain thinking right at the

727
00:25:48,799 --> 00:25:52,080
beginning of the show when i came up

728
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:54,159
with a name and then that was it

729
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:57,039
i was

730
00:25:54,159 --> 00:25:58,559
i was spent um but no the first law

731
00:25:57,039 --> 00:25:59,919
states that an object in motion tends to

732
00:25:58,559 --> 00:26:01,840
stay in motion

733
00:25:59,919 --> 00:26:03,360
unless an external force act to plan it

734
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,880
but that works very well with that

735
00:26:03,360 --> 00:26:06,559
metaphor of that rock falling down the

736
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,760
hill like as you said like it's just

737
00:26:06,559 --> 00:26:09,760
gonna keep

738
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:11,760
rolling because you already sat at the

739
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:14,400
table playing the game so

740
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:16,159
i guess what i'm getting at is

741
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,720
sometimes there's a lot of

742
00:26:16,159 --> 00:26:21,760
pressure on gms and

743
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:24,880
mainly self-imposed to be like this

744
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:27,600
bastion of creativity and this fountain

745
00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:29,360
of agency and all these other

746
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,440
stupid terms that i'm making up when in

747
00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:34,000
reality like everything's there working

748
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:36,320
already for you in a way like that there

749
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,919
are a lot of things that are already

750
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,799
happening and sometimes it's easy to get

751
00:26:37,919 --> 00:26:40,000
you know

752
00:26:38,799 --> 00:26:41,600
lost in the woods you know you can't see

753
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,039
the wood for the trees kind of thing

754
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:45,200
when yeah

755
00:26:43,039 --> 00:26:47,679
it can be quite simple a solution as

756
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:49,039
you've just said hunter in terms of like

757
00:26:47,679 --> 00:26:49,350
okay well now they're burning it's the

758
00:26:49,039 --> 00:26:50,880
ground

759
00:26:49,350 --> 00:26:52,480
[Laughter]

760
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:55,520
yeah

761
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:59,279
i i think this is a really good time to

762
00:26:55,520 --> 00:27:00,240
bring in a a staple of gm conversations

763
00:26:59,279 --> 00:27:02,159
which is

764
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,440
collaborative storytelling it's

765
00:27:02,159 --> 00:27:07,200
something that you're going to hear a

766
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:08,799
lot if you start discussing any tt rpg

767
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,520
but it's the idea that your players

768
00:27:08,799 --> 00:27:13,520
contribute to the story as well

769
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:16,159
so let's take a

770
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:18,240
i hate to bring up this show but uh

771
00:27:16,159 --> 00:27:21,240
let's take critical role for example

772
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,240
right

773
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:31,520
i have never heard of this critical role

774
00:27:28,559 --> 00:27:34,399
hunter what do you mean can you expect

775
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,399
some little show

776
00:27:35,120 --> 00:27:38,320
then i don't know maybe they sell them

777
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,080
on amazon or something you can buy a

778
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:42,080
critical role somewhere

779
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,600
um

780
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:46,720
but uh we

781
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:49,760
as gm's a lot of people got their start

782
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:52,159
in this hobby via watching matt mercer

783
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:54,799
work right yeah and i don't think that's

784
00:27:52,159 --> 00:27:56,480
a bad thing i'm one of them you know i

785
00:27:54,799 --> 00:27:58,799
started watching critical role very very

786
00:27:56,480 --> 00:28:01,760
early on in campaign one and it inspired

787
00:27:58,799 --> 00:28:03,520
me to play in my first dnd game and the

788
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:06,080
rock rolled down the hill and here i am

789
00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:08,480
making a podcast about it right yeah

790
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:10,880
that i mean same boat

791
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:14,240
critical role is not solely successful

792
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:17,840
because matt mercer is a good gm

793
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:20,159
matt mercer could in theory be the best

794
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:22,399
gm in the world but that is not what

795
00:28:20,159 --> 00:28:24,880
makes critical roles successful

796
00:28:22,399 --> 00:28:25,679
what makes critical role great

797
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,399
is

798
00:28:25,679 --> 00:28:31,039
the interplay between gm

799
00:28:28,399 --> 00:28:32,960
and players right

800
00:28:31,039 --> 00:28:35,919
matt mercer could probably make a

801
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:38,320
successful podcast with a group of

802
00:28:35,919 --> 00:28:40,399
normies right

803
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:43,679
but the fact that he's got such

804
00:28:40,399 --> 00:28:45,840
interactive and dynamic players

805
00:28:43,679 --> 00:28:47,679
takes critical role to the heights that

806
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:49,919
it is today because matt mercer would

807
00:28:47,679 --> 00:28:52,080
not be nearly as successful as a gm if

808
00:28:49,919 --> 00:28:54,399
he didn't have a group of players that

809
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:57,279
both fit his style and played well off

810
00:28:54,399 --> 00:28:58,720
of one another yeah critical role is a

811
00:28:57,279 --> 00:29:01,120
great example of collaborative

812
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:03,039
storytelling because every single player

813
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:06,159
contributes to the world

814
00:29:03,039 --> 00:29:08,720
just as much as the gm does yeah and

815
00:29:06,159 --> 00:29:10,640
that's actually something that a

816
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:13,039
youtuber who goes by the name the

817
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:15,039
dungeon coach talks about

818
00:29:13,039 --> 00:29:16,799
i actually highly recommend the dungeon

819
00:29:15,039 --> 00:29:19,760
coach if you

820
00:29:16,799 --> 00:29:21,840
like me really like doing home brew

821
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,840
for dungeons and dragons 5th edition

822
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:25,440
because that's almost exclusively what

823
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,840
he talks about he touches into other

824
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:30,000
systems as well but a lot of what he

825
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:32,320
talks about is hey i really don't like

826
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:33,840
this particular rule for d5e as it's

827
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,200
written how about we do a home brew to

828
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:37,440
patch it

829
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:40,559
and he actually talks about

830
00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:41,919
the critical role player effect uh

831
00:29:40,559 --> 00:29:44,000
because people have talked to death

832
00:29:41,919 --> 00:29:45,760
about the matt mercer effect but there

833
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:47,600
is a critical role player effect

834
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:50,399
happening as well and it's a lot of what

835
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:52,000
you've talked about and he talks about

836
00:29:50,399 --> 00:29:54,559
it more in depth in his video i highly

837
00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:57,520
recommend that you just watch that so it

838
00:29:54,559 --> 00:29:59,039
can be small things um so

839
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,480
like as a player to go back to the

840
00:29:59,039 --> 00:30:02,159
player perspective

841
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:04,320
i was playing in my star wars game we

842
00:30:02,159 --> 00:30:07,120
were doing a heist in a bar

843
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:09,200
i just made up three different drinks

844
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,880
alcoholic drinks so don't don't drink

845
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,410
any of these fake star wars drinks if

846
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:15,039
you're under 21 in america

847
00:30:12,410 --> 00:30:17,360
[Laughter]

848
00:30:15,039 --> 00:30:19,039
but uh you know i just made up three

849
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,880
drinks that

850
00:30:19,039 --> 00:30:24,320
added just a little bit of flair and

851
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:26,159
flavor to the world around us right

852
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,559
you can do little things like that be

853
00:30:26,159 --> 00:30:31,279
like oh uh we walk into this new town

854
00:30:28,559 --> 00:30:34,000
hey gm can there be a

855
00:30:31,279 --> 00:30:36,720
i don't know a tavern named the lovely

856
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,320
goose and it's all fashioned and goosed

857
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,919
down everything and it's really

858
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,120
expensive but the food tastes like

859
00:30:39,919 --> 00:30:43,360
garbage

860
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,960
right just this quirky little thing

861
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:47,120
where it looks really nice but it's

862
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:49,279
functionally defunct right

863
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:51,360
and as a gm invite your players to do

864
00:30:49,279 --> 00:30:54,000
that if you're like i don't really know

865
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:55,600
how else to describe this city hey

866
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:58,399
players

867
00:30:55,600 --> 00:31:00,799
what do you think this city looks like

868
00:30:58,399 --> 00:31:02,640
yeah tell me one thing that you see tell

869
00:31:00,799 --> 00:31:04,880
me one thing that you smell tell me one

870
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,919
thing that like brushes up against your

871
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,519
leg

872
00:31:05,919 --> 00:31:09,279
exactly and to bring this back to the

873
00:31:07,519 --> 00:31:10,559
overarching topic so we don't tangent

874
00:31:09,279 --> 00:31:12,399
too much

875
00:31:10,559 --> 00:31:13,840
that's going to encourage the players to

876
00:31:12,399 --> 00:31:16,240
interact with the things that they've

877
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:17,919
created in the town right so that's

878
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,519
going to keep them moving forward it

879
00:31:17,919 --> 00:31:22,960
gives you an easy place to put plot

880
00:31:19,519 --> 00:31:24,880
hooks or easy plot hooks to pull on uh

881
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:26,480
because players are more likely to

882
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,480
engage with things that they've created

883
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:31,120
that's why backstory arcs are so

884
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,120
effective

885
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:35,519
i'm gonna have to

