Ravenloft

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welcome thinkers to a new season season

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five episode one of thinking critically

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a DND discussion thank you ever so much

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for continuing to enjoy and support the

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show

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yeah I've been a bit quiet recently both

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in terms of episode output uh and also

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on the on the socials and stuff uh just

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life

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is not finding a way for me at the

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moment I've taken on way too many

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hobbies and we're we're reaching that

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time of the year in the UK at least

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where everybody's getting married and

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going on holidays and the summertime is

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very much upon us that being said I am

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still looking for questions to do an AMA

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style like we did at the end of season

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one

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thing

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so any questions at all about the show

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the podcast me you know production of

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the show how I get episodes how we do

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the recording the stream the campaign

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the characters in The Campaign what I've

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got planned anything at all then please

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drop a question Below in the the Spotify

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ask me anything poll thing if you scroll

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down if you're on Spotify or just on any

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of the socials or DM me as well those

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who uh in the elite crew otherwise yeah

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that's good let's get on with it new

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season

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who this let's roll uh great episode

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coming up actually you really stoked

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this one one of the few instances where

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I've seen the guest in real life sounds

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weird to say ahead of time and you'll

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you'll understand when you hear it but

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it's passion is just infectious so

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really stick to this one very

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educational very fun so

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let's let's get on the show

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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thank you

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and today I'm joined by John gent thank

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you ever so much for joining us today

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John can you tell us a little bit about

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yourself well good evening

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job is I'm a project manager so dealing

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with quite heavy serious real stuff but

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my passion is gaming and in particular

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uh subject for this evening

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been playing since I was 13 so that's

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coming up for about 43 years now I've

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been playing in dming my dad got me into

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it and I just enjoy gaming I just love

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gaming um I've had a I've had a shop you

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know I've run clubs

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so I just I just enjoy myself the games

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amazing and I can't believe we didn't

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haven't talked about this yet or not but

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I'm also a project manager but we won't

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talk about that

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I wanna I wanna keep the listeners I

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don't want to drive them off in the

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first to come on

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afterwards before I project management

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stuff absolutely

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um but of course today's today's topic

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is Raven Loft so what does that mean to

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you and the d d and wider ttrpg

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framework wow Raven lost a passion of

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mine uh I I am I am that old that I

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remember when the original

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I6 ravenloft scenario came out in I

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think was about 80. 3 1983

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um and it was It was kind of

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revolutionary when it came out I think

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because it was it was very different on

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a couple of levels one it was

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it's a very dark

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scenario there's a very there's a very

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powerful bad guy in there and the second

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part that was really the maps were the

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cartography was just stunning

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um I I think it won some awards but it

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was definitely used a lot more and of

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course that that was the start and it's

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just

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it's just grown it's just grown I mean

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that was that was first edition Advanced

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DND and of course then it flipped over

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into second edition

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then third 3.5

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fourth and now in fifth it's it's gone

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through every single

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every single Edition and it started from

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that one

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scenario for a sort of a mid mid-level

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character then it just grew and grew and

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grew and I think part of its uh charm if

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that's the right word

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is the the potential dark nature of

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anything it's got almost an entity to

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itself it's it's a campaign world I mean

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you look at everyone eberron is another

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favorite of mine but that's that's got a

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really rich history if you go into

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ravenloft and you go back through it and

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the original books of the second edition

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whatever the history and the law that's

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in there is really deep and Rich and

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there's a lot of background and you get

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into that there's this it's like well

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you know that's that's why that is like

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it is that's why that person is like

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they are and a lot of it is

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is almost a tragedy

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I mean I think they've defined it now

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more that it's part of the Shadow fell

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um yeah so it's it's actually it's got a

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space but if you go back to the original

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thinking of it when they first started

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doing it it was it was a pocket realm

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they called them pocket Realms and it

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was just this little bit in in the case

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of ravenoft it was borovia it was Castle

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Raven Loft and it was the village of

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barovia and there was a little bit

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around it and what have you and then

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that grew into something more if you go

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to

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cursive straud which is the latest

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version it's it's huge there's different

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areas

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but they're all these little pocket

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Realms and it spawned other areas that

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became part of the Raven off brand and

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it was a completely different way of

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looking at it I think because they

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existed but depending and I think they

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they purposely kept it mysterious

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um and they purposely kept a veil over

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it and never really divulged where it

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was or what it was and depending on how

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you look it was it was either a prison

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for bad guys or it was it was it was a

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playground

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you know depending on your point of view

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yeah and who created it what created it

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you know yeah it's up to you you guys

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can make it up as they say and the very

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land itself is living and early on in

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the rainbow of the original Raven Loft

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um if you started doing bad things if

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your character obviously not a paladin

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but um if you if your Rogue decided that

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he was going to start stealing from the

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locals and

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stealing from from the party and things

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like that that the land would react to

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that okay and and you would get

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sin points if you like and you there

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were tables as well because d d loves a