886
00:31:32,559 --> 00:31:38,240
leverage that if only for the reason of

887
00:31:35,519 --> 00:31:40,399
taking some of that creative weight off

888
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:43,600
of my shoulders i'm a lazy bastard so i

889
00:31:40,399 --> 00:31:43,600
encourage you to do that

890
00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:46,960
i know well he

891
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,399
he won't strongly encourage you he'll

892
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:50,159
just kind of sit there like yeah you do

893
00:31:48,399 --> 00:31:52,960
that man

894
00:31:50,159 --> 00:31:55,279
way to go yeah no honestly this is a big

895
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:57,760
chunk of why i

896
00:31:55,279 --> 00:31:59,519
highly encourage my players to like give

897
00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:02,240
me as detailed the backstory as they

898
00:31:59,519 --> 00:32:04,559
want because they give me elements that

899
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:06,399
i can put into the world like oh my

900
00:32:04,559 --> 00:32:07,919
parents came from this town and this

901
00:32:06,399 --> 00:32:09,600
town is best known for this thing and

902
00:32:07,919 --> 00:32:11,039
i'm like great this is one less thing

903
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,320
for me to build

904
00:32:11,039 --> 00:32:14,640
from scratch

905
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:18,940
so like absolutely engage with the

906
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:22,249
players backstory to flesh out the world

907
00:32:18,940 --> 00:32:22,249
[Music]

908
00:32:24,810 --> 00:32:29,360
[Music]

909
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,600
okay so

910
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,559
i mean we've talked an awful lot now

911
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:35,840
about

912
00:32:32,559 --> 00:32:37,919
in-game motion so keeping things moving

913
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:39,440
i think is the nice simple

914
00:32:37,919 --> 00:32:41,200
definition that we've used for the first

915
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,880
half an hour of this show

916
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:45,600
uh before we move on though i had one

917
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:47,279
more thought around um

918
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,120
when that is inhibited for whatever

919
00:32:47,279 --> 00:32:53,440
reason so we've talked about

920
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:56,000
the the abstinent party uh

921
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:58,080
yeah we've talked about who's you know

922
00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:00,640
who's responsible for keeping things in

923
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,960
motion the one final thing that i had on

924
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:05,120
this kind of broad topic around kind of

925
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:08,640
in universe motion was

926
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:09,679
analysis paralysis that classic

927
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,919
that

928
00:33:09,679 --> 00:33:14,159
we've all had as human beings in our

929
00:33:11,919 --> 00:33:15,919
lives at one point or another something

930
00:33:14,159 --> 00:33:17,440
we could all relate to and i think when

931
00:33:15,919 --> 00:33:20,240
you get

932
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:21,840
however many players around a table

933
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,279
operating through a filter of their

934
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:25,039
characters

935
00:33:23,279 --> 00:33:26,240
you know inherently operating on less

936
00:33:25,039 --> 00:33:29,440
knowledge than perhaps they should have

937
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:31,519
at that time it is very very very easy

938
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:33,200
to fall into that trap doubly so when

939
00:33:31,519 --> 00:33:36,240
you have

940
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:37,679
players who are either hyper aware of

941
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:39,120
the other players and like don't want to

942
00:33:37,679 --> 00:33:40,880
step on any toes and don't want to be

943
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:43,200
seen as like

944
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:46,480
commandeering the situation

945
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:48,960
so it's just very easy to fall in to

946
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:50,960
that trap of like i'm the gm and look at

947
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,720
this smorgasbord i have laid out this

948
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:54,880
wonderful fantabulous world of all these

949
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:57,360
wonderful and wacky things you can do

950
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:59,440
have fun and the players go oh

951
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,880
don't know what to do where i don't want

952
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,320
to do that because that's there but i

953
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:03,679
can't go there because

954
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,000
this other character doesn't want to go

955
00:34:03,679 --> 00:34:07,600
there and it's it can very easily

956
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:09,359
devolve into

957
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,320
three hours of

958
00:34:09,359 --> 00:34:12,240
of like

959
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:13,760
zero motion other than

960
00:34:12,240 --> 00:34:14,639
so we should go

961
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:15,919
right

962
00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:19,280
and

963
00:34:15,919 --> 00:34:21,679
yeah yeah so yeah what what uh you know

964
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,639
how do you mitigate that how do we stop

965
00:34:21,679 --> 00:34:24,320
that

966
00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:26,159
the best solution is to stop i guess

967
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,520
that point happening when it happens in

968
00:34:26,159 --> 00:34:29,359
a negative way of course there are

969
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:31,440
probably instances when it can be seen

970
00:34:29,359 --> 00:34:32,879
in a positive way but let's

971
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,800
have a good faith argument here and

972
00:34:32,879 --> 00:34:37,520
assume that the analysis of paralysis is

973
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:38,879
a negative instance in this case how can

974
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,040
we stop it from happening it's probably

975
00:34:38,879 --> 00:34:42,720
the best question to ask

976
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:43,919
i have a lot of thoughts on this okay

977
00:34:42,720 --> 00:34:45,760
okay good

978
00:34:43,919 --> 00:34:48,639
as somebody and somebody who is

979
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:51,119
neurodivergent who also writes stories a

980
00:34:48,639 --> 00:34:53,200
lot and who is overwhelmed by analysis

981
00:34:51,119 --> 00:34:56,639
paralysis a lot of the time

982
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:58,079
one of the easy ways to mitigate that

983
00:34:56,639 --> 00:34:59,920
is um

984
00:34:58,079 --> 00:35:01,359
and i'm just going to tangent a little

985
00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:02,800
bit and just talk about writer's block

986
00:35:01,359 --> 00:35:04,640
for a second because that's what

987
00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:06,960
writer's block is is just analysis

988
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:09,119
paralysis you have written yourself to a

989
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,480
point where suddenly there's a lot of

990
00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:12,720
options in front of you and you don't

991
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:15,520
know which one is the best one

992
00:35:12,720 --> 00:35:18,560
and honestly the best answer is that

993
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:19,839
there is no best choice in a scenario

994
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,320
like that you

995
00:35:19,839 --> 00:35:23,680
either pick an option and you follow

996
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,839
that road to

997
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:27,599
where it inevitably ends

998
00:35:25,839 --> 00:35:28,880
and at least when it comes to writing if

999
00:35:27,599 --> 00:35:32,079
you don't like where it ends you can

1000
00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:33,280
just go back to that point where you had

1001
00:35:32,079 --> 00:35:35,680
experienced the writer's block in the

1002
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:37,440
first place and try again with a

1003
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:38,800
different option because i've done that

1004
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:40,880
multiple times

1005
00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:42,560
when it comes to

1006
00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:45,760
gmming or

1007
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:47,920
running a game and the players are like

1008
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:52,079
oh god analysis paralysis what do i do

1009
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:54,640
next um it can be your role as the dm to

1010
00:35:52,079 --> 00:35:55,680
just narrow it down to like three

1011
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:56,640
options

1012
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,400
and this is

1013
00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:00,960
this is something that's been brought up

1014
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:03,920
as a sales tactic too because i've done

1015
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:05,839
sales for years um because it can be

1016
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:08,640
really easy to overwhelm the shopper

1017
00:36:05,839 --> 00:36:10,320
with options so you just narrow it down

1018
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:13,680
to three

1019
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:15,040
to start and yeah go from there and

1020
00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:17,440
whenever you're

1021
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:20,000
gming for a particular setting

1022
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:21,280
it may be helpful to just

1023
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:23,760
have like

1024
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:27,280
three kind of root

1025
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:28,160
choices to choose from and then each

1026
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:31,200
root

1027
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:33,599
choice can have sub choices after that

1028
00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:36,720
almost like uh almost like a spoken

1029
00:36:33,599 --> 00:36:39,599
wheel kind of a system where like you go

1030
00:36:36,720 --> 00:36:40,880
down one spoke and it leads into another

1031
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:42,640
spoken at least to another one and

1032
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,520
another one etc

1033
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:46,240
but

1034
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:48,400
that's my thoughts on it

1035
00:36:46,240 --> 00:36:50,880
if anybody else wants to chip in

1036
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:53,839
no i i definitely agree i think uh

1037
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:56,880
generally when i am writing something uh

1038
00:36:53,839 --> 00:36:59,760
to to put in front of my players i

1039
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,599
have one to two like likely options i

1040
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,640
mean as a gm you generally know your

1041
00:37:01,599 --> 00:37:04,480
players

1042
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,000
uh to an extent

1043
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,520
and

1044
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:09,520
they're inevitably gonna surprise you at

1045
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,800
some points but after you played with a

1046
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:11,760
with a group for a certain amount of

1047
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:14,240
time you're like okay well they're

1048
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:16,160
likely to engage with this or that

1049
00:37:14,240 --> 00:37:18,640
uh and you can kind of narrow things

1050
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,560
down a little bit but yeah

1051
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:22,880
i mean there there's also a time and a

1052
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:24,800
place for you know like hey you're

1053
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:27,359
in the middle of a crisis like quit

1054
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,320
knee-jerk response what is so and so do

1055
00:37:27,359 --> 00:37:31,200
you know

1056
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:34,000
yeah absolutely the the classic tactic

1057
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:35,359
there is imposing a time limit which is

1058
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,440
as with most gm

1059
00:37:35,359 --> 00:37:39,040
tool belt tricks it's

1060
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:41,359
obviously in in moderation don't do it

1061
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,800
for every single the barmaid comes over

1062
00:37:41,359 --> 00:37:44,720
and asks what are you buying you've got

1063
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,320
three seconds to decide is it is it beer

1064
00:37:44,720 --> 00:37:48,400
or is it red wine

1065
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:50,880
that's a little excessive

1066
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:52,480
red wine or blue wine

1067
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:54,240
honestly there could just be some

1068
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:56,000
moments where it can be in character for

1069
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:57,920
somebody to just sit there and putts

1070
00:37:56,000 --> 00:38:00,640
around for 10 minutes being like oh do i

1071
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:03,200
want to do this one oh wait a minute do

1072
00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:05,200
we want to do like a a party plate a

1073
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:07,359
party plate maybe let's do a party play

1074
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,119
how about we do a party plate like that

1075
00:38:07,359 --> 00:38:11,200
could be in character and that can be

1076
00:38:09,119 --> 00:38:12,000
motion in and of itself

1077
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:14,640
yeah

1078
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:16,800
absolutely and that comes to kind of

1079
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:17,760
player experience to a certain extent to

1080
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:20,160
know

1081
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,520
where the line is in terms of well now

1082
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:24,079
now i'm just

1083
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:25,760
being obnoxious

1084
00:38:24,079 --> 00:38:27,200
rather than you know playing to my

1085
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:29,119
character's strengths but i've

1086
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:31,119
definitely been

1087
00:38:29,119 --> 00:38:34,000
on both sides of that

1088
00:38:31,119 --> 00:38:35,760
issue of both the player and the dm

1089
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,280
where my players

1090
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,119
have you know discussed and discussed

1091
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,880
and it gets to a point where one or two

1092
00:38:39,119 --> 00:38:42,400
players will be like i just don't care

1093
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:43,839
anymore like

1094
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:47,599
we're not playing the game anymore we're

1095
00:38:43,839 --> 00:38:49,200
just in this weird meta verse of

1096
00:38:47,599 --> 00:38:51,839
not really playing and just kind of

1097
00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:53,520
overthinking everything and

1098
00:38:51,839 --> 00:38:55,359
that is why i ask the question because

1099
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:57,040
when it gets to that point as soon as

1100
00:38:55,359 --> 00:38:58,160
the first player is annoyed then

1101
00:38:57,040 --> 00:38:59,440
everything

1102
00:38:58,160 --> 00:39:00,880
you know the house of cards falls down

1103
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:03,040
very quickly because

1104
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:04,560
right which is fair enough like one

1105
00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:05,760
person's not really having fun well then

1106
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:06,960
absolutely the house of cards should

1107
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:09,119
fall over because you need to rectify

1108
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,640
that pretty pretty sharpish oh yes which

1109
00:39:09,119 --> 00:39:11,680
is ironic considering the source of the

1110
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,640
problem is

1111
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:16,640
things happening not sharpish

1112
00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:18,400
yeah you can see that that one person

1113
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:21,119
tilt and then it just kind of sinks the

1114
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,640
whole ship yeah yeah so that's that's

1115
00:39:21,119 --> 00:39:25,680
why i asked the question to be like

1116
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:26,720
let's let's think about that and um

1117
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:28,720
it is

1118
00:39:26,720 --> 00:39:30,480
again i i'm unbeknownst to me when i ask

1119
00:39:28,720 --> 00:39:32,480
this question but i'm very happy

1120
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:34,000
i've thought of this is that it is again

1121
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:37,520
it falls into that

1122
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:39,599
that classic dm trap of like oh

1123
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:41,359
i shouldn't impose a time limit or i

1124
00:39:39,599 --> 00:39:43,040
shouldn't just you know

1125
00:39:41,359 --> 00:39:44,960
bring in some cheap

1126
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:47,119
while you're deciding well the right

1127
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,880
hand path suffers a landslide and they

1128
00:39:47,119 --> 00:39:50,400
can't go down anymore

1129
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:52,960
because you know it

1130
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:55,760
it is very easy to be very heavy-handed

1131
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:57,680
in those situations as a gm and just

1132
00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:59,280
have those kind of contrived

1133
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:00,560
outcomes and i think the nuance comes

1134
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:03,520
from

1135
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:06,560
reducing the options in a way that is

1136
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:09,599
fair and makes sense which is

1137
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:12,240
very hard to do in my opinion

1138
00:40:09,599 --> 00:40:14,000
yeah if you don't mind another bit of a

1139
00:40:12,240 --> 00:40:16,720
weird metaphor

1140
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:19,359
i'm bad at writing puzzles i'm

1141
00:40:16,720 --> 00:40:21,520
fully aware of that

1142
00:40:19,359 --> 00:40:22,800
so typically i just steal them online

1143
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:24,880
but

1144
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:27,119
if i'm not doing that

1145
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,680
if i'm writing my own

1146
00:40:27,119 --> 00:40:30,960
mystery for the players to solve

1147
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:33,040
um

1148
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,160
this is the weird metaphor part i like

1149
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:36,160
to think of it like a meat and

1150
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:37,359
charcuterie board okay

1151
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:40,160
right

1152
00:40:37,359 --> 00:40:42,000
so i worked in a restaurant for years

1153
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,560
and i learned a lot about like food

1154
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:46,400
presentation and the idea behind flavor

1155
00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:48,720
profiles right

1156
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:51,119
so the ideal way to

1157
00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:52,400
build out a a charcuterie board

1158
00:40:51,119 --> 00:40:54,720
especially if you're going to be having

1159
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:56,960
things like fruit and breads and sauces

1160
00:40:54,720 --> 00:40:59,359
and honeys and things like that

1161
00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:00,560
is to group the things that taste good

1162
00:40:59,359 --> 00:41:01,680
together

1163
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:03,040
together

1164
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:05,520
right

1165
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,640
so you're gonna put like brie

1166
00:41:05,520 --> 00:41:08,720
with

1167
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:11,119
fruit you're going to put stronger

1168
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:13,920
cheeses like uh i don't know why you

1169
00:41:11,119 --> 00:41:17,359
would have a gorgonzola but a gorgonzola

1170
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:20,319
with like salted meats and more heavy

1171
00:41:17,359 --> 00:41:21,839
breads like um like a toasted baguette

1172
00:41:20,319 --> 00:41:24,240
or something

1173
00:41:21,839 --> 00:41:26,720
and the whole idea is that if you're

1174
00:41:24,240 --> 00:41:28,800
picking from the right side of the board

1175
00:41:26,720 --> 00:41:30,079
everything that goes well together is

1176
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,480
going to be on the right side of the

1177
00:41:30,079 --> 00:41:35,440
board same goes with the left top bottom

1178
00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:37,280
whatever quadrant that you're in right

1179
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:38,880
so if a player

1180
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,240
goes to this dinner party and they see

1181
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:41,760
this meet and charcuterie board and

1182
00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:42,800
they're overwhelmed by their amount of

1183
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:45,359
options

1184
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:46,240
one of the easiest ways that i've found

1185
00:41:45,359 --> 00:41:48,160
to

1186
00:41:46,240 --> 00:41:50,720
lighten the load of that analysis

1187
00:41:48,160 --> 00:41:51,599
paralysis is to simply go up and say

1188
00:41:50,720 --> 00:41:53,760
hey

1189
00:41:51,599 --> 00:41:55,040
those grapes go really really well with

1190
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:57,520
swiss

1191
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:59,680
[Laughter]

1192
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:02,319
metaphorically speaking yeah yeah

1193
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:04,480
metaphorically speaking just go to your

1194
00:42:02,319 --> 00:42:06,400
players and be like hey

1195
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,920
these two things seem to have some kind

1196
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:09,520
of connection yeah

1197
00:42:07,920 --> 00:42:10,720
and eventually you're going to get to a

1198
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:12,480
point where

1199
00:42:10,720 --> 00:42:14,160
something clicks

1200
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,079
and they're able to just steamroll

1201
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:18,720
through the rest of the the puzzle right

1202
00:42:16,079 --> 00:42:20,800
because puzzles are meant to be solved

1203
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:22,640
alternatively if they're a really

1204
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,160
suspicious party that never trust

1205
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,480
anything you say

1206
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:30,000
then you can always be like hey

1207
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:31,839
you should try blue cheese and honey or

1208
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,280
like some weird combination that you

1209
00:42:31,839 --> 00:42:35,359
know isn't gonna taste good because

1210
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:36,800
they're going to reject that immediately

1211
00:42:35,359 --> 00:42:37,839
and hopefully that'll get the ball

1212
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:39,520
rolling

1213
00:42:37,839 --> 00:42:42,800
so it's a little bit of knowing your

1214
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:45,520
party and choosing between truthfulness

1215
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:47,200
and deception to kind of spur them into

1216
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:50,160
the right direction

1217
00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:52,160
i'm a big proponent of hey gm's just

1218
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:53,920
tell your players what's up

1219
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:56,640
like communicate with them if you see

1220
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:59,599
that they're a little lost yeah because

1221
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:02,400
the game's no fun if it stagnates in my

1222
00:42:59,599 --> 00:43:03,920
opinion yeah so just

1223
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,599
it's not going to hurt anything just be

1224
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:07,520
like hey

1225
00:43:05,599 --> 00:43:09,359
go cut the red wire

1226
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:10,960
you know yeah i don't think it's really

1227
00:43:09,359 --> 00:43:12,400
going to hurt anything in the grand

1228
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,839
scheme

1229
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:15,920
and then and then when you roll when do

1230
00:43:13,839 --> 00:43:17,599
you roll the cheese down the hill of my

1231
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:19,520
uh

1232
00:43:17,599 --> 00:43:20,880
uh typically after you taste it and

1233
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:22,160
don't like it you're like i don't want

1234
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:23,760
that anymore and then the cheese always

1235
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:26,160
gets the bottom got it right i'm ready

1236
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:28,880
to dm now exactly the cheese eventually

1237
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:28,880
reaches the bottom

1238
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:33,280
all roads lead to the bottom of the hill

1239
00:43:30,720 --> 00:43:35,040
yeah yeah yeah exactly all roads lead to

1240
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:37,599
the cheese

1241
00:43:35,040 --> 00:43:40,000
like not all who huda or cheddar or

1242
00:43:37,599 --> 00:43:41,440
something those lines yeah some some

1243
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:42,960
profound metaphor in there that we've

1244
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,160
built together in some collaborative

1245
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:44,590
storytelling

1246
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:46,560
um

1247
00:43:44,590 --> 00:43:49,040
[Laughter]

1248
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:50,800
i do think there is

1249
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:51,599
i love that you've brought that up there

1250
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:54,640
that

1251
00:43:51,599 --> 00:43:56,240
the dm withholding information and i

1252
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:57,440
feel qualified to talk about this

1253
00:43:56,240 --> 00:44:00,079
because it's something i've done several

1254
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:02,560
times myself for for wrong

1255
00:44:00,079 --> 00:44:04,720
me in that it's very easy to fulfill

1256
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:06,400
that kind of

1257
00:44:04,720 --> 00:44:08,880
machiavellian like

1258
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:11,040
i hold all the cards and you stupid

1259
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:12,319
players don't know what you're doing and

1260
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:15,359
it kind of

1261
00:44:12,319 --> 00:44:17,599
ticks that small box of being a gm

1262
00:44:15,359 --> 00:44:18,800
and so that combined with

1263
00:44:17,599 --> 00:44:20,400
how

1264
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:22,480
intrinsically difficult it is to know

1265
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:24,079
what the players know and

1266
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:25,839
another level deeper to know what their

1267
00:44:24,079 --> 00:44:27,520
play characters know and disassociate

1268
00:44:25,839 --> 00:44:28,400
that from what you as the gm know which

1269
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:29,920
is

1270
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:32,160
quite literally everything

1271
00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:32,160
uh

1272
00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:35,599
so that often leads to those situations

1273
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,760
where like oh i don't need to tell them

1274
00:44:35,599 --> 00:44:39,599
to cut the red wire because it's obvious

1275
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:41,200
it's the red it's the red wire why

1276
00:44:39,599 --> 00:44:42,400
wouldn't they be cutting it and then

1277
00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:43,359
what you don't know is the dm is that

1278
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:45,119
they've got

1279
00:44:43,359 --> 00:44:47,920
70 sessions of baggage that's taught

1280
00:44:45,119 --> 00:44:48,640
them don't cut you know red things or

1281
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:50,319
they

1282
00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:52,240
too many enemies were read in the last

1283
00:44:50,319 --> 00:44:54,079
couple of sessions and now they've they

1284
00:44:52,240 --> 00:44:55,200
are suspicious about red things and that

1285
00:44:54,079 --> 00:44:57,200
just didn't

1286
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:58,640
click for you until this one pertinent

1287
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,240
moment when it all rests on cutting the

1288
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:01,680
red wire and then you're just sitting

1289
00:45:00,240 --> 00:45:04,800
there as a gm going

1290
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:06,079
ah [ __ ] yeah i didn't see that

1291
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:07,839
yeah

1292
00:45:06,079 --> 00:45:09,839
yep and it's okay to admit that you're

1293
00:45:07,839 --> 00:45:10,640
wrong at points you know

1294
00:45:09,839 --> 00:45:13,040
so

1295
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:14,880
to beat a dead horse if your rock gets

1296
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,640
stuck

1297
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:18,720
rolling down the hill

1298
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:21,040
it's okay to walk down the hill a little

1299
00:45:18,720 --> 00:45:23,119
bit and be like here you go buddy i'm

1300
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,480
sorry i didn't see that somebody parked

1301
00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:25,520
their car there

1302
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,520
you know

1303
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:28,880
it's okay to just kind of nudge it a

1304
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:31,440
little bit to get

1305
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:34,000
the metaphorical rock rolling again you

1306
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:36,000
know yep i mean don't pick it up and

1307
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,920
carry it to the bottom of the hill but

1308
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:39,440
just a little nudge here and there to

1309
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:41,920
get everything moving again i don't

1310
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:44,640
think is a bad thing if you do mess up

1311
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:48,079
as a gm just say hey that's on me

1312
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:49,760
let's keep going yeah precisely and

1313
00:45:48,079 --> 00:45:50,960
you're now um

1314
00:45:49,760 --> 00:45:52,800
i was gonna say you must have listened

1315
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:54,960
to the show before because most of the

1316
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:57,920
show nowadays is me talking about the

1317
00:45:54,960 --> 00:46:01,440
mistakes i've made uh so

1318
00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:03,920
as a gm so yes

1319
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:05,119
we're certainly over that bridge

1320
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:07,440
so

1321
00:46:05,119 --> 00:46:11,359
as we you alluded to earlier on kelsey

1322
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:14,960
regarding the comic art side of things

1323
00:46:11,359 --> 00:46:16,400
emotion uh in regards to that please

1324
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:19,520
educate me

1325
00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:21,359
oh boy okay so motion in comics can

1326
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:22,720
apply to a lot of things it can imply it

1327
00:46:21,359 --> 00:46:24,640
can apply to

1328
00:46:22,720 --> 00:46:26,960
how does the reader's eye move around

1329
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:27,839
the page in order to read it it can also

1330
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:30,880
mean

1331
00:46:27,839 --> 00:46:32,560
can the art imply

1332
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:35,119
movement on the page does a character

1333
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:37,520
look like they are moving

1334
00:46:35,119 --> 00:46:39,599
like a fluidly stiffly

1335
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,680
how are you implying motion in the

1336
00:46:39,599 --> 00:46:43,839
character that you are illustrating how

1337
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:45,680
are you implying motion in the dialogue

1338
00:46:43,839 --> 00:46:48,079
is there motion in the dialogue there's

1339
00:46:45,680 --> 00:46:49,040
a lot of different factors for

1340
00:46:48,079 --> 00:46:52,079
where

1341
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:53,760
motion can apply in comics

1342
00:46:52,079 --> 00:46:56,319
um

1343
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:58,079
the most recent page that i finished for

1344
00:46:56,319 --> 00:47:00,480
my own webcomic the legend of jamie

1345
00:46:58,079 --> 00:47:02,160
roberts i feel really proud of

1346
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:04,880
because it is

1347
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:07,440
in my opinion very fluid and a lot of my

1348
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:09,520
readers have noticed hey the the motion

1349
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:11,280
in this page is actually really really

1350
00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:12,160
nice because like

1351
00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:15,040
um

1352
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:17,040
in in the particular page there's uh one

1353
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:19,359
character asia tossing something to

1354
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:22,480
another character daniel and daniel is

1355
00:47:19,359 --> 00:47:25,520
like fumbling with it and

1356
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:27,520
the line work and the gesture can imply

1357
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:31,040
the motion as well

1358
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:33,599
so there's that and then there's also

1359
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:35,920
just the motion of the story

1360
00:47:33,599 --> 00:47:39,200
overall

1361
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:41,520
and that can also be really hard to

1362
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:43,440
achieve in comics because i'll tell you

1363
00:47:41,520 --> 00:47:46,800
what it's really easy

1364
00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:48,480
for comic stories to

1365
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:50,000
get from point a

1366
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:52,480
to point b

1367
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:54,720
and then they never get to point c

1368
00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:57,599
because point b

1369
00:47:54,720 --> 00:47:59,119
for some ungodly reason is where the

1370
00:47:57,599 --> 00:48:00,640
creative team is like let's just hang

1371
00:47:59,119 --> 00:48:04,640
out here for a little bit and it's like

1372
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:07,200
can we please get to point c though

1373
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:09,119
which which is that uh is that pitfall

1374
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:10,640
there is directly applicable to what

1375
00:48:09,119 --> 00:48:13,440
we've just spent the last 15 minutes

1376
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:15,520
discussing around absolutely

1377
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:16,880
being stuck in that that middle ground

1378
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:20,880
of like

1379
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:22,800
in in action or on

1380
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:25,920
for whatever you want to call it yeah

1381
00:48:22,800 --> 00:48:28,160
yeah yeah a chunk of that can also just

1382
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:30,319
apply to it and really depends on the

1383
00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:32,079
comic market a lot of it is real really

1384
00:48:30,319 --> 00:48:33,200
dependent on like

1385
00:48:32,079 --> 00:48:34,960
sales

1386
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:37,599
because if

1387
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:38,960
if the sales of a book are really really

1388
00:48:37,599 --> 00:48:41,520
good you want to try to prolong the

1389
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:43,359
story for as long as you can so you just

1390
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:45,200
keep the characters hanging out at point

1391
00:48:43,359 --> 00:48:47,599
b and you just don't have them get

1392
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:49,200
anywhere near point c because point c is

1393
00:48:47,599 --> 00:48:51,359
the conclusion we don't want this to

1394
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:53,839
conclude we want to keep selling books

1395
00:48:51,359 --> 00:48:55,359
and that can be kind of a problem

1396
00:48:53,839 --> 00:48:57,440
because you do want to reach a

1397
00:48:55,359 --> 00:49:01,680
conclusion at some point

1398
00:48:57,440 --> 00:49:02,880
yeah yeah goddamn capitalism

1399
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:04,559
yeah

1400
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:06,800
uh well and one thing you mentioned

1401
00:49:04,559 --> 00:49:09,200
kelsey is is talking about motion like

1402
00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:10,960
what where the the reader's eyes are on

1403
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:12,720
and i think that that part of that can

1404
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:15,839
kind of tie back to

1405
00:49:12,720 --> 00:49:16,720
you know describing a scene as a as a gm

1406
00:49:15,839 --> 00:49:19,040
you're

1407
00:49:16,720 --> 00:49:20,640
painting a picture then okay what is

1408
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:21,920
going to jump out at your players

1409
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:23,839
immediately what are they going to run

1410
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:25,839
over and interact with and did you

1411
00:49:23,839 --> 00:49:27,760
describe something meaningful or did you

1412
00:49:25,839 --> 00:49:30,480
just describe a bump on a log that they

1413
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:32,160
are now suddenly fascinated with yeah

1414
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:34,400
and also be

1415
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:36,800
aware of the kinds of like backstory

1416
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:38,559
things that your characters

1417
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:40,400
have hanging around in their backstory

1418
00:49:38,559 --> 00:49:43,119
whenever you're so that whenever you're

1419
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:46,880
describing a scene and

1420
00:49:43,119 --> 00:49:48,800
let's let's say for example uh that you

1421
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:51,440
have a player character who is looking

1422
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:56,160
for a missing mentor figure and you're

1423
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:58,319
describing a scene and you bring up

1424
00:49:56,160 --> 00:50:00,720
that there is something in the bushes

1425
00:49:58,319 --> 00:50:03,119
that looks an awful lot like fabric that

1426
00:50:00,720 --> 00:50:04,559
player is suddenly going to be like oh

1427
00:50:03,119 --> 00:50:05,839
what's the pattern on the fabric over

1428
00:50:04,559 --> 00:50:07,520
there is it connected to my mentor

1429
00:50:05,839 --> 00:50:10,319
figure who am i i'm looking for were

1430
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:12,240
they just in this area like what does it

1431
00:50:10,319 --> 00:50:16,319
look like and that will make them want

1432
00:50:12,240 --> 00:50:18,319
to go and investigate stuff like that

1433
00:50:16,319 --> 00:50:20,960
yeah i'm glad you mentioned that joe

1434
00:50:18,319 --> 00:50:23,440
again because that is a very classic

1435
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:25,119
pitfall again for gm's to be like

1436
00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:28,160
do i point to the elephant in the room

1437
00:50:25,119 --> 00:50:30,000
or do i not point and let the players

1438
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:31,440
then find it but then

1439
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:32,880
you know which is the lesser of two

1440
00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:34,400
evils here because then otherwise are

1441
00:50:32,880 --> 00:50:35,920
they going to get fixated on that random

1442
00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:38,559
pebble that i draw attention to for

1443
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:40,000
flavor and waste right funnily enough

1444
00:50:38,559 --> 00:50:41,200
bring the game to

1445
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:42,740
a screeching halt because they're

1446
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:45,760
invested in pebblegate

1447
00:50:42,740 --> 00:50:48,480
[Laughter]

1448
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:51,359
or do i just be like nah like the

1449
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:55,280
pebble's just a pebble guys um the big

1450
00:50:51,359 --> 00:50:56,880
flaming demon is maybe a bigger concern

1451
00:50:55,280 --> 00:50:59,359
yeah uh

1452
00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,200
this is uh i'm sorry i'm bringing up

1453
00:50:59,359 --> 00:51:03,680
critical role again this is why in

1454
00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:05,359
campaign two matt mercer really should

1455
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:06,720
not have described

1456
00:51:05,359 --> 00:51:09,920
the chair

1457
00:51:06,720 --> 00:51:13,200
and as much depth as he did

1458
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:15,680
because there was a scene where and

1459
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:17,359
what you describe and how you describe

1460
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:18,800
it will say a lot and he had described a

1461
00:51:17,359 --> 00:51:21,520
scene where everything was wrecked

1462
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:24,880
except for one chair which was still

1463
00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:26,079
standing on all four legs undisturbed

1464
00:51:24,880 --> 00:51:27,839
and

1465
00:51:26,079 --> 00:51:30,559
a lesson to all

1466
00:51:27,839 --> 00:51:31,599
gm's and dms out there how you describe

1467
00:51:30,559 --> 00:51:33,920
a scene

1468
00:51:31,599 --> 00:51:37,200
and how you describe the objects in that

1469
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:38,800
scene will do a lot to paint an

1470
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:41,119
implication

1471
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:42,720
of that scene and paint an implication

1472
00:51:41,119 --> 00:51:44,079
of the object that you are describing

1473
00:51:42,720 --> 00:51:45,599
because if everything is a mess but

1474
00:51:44,079 --> 00:51:47,599
there is one object that is really

1475
00:51:45,599 --> 00:51:48,960
pristine what does that say about the

1476
00:51:47,599 --> 00:51:50,880
object

1477
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:53,119
yeah well this is actually a really

1478
00:51:50,880 --> 00:51:54,960
interesting thing that isn't all forms

1479
00:51:53,119 --> 00:51:56,800
of storytelling because

1480
00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:58,400
this is the difference between

1481
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,359
what the gm knows and what the players

1482
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:01,280
know

1483
00:51:59,359 --> 00:52:03,599
you have to remember the gm if you're

1484
00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:06,079
describing a scene that

1485
00:52:03,599 --> 00:52:08,400
how you describe it or how you show it

1486
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:09,839
whether you have a battle map or like an

1487
00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:11,680
illustration

1488
00:52:09,839 --> 00:52:13,760
that's all that the players know about

1489
00:52:11,680 --> 00:52:15,599
the area that they're in

1490
00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:17,440
so if

1491
00:52:15,599 --> 00:52:19,119
let's say in

1492
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:21,839
lord of the rings

1493
00:52:19,119 --> 00:52:22,800
they never mention mordor

1494
00:52:21,839 --> 00:52:24,400
ever

1495
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:25,920
and then suddenly you're in mortar and

1496
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:27,119
you're like whoa what the [ __ ]

1497
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,640
what is this

1498
00:52:27,119 --> 00:52:29,920
you know like i don't know what this

1499
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:31,040
place is

1500
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:34,640
the

1501
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:37,680
viewer of the film if they have zero

1502
00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:39,680
context or zero idea what mordor is are

1503
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:41,119
going to be completely lost and they're

1504
00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:43,119
going to latch on to the first thing

1505
00:52:41,119 --> 00:52:44,720
that interests them

1506
00:52:43,119 --> 00:52:46,880
in that case which would probably be the

1507
00:52:44,720 --> 00:52:48,559
giant volcano or the army of orcs

1508
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:50,960
depending on the person that

1509
00:52:48,559 --> 00:52:53,040
watches it but or the giant ass eyeball

1510
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:56,240
that's staring down at them from on high

1511
00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:57,599
that's not important or that

1512
00:52:56,240 --> 00:53:00,319
probably not

1513
00:52:57,599 --> 00:53:03,359
but as a gm you know

1514
00:53:00,319 --> 00:53:05,040
you have all of the power to draw focus

1515
00:53:03,359 --> 00:53:07,839
to something

1516
00:53:05,040 --> 00:53:10,319
and this is where i think pace comes

1517
00:53:07,839 --> 00:53:12,079
into the conversation of motion

1518
00:53:10,319 --> 00:53:14,720
because

1519
00:53:12,079 --> 00:53:15,839
if you're moving slowly you're still

1520
00:53:14,720 --> 00:53:17,119
moving

1521
00:53:15,839 --> 00:53:20,480
right

1522
00:53:17,119 --> 00:53:23,440
so i like to take my descriptive moments

1523
00:53:20,480 --> 00:53:25,920
especially in a new area to slow down

1524
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:29,920
the pace of the game and really

1525
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:33,119
bring the important things to bear

1526
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:35,040
my players in my dnd game just entered a

1527
00:53:33,119 --> 00:53:36,400
a ruined city

1528
00:53:35,040 --> 00:53:38,079
with like a bunch of skeletons

1529
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:39,520
everywhere and tree overgrowth and

1530
00:53:38,079 --> 00:53:41,359
everything like that

1531
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:42,880
and you know i go ahead and i describe

1532
00:53:41,359 --> 00:53:44,240
the city and all that but what i really

1533
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:46,880
wanted to bring their attention to was

1534
00:53:44,240 --> 00:53:48,640
this giant hundred foot across hole that

1535
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:49,680
sunk down deeper than any of them could

1536
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:52,400
see

1537
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:55,599
right in the middle of the town

1538
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:58,000
pretty easy thing to bring attention to

1539
00:53:55,599 --> 00:54:00,240
but it's also a really easy thing to

1540
00:53:58,000 --> 00:54:02,640
just kind of gloss over because you just

1541
00:54:00,240 --> 00:54:04,720
assume that people will pay attention to

1542
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:07,200
it right

1543
00:54:04,720 --> 00:54:09,440
so the way that i got around that was

1544
00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:10,559
let me take my time let me describe

1545
00:54:09,440 --> 00:54:12,559
everything

1546
00:54:10,559 --> 00:54:14,559
you know relatively quickly just tell

1547
00:54:12,559 --> 00:54:16,800
them what everything looks like and then

1548
00:54:14,559 --> 00:54:19,440
let me slow down

1549
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:22,000
how quickly i'm talking when i'm

1550
00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:24,160
describing this massive hole

1551
00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:26,640
these aqueducts going all throughout the

1552
00:54:24,160 --> 00:54:28,880
city or draining into it but it is not

1553
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:30,800
full of water because the aqueducts

1554
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,800
aren't full right now

1555
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:35,760
this hole sinks down and down and down

1556
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:38,640
you feel the call into the void that is

1557
00:54:35,760 --> 00:54:40,720
at the bottom of this sinkhole and that

1558
00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:42,480
immediately enraptured all of them and

1559
00:54:40,720 --> 00:54:45,040
of course like a good gm i ended the

1560
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:45,040
session there

1561
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:49,680
perfect

1562
00:54:47,359 --> 00:54:51,119
but slowing down even just the pace at

1563
00:54:49,680 --> 00:54:54,240
which you speak

1564
00:54:51,119 --> 00:54:55,599
draws a lot of attention to people

1565
00:54:54,240 --> 00:54:57,440
because whether or not

1566
00:54:55,599 --> 00:55:00,559
we realize it

1567
00:54:57,440 --> 00:55:03,520
humans like to hyper fixate on on things

1568
00:55:00,559 --> 00:55:05,680
that are not normal in their mind

1569
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:08,079
and if this is my normal speaking pace

1570
00:55:05,680 --> 00:55:11,040
just slowing down or speeding up is

1571
00:55:08,079 --> 00:55:12,799
going to tell a lot subconsciously to my

1572
00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:15,520
players

1573
00:55:12,799 --> 00:55:18,400
heck yeah yeah yeah i love that example

1574
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:21,200
actually because if that exactly

1575
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:24,160
identical situation was delivered by

1576
00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:26,160
a not so masterful gm

1577
00:55:24,160 --> 00:55:27,920
it could have easily been you know

1578
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:29,040
construed by the players oh that's just

1579
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:30,799
a well

1580
00:55:29,040 --> 00:55:32,240
and like there's a hole in the ground of

1581
00:55:30,799 --> 00:55:34,240
wars running into that's the well okay

1582
00:55:32,240 --> 00:55:36,559
what else do we see and then you're like

1583
00:55:34,240 --> 00:55:38,160
oh no

1584
00:55:36,559 --> 00:55:39,839
yeah no no no it's a really really

1585
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:41,440
important well hold on

1586
00:55:39,839 --> 00:55:42,640
yeah don't leave yet yeah no come back

1587
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:44,160
come back

1588
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:46,880
pull them in by the stuff on there next

1589
00:55:44,160 --> 00:55:48,240
so no yeah yes yeah it's very it's very

1590
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:51,200
important to know the kind of mood that

1591
00:55:48,240 --> 00:55:53,520
you want to set uh slowing down can be a

1592
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:55,119
really good way to build a sense of

1593
00:55:53,520 --> 00:55:57,680
dread

1594
00:55:55,119 --> 00:56:00,240
so is lowering your voice just that

1595
00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:03,839
little bit or like dropping down to a

1596
00:56:00,240 --> 00:56:05,359
near whisper so tone of voice can also

1597
00:56:03,839 --> 00:56:08,319
affect motion

1598
00:56:05,359 --> 00:56:09,200
um it's it's true for comics it's true

1599
00:56:08,319 --> 00:56:12,079
for

1600
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:13,680
gmming a session yeah yeah yeah and it's

1601
00:56:12,079 --> 00:56:15,359
a it's a classic

1602
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:16,880
uh i learned many years ago in my

1603
00:56:15,359 --> 00:56:18,640
university days when delivering

1604
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:21,760
presentations that

1605
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:23,440
people tend to speak uh you know their

1606
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:24,960
cadence increases

1607
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:26,799
when you're standing in front of people

1608
00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:28,640
slightly nervous you

1609
00:56:26,799 --> 00:56:30,720
subconsciously rattle you want to rattle

1610
00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:32,880
through it so it's over quicker and and

1611
00:56:30,720 --> 00:56:35,119
a big skill you learn when practicing

1612
00:56:32,880 --> 00:56:36,640
giving presentations and whatnot as a

1613
00:56:35,119 --> 00:56:38,240
you know obviously learn the material so

1614
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:40,640
you're a bit more confident but it's

1615
00:56:38,240 --> 00:56:42,000
it's b it's having that conscious effort

1616
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:44,880
in your mind to

1617
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:45,920
slow down you're the way you were

1618
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:47,440
speaking to bring you back into your

1619
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:49,040
normal kind of speed

1620
00:56:47,440 --> 00:56:50,960
because when you're rattling through it

1621
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:53,119
fast you lose

1622
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:54,720
you sound less confident you lose the

1623
00:56:53,119 --> 00:56:56,240
nuance you lose the detail because

1624
00:56:54,720 --> 00:56:57,760
you're just blasting through and sounds

1625
00:56:56,240 --> 00:56:59,359
like this anyway and this and

1626
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:02,480
profitability is that anyway uh bye

1627
00:56:59,359 --> 00:57:04,319
thanks listening and no one's really

1628
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:07,119
paid attention so you know

1629
00:57:04,319 --> 00:57:08,880
just from a human being point of view

1630
00:57:07,119 --> 00:57:10,480
there's rooms and reams of evidence in

1631
00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:11,920
in how that's important just from

1632
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:13,760
standing up in front of you know 30 of

1633
00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:15,359
your classmates and telling them about

1634
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,880
this piece of work you've done so

1635
00:57:15,359 --> 00:57:19,040
obviously you can apply

1636
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:20,960
that very same thinking to just being a

1637
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:22,480
dm and being like okay i'm not

1638
00:57:20,960 --> 00:57:24,480
particularly nervous right now although

1639
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:25,520
some will be but yeah just slowing it

1640
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,680
down

1641
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:30,880
one more notch can have the the opposite

1642
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:33,599
effect of speeding it up unsurprisingly

1643
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:34,559
oh yeah yeah i did stage acting in high

1644
00:57:33,599 --> 00:57:36,960
school

1645
00:57:34,559 --> 00:57:39,680
and one of the ways that we rehearsed

1646
00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:42,000
was we would rehearse speaking as fast

1647
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:45,359
as we possibly could and going through

1648
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:48,559
the motions as fast as we possibly could

1649
00:57:45,359 --> 00:57:50,640
just to give ourselves uh kind of a

1650
00:57:48,559 --> 00:57:54,240
range at which

1651
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:55,839
we could actually operate so if it was a

1652
00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:57,760
one-hour show

1653
00:57:55,839 --> 00:57:59,280
then we would try like we would set

1654
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:01,119
ourselves a goal to get it done in 40

1655
00:57:59,280 --> 00:58:03,280
minutes speed running exactly we would

1656
00:58:01,119 --> 00:58:05,680
speed run the show and

1657
00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:08,160
when we did that it gave at least it

1658
00:58:05,680 --> 00:58:09,040
gave me a more conscious understanding

1659
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:11,680
of

1660
00:58:09,040 --> 00:58:13,359
what pace am i actually performing at

1661
00:58:11,680 --> 00:58:15,280
and then when we got to the actual show

1662
00:58:13,359 --> 00:58:17,040
we would perform it you know three times

1663
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:19,040
friday saturday sunday

1664
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:20,720
and um when we would actually get in

1665
00:58:19,040 --> 00:58:22,319
there and perform the show

1666
00:58:20,720 --> 00:58:23,920
i would be able to carry that with me a

1667
00:58:22,319 --> 00:58:26,000
little bit more and of course we'd been

1668
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,799
rehearsing for months so the confidence

1669
00:58:26,000 --> 00:58:29,119
was

1670
00:58:26,799 --> 00:58:30,079
uh was available to us

1671
00:58:29,119 --> 00:58:32,640
but

1672
00:58:30,079 --> 00:58:35,119
still having that idea of i can finish

1673
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:36,720
this show in 40 minutes if i'm not

1674
00:58:35,119 --> 00:58:38,799
careful

1675
00:58:36,720 --> 00:58:39,920
let me bring it in

1676
00:58:38,799 --> 00:58:41,760
you know

1677
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:44,000
it can be really really helpful so if

1678
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:46,000
you're going to practice as a gm that's

1679
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:48,240
something that i would suggest is try to

1680
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:50,319
speed run through all of the

1681
00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:52,319
uh descriptions that you're going to use

1682
00:58:50,319 --> 00:58:54,799
and that'll give you an idea of okay how

1683
00:58:52,319 --> 00:58:57,040
fast can i actually say this

1684
00:58:54,799 --> 00:59:00,880
if i'm not paying attention

1685
00:58:57,040 --> 00:59:03,119
um and conversely if i may um

1686
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:05,440
because i've i did improv comedy for a

1687
00:59:03,119 --> 00:59:07,680
couple of years when i was in college uh

1688
00:59:05,440 --> 00:59:10,000
one of our warm-up exercises was

1689
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:10,960
actually slow motion

1690
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:13,160
movement

1691
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:16,319
uh like going through things like

1692
00:59:13,160 --> 00:59:17,119
exceptionally slowly um whether you're

1693
00:59:16,319 --> 00:59:19,599
like

1694
00:59:17,119 --> 00:59:20,720
doing slow motion like

1695
00:59:19,599 --> 00:59:22,000
fighting

1696
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:24,720
and

1697
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:26,880
doing exaggerated reactions or doing

1698
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:28,760
reactions that are totally unexpected

1699
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:31,480
but like just going through things

1700
00:59:28,760 --> 00:59:34,640
deliberately slowly like

1701
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:36,640
exceptionally so like whatever you think

1702
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:38,880
sloth speed is

1703
00:59:36,640 --> 00:59:40,720
even slower than that that was our

1704
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:44,079
warm-up exercise

1705
00:59:40,720 --> 00:59:48,480
for uh getting ourselves loose

1706
00:59:44,079 --> 00:59:49,599
and getting ourselves relaxed

1707
00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:52,880
well uh

1708
00:59:49,599 --> 00:59:55,200
thank you uh all for for sharing

1709
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:57,200
your expertise and knowledge in

1710
00:59:55,200 --> 00:59:59,520
in these areas that on the face of it i

1711
00:59:57,200 --> 01:00:04,000
wouldn't have immediately applied to

1712
00:59:59,520 --> 01:00:06,480
uh dnd and hdrpgs and yet here we are uh

1713
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:08,400
we're good for that

1714
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:10,480
uh is is there anything about the topic

1715
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:12,960
of motion that you wanted to discuss

1716
01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:15,200
that we might not have hit yet

1717
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:16,880
uh the only other thing i you see a lot

1718
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:18,960
of people like complaining about like

1719
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:20,960
specific races because they have certain

1720
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:23,040
types of motion whether that's like swim

1721
01:00:20,960 --> 01:00:24,799
speeds or fly speeds

1722
01:00:23,040 --> 01:00:26,720
i think just to briefly touch on that i

1723
01:00:24,799 --> 01:00:29,040
think the big thing with that is just

1724
01:00:26,720 --> 01:00:32,400
knowing what you're in for like

1725
01:00:29,040 --> 01:00:34,559
is a fly speed a little overpowered

1726
01:00:32,400 --> 01:00:36,319
maybe but if you're planning for it it's

1727
01:00:34,559 --> 01:00:38,160
not going to be that big of a deal it's

1728
01:00:36,319 --> 01:00:40,640
i think it boils down to knowing you're

1729
01:00:38,160 --> 01:00:43,680
knowing your party and knowing that team

1730
01:00:40,640 --> 01:00:45,760
at the end of the day yeah absolutely as

1731
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:47,599
as much as it because usually i don't

1732
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:49,760
pay too too much attention to stat

1733
01:00:47,599 --> 01:00:52,079
blocks even as a dm and yet paying

1734
01:00:49,760 --> 01:00:54,400
attention to stat blocks is

1735
01:00:52,079 --> 01:00:56,960
important and paying attention to your

1736
01:00:54,400 --> 01:01:00,000
player character's stat blocks are very

1737
01:00:56,960 --> 01:01:01,920
important like reading is fundamental

1738
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:04,319
reading is fundamental also it would

1739
01:01:01,920 --> 01:01:07,200
really really suck to plan an encounter

1740
01:01:04,319 --> 01:01:09,440
with like for example a displacer beast

1741
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:11,760
and suddenly your cleric is like i cast

1742
01:01:09,440 --> 01:01:13,280
banishment and it's like oh because the

1743
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:15,760
displacer beast is not native to this

1744
01:01:13,280 --> 01:01:17,599
plane of existence that that shit's gone

1745
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:19,760
yep okay

1746
01:01:17,599 --> 01:01:21,280
yep that that happened to me so that's

1747
01:01:19,760 --> 01:01:23,359
fine definitely not you're not bringing

1748
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:25,440
up any bad memories there's a gymnast oh

1749
01:01:23,359 --> 01:01:26,640
no it totally happened to me too i feel

1750
01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:28,720
you dude

1751
01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:30,079
yeah i do two big flying

1752
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:32,960
guys from

1753
01:01:30,079 --> 01:01:34,720
one of the layers of the abyss and

1754
01:01:32,960 --> 01:01:36,960
my sorcerer took a pump and just said

1755
01:01:34,720 --> 01:01:38,880
they look alien enough banishment and i

1756
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:42,079
was like oh okay this is now trivial

1757
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:43,280
combat yep and yeah it did go did try

1758
01:01:42,079 --> 01:01:45,119
and break the concentration but it

1759
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:47,920
wasn't wasn't quick enough and uh yeah

1760
01:01:45,119 --> 01:01:50,319
that that was that so uh yeah yeah know

1761
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:54,559
your players capabilities ah yeah and

1762
01:01:50,319 --> 01:01:56,160
the fly thing i love as a fear because

1763
01:01:54,559 --> 01:01:59,839
i have been there as well and it's a

1764
01:01:56,160 --> 01:02:01,599
genuine concern again indicative of

1765
01:01:59,839 --> 01:02:04,000
how the majority of games are played in

1766
01:02:01,599 --> 01:02:05,200
tier one and two when it makes the

1767
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:08,160
biggest difference

1768
01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:10,079
because as soon as my warlock got fly

1769
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:11,680
like he was like i'm not standing on the

1770
01:02:10,079 --> 01:02:13,359
ground you guys are chumps walking

1771
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:15,680
around i'm flying like any given

1772
01:02:13,359 --> 01:02:17,280
opportunity i'm flying fighting enemies

1773
01:02:15,680 --> 01:02:18,160
i'm flying talking to a merchant i'm

1774
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:19,119
flying

1775
01:02:18,160 --> 01:02:20,960
buying

1776
01:02:19,119 --> 01:02:22,559
shoes i'm flying which is weird because

1777
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:25,359
shoes are for walking on the ground but

1778
01:02:22,559 --> 01:02:27,359
he'd still be flying and so when

1779
01:02:25,359 --> 01:02:29,760
when that band-aid was torn off i was

1780
01:02:27,359 --> 01:02:31,230
like oh okay it was no longer this big

1781
01:02:29,760 --> 01:02:32,880
scary thing that i had to worry about

1782
01:02:31,230 --> 01:02:34,720
[Laughter]

1783
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:36,079
yeah i mean once you get to tier three

1784
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:38,240
where like

1785
01:02:36,079 --> 01:02:41,039
people can move between dimensions and

1786
01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:42,960
[ __ ] like yeah it's it's a negligible i

1787
01:02:41,039 --> 01:02:44,319
mean even at tier two like several

1788
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:45,760
classes are going to give you like i

1789
01:02:44,319 --> 01:02:48,240
want to say there uh there are some

1790
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:50,079
rangers they give you like swim speeds

1791
01:02:48,240 --> 01:02:52,559
or climb speeds and stuff like that so

1792
01:02:50,079 --> 01:02:53,520
it's just it's negligible it is yeah

1793
01:02:52,559 --> 01:02:55,839
yeah

1794
01:02:53,520 --> 01:02:58,240
well awesome so

1795
01:02:55,839 --> 01:02:59,839
after after that is there anything that

1796
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:01,680
you would like to

1797
01:02:59,839 --> 01:03:03,200
promote that you haven't already

1798
01:03:01,680 --> 01:03:05,680
sneakily promoted halfway through the

1799
01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:05,680
episode

1800
01:03:05,920 --> 01:03:10,960
you could have done this

1801
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:12,640
oh gee i i have no idea what you're

1802
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:14,480
talking about we need to point fingers

1803
01:03:12,640 --> 01:03:17,480
and we need to get to the bottom of who

1804
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:17,480
did

1805
01:03:18,079 --> 01:03:23,359
um well yeah uh you know we're the

1806
01:03:21,200 --> 01:03:25,760
fourth leg as we talked about at the

1807
01:03:23,359 --> 01:03:28,240
start of the show top of the show

1808
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:30,880
we are like i said at the top of the

1809
01:03:28,240 --> 01:03:32,000
show a tabletop gaming show that dives

1810
01:03:30,880 --> 01:03:34,880
into

1811
01:03:32,000 --> 01:03:37,680
a comprehensive guide on how to start

1812
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:39,280
your career gm'ing and we're currently

1813
01:03:37,680 --> 01:03:41,200
coming to

1814
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:42,559
a rapid close to season two i think

1815
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:44,720
we've only got like two or three more

1816
01:03:42,559 --> 01:03:48,079
episodes to release

1817
01:03:44,720 --> 01:03:49,839
so get in on that uh we are currently

1818
01:03:48,079 --> 01:03:51,839
building through a

1819
01:03:49,839 --> 01:03:54,240
uh well three different campaign

1820
01:03:51,839 --> 01:03:56,960
settings that are originally created one

1821
01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:58,079
by each host and in different systems no

1822
01:03:56,960 --> 01:04:01,359
less

1823
01:03:58,079 --> 01:04:04,480
into different systems no less using d5e

1824
01:04:01,359 --> 01:04:06,559
the genesis system uh by fantasy flight

1825
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:08,240
games and powered by the apocalypse

1826
01:04:06,559 --> 01:04:09,920
system set in a

1827
01:04:08,240 --> 01:04:11,520
cyberpunk wasteland

1828
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:13,039
so those are coming along really nicely

1829
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:14,559
and we do our best to incorporate the

1830
01:04:13,039 --> 01:04:17,599
things that we've talked about in prior

1831
01:04:14,559 --> 01:04:19,599
episodes directly into the next stages

1832
01:04:17,599 --> 01:04:22,000
of our campaign so we're coming up on

1833
01:04:19,599 --> 01:04:24,319
the fourth installment of that uh so

1834
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:26,160
stay tuned heck yeah oh and you can find

1835
01:04:24,319 --> 01:04:28,000
us on spotify and a bunch of other

1836
01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:30,720
podcatchers and follow our twitter at

1837
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:32,960
the fourth leg yes uh your podcast

1838
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:34,480
platform of choice i'm sure

1839
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:38,000
perhaps the very one that people are

1840
01:04:34,480 --> 01:04:38,000
listening to right now i would imagine

1841
01:04:39,200 --> 01:04:44,880
oh yeah well uh in that case all that's

1842
01:04:42,480 --> 01:04:47,680
left to say is very very heartfelt

1843
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:49,520
thanks to the the three of you today joe

1844
01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:51,680
kelsey and hunter that was that was a

1845
01:04:49,520 --> 01:04:53,200
really really really really interesting

1846
01:04:51,680 --> 01:04:55,440
discussion

1847
01:04:53,200 --> 01:04:57,200
on something which is on the face of it

1848
01:04:55,440 --> 01:05:01,039
a bit um

1849
01:04:57,200 --> 01:05:03,280
esoteric extract yeah yeah

1850
01:05:01,039 --> 01:05:05,039
and they're just kind of like how

1851
01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:07,520
don't like but but how could this topic

1852
01:05:05,039 --> 01:05:10,720
ever be applied to ttrpgs and i'm very

1853
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:14,640
happy to have answered that hypothetical

1854
01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:14,640
question from my invisible hater

1855
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:19,839
yeah no we talked about rocks and hills

1856
01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:21,680
and meats and honey it's great and now

1857
01:05:19,839 --> 01:05:22,880
i'm hungry again despite having just had

1858
01:05:21,680 --> 01:05:25,599
dinner so cool

1859
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:27,119
[Laughter]

1860
01:05:25,599 --> 01:05:28,720
thank you thank you i haven't eaten

1861
01:05:27,119 --> 01:05:30,400
dinner yet so maybe that's why i started

1862
01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:31,680
talking about food

1863
01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:32,720
all these food

1864
01:05:31,680 --> 01:05:34,839
food is

1865
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:37,839
food is a great topic

1866
01:05:34,839 --> 01:05:39,920
regardless but i could also eat all the

1867
01:05:37,839 --> 01:05:40,720
time i'm not the kind of person well

1868
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:41,920
yeah

1869
01:05:40,720 --> 01:05:43,440
you're providing additional value

1870
01:05:41,920 --> 01:05:45,359
because food isn't a topic that we've

1871
01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:48,160
covered yet so that's now on the list so

1872
01:05:45,359 --> 01:05:49,520
thank you very much

1873
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:51,280
and we've talked about it a little bit

1874
01:05:49,520 --> 01:05:53,039
in this episode you're welcome

1875
01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:54,880
we'll see we'll see you all back uh next

1876
01:05:53,039 --> 01:05:56,400
season for food for food yeah season

1877
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:57,920
four

1878
01:05:56,400 --> 01:05:59,520
the food lake i don't know something

1879
01:05:57,920 --> 01:06:01,920
there's there's a pun somewhere in there

1880
01:05:59,520 --> 01:06:06,319
buried in there

1881
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:06,319
the fourth leg of chicken oh there we go

1882
01:06:07,119 --> 01:06:10,480
all right okay okay leg of land yeah so

1883
01:06:09,680 --> 01:06:11,839
there's something there's something

1884
01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:13,200
knocking around there we'll we'll

1885
01:06:11,839 --> 01:06:15,280
workshop it and come back in the next

1886
01:06:13,200 --> 01:06:17,119
season um but

1887
01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:19,920
with these terrible puns i can't think

1888
01:06:17,119 --> 01:06:21,039
of a better place to end the episode

1889
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:22,640
[Music]

1890
01:06:21,039 --> 01:06:24,960
thank you all uh

1891
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:26,880
for listening at home please do check

1892
01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:29,039
out the episode description for the

1893
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:31,280
links to the fourth leg as well as all

1894
01:06:29,039 --> 01:06:32,960
of my socials and i'd very much

1895
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:35,200
encourage you to reach out to any of us

1896
01:06:32,960 --> 01:06:36,720
to talk about rocks or food um

1897
01:06:35,200 --> 01:06:40,079
two primary topics

1898
01:06:36,720 --> 01:06:41,760
uh otherwise thank you all for listening

1899
01:06:40,079 --> 01:06:44,720
and good night

1900
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:46,319
good night thank you take it easy guys

1901
01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:47,359
and now it's time for the patreon shout

1902
01:06:46,319 --> 01:06:49,599
outs

1903
01:06:47,359 --> 01:06:52,079
thank you to optional rule a two time

1904
01:06:49,599 --> 01:06:54,880
guest of the show and a very insightful

1905
01:06:52,079 --> 01:06:56,160
and knowledgeable source of information

1906
01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:59,160
please check them out at

1907
01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:59,160
www.optionalrule.com

1908
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:04,880
huge huge huge thank you to a great

1909
01:07:02,319 --> 01:07:07,280
friend of the show matthew perkins who's

1910
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:09,680
out there making hilarious and

1911
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:11,440
educational dungeons and dragons content

1912
01:07:09,680 --> 01:07:13,200
please go and check out his stuff at

1913
01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:15,599
matthewperkins.net where you can find

1914
01:07:13,200 --> 01:07:17,200
links to all of his socials and all of

1915
01:07:15,599 --> 01:07:18,880
his content including his own patreon

1916
01:07:17,200 --> 01:07:20,640
which i would very much encourage you to

1917
01:07:18,880 --> 01:07:23,520
check out

1918
01:07:20,640 --> 01:07:25,440
thank you to matt street at mpstreet88

1919
01:07:23,520 --> 01:07:26,720
on twitter for supporting the show

1920
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:29,720
if you need support running your

1921
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:31,920
personal or business schedule head to

1922
01:07:29,720 --> 01:07:33,599
virtualtimehustle.com or on instagram to

1923
01:07:31,920 --> 01:07:35,760
make that difference between should do

1924
01:07:33,599 --> 01:07:37,520
and done boss it better with support

1925
01:07:35,760 --> 01:07:39,839
from cat who will help you get back that

1926
01:07:37,520 --> 01:07:41,280
essential time you've been searching for

1927
01:07:39,839 --> 01:07:43,200
if you would like to support what we do

1928
01:07:41,280 --> 01:07:45,920
and get four shout outs a month head

1929
01:07:43,200 --> 01:07:47,440
over to patreon.com thinking critically

1930
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:51,390
or you can just buy me a coffee at

1931
01:07:47,440 --> 01:07:58,400
kofi.com thinking critically

1932
01:07:51,390 --> 01:08:18,640
[Music]

The Fourth Leg Podcast Profile Photo

The Fourth Leg Podcast

Podcast

We are the Fourth Leg, a TTRPG show all about giving new GMs a leg to stand on! We focus on giving newcomers to this wonderful hobby a toolkit to get started with their worldbuilding and campaign writing!