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good table yeah

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um and and you could you could do these

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different things you know you get this

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this Lust For Gold you don't show any

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gold you know very

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yeah you'd do anything to get it and and

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that then you would if you went further

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um it would reward you with maybe small

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things or little sharp claws on your

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fingers that were almost imperceptible

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but would give you that extra attack and

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yeah and I think that's that's what

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really gripped me was the fact that

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the players just couldn't do what they

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wanted anymore

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without some kind of consequence oh you

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know and if you start being a bad guy

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and messing around then things would

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happen

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and that concept was just brand new to

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me I mean I was what uh early 20s I

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would have been then dming and I picked

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Raven up and that was my realm that's

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what I used to run um my dad used to run

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um and he would run you know the the

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mainstream stuff a lot of the mainstream

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stuff Sinister secret assault Marsh Isle

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of dread all that sort of original stuff

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my brother who's also a gamer a few

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years younger than me

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um his thing became Hollow world I don't

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know if you remember hello world no it

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was it hello world it was that was

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another campaign from DND it was based

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around the center of the planet oh okay

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so that was his thing he did that

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another friend of mine player still

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gaming now dark son was his that one

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rings a bell yep yeah um and you know

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and we all had our own little sort of

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areas where we'd rather off as mine and

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I read up on it I just loved it

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if to me it's you can have a lot of fun

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with it as a DM yeah as a DM you can

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have a lot of fun

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quite often when you when you're running

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a scenario as a DM

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you want to do something but it doesn't

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kind of fit with the story

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[Music]

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you know am I am I going to annoy my

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players if I do that with rain enough

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you can do that

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and you and and actively irritating your

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place

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to get them to do something

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um and it's just magic it's just you can

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just I'm gonna do this because I can

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yeah and and yeah it just kind of turned

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it on its head and then of course you've

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got the main man himself who is you know

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an immensely powerful completely

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evil single-minded

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Nutter really but very clever a very

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gentlemanly polite

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almost honest to her to a fault

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honorable

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and you've got this arch nemesis there

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and then everything that goes goes

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around it I mean yeah it's huge for me

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it's huge yeah well I I love the the

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passion it's very clear through how you

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talk about it how how engaged you are

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available which is which is lovely to

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see there's a couple of things there so

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before we talk about

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um well anything actually of course I

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forgot to mention up the front that we

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met at the RP gaming in faversham in in

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Kent have been a good a good few weeks

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back uh from the guys to the the boys in

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the Baltic star which had been in the

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previous episode and you took me and one

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of my players through a ravenloft one

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shot right kind of pretty much yeah yeah

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so that that was officially well hey

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thank you for that because it was really

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fun to play with one of my players to be

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on the same side of the the screen from

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him for a change

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uh and also that was really my first

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experience not to like out myself too

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much on the show of my lack of

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experience but um

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the first thing I wanted to talk about

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here that really picked my interest in

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your your initial discussion there was

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how you said the world reacts to the

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players because that is a problem

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you see time and time and time again on

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DM advice subreddits and RPG stack

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exchange and everything have been like

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yeah my players are doing this so how do

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I encourage this Behavior which is the

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the nicer way of putting it or how do I

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stop them doing that or why are they

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doing this there's so many questions and

275
00:11:11,820 --> 00:11:15,959
I do think

276
00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:18,060
done correctly of course it can be quite

277
00:11:15,959 --> 00:11:19,860
an elegant solution to have that living

278
00:11:18,060 --> 00:11:21,540
world as it were so they're not just

279
00:11:19,860 --> 00:11:23,880
like in you know the uh the material

280
00:11:21,540 --> 00:11:25,440
plane and the market shopkeeper and

281
00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:27,300
that's it like there's no yes all

282
00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:30,300
there's police might chasing down okay

283
00:11:27,300 --> 00:11:32,399
but they're hierarch Adventures so like

284
00:11:30,300 --> 00:11:34,440
they don't care but they have something

285
00:11:32,399 --> 00:11:36,060
you know in not inhumane or yeah

286
00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:38,579
inhumane in a way but like this

287
00:11:36,060 --> 00:11:41,579
unknowable unbargonable

288
00:11:38,579 --> 00:11:42,839
feature just affects you and then the

289
00:11:41,579 --> 00:11:45,720
and the environment you're in because of

290
00:11:42,839 --> 00:11:47,700
your own actions I think is is one a

291
00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:50,579
very good elegant way to to be like

292
00:11:47,700 --> 00:11:53,640
you're doing objectively evil things or

293
00:11:50,579 --> 00:11:56,100
bad things like morally wrong yeah like

294
00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:57,440
something you know the world is a

295
00:11:56,100 --> 00:12:00,480
reflection of

296
00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:01,680
any any time there's a reflection you

297
00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:04,680
hold up a mirror to the player

298
00:12:01,680 --> 00:12:06,360
characters I love uh and that is one way

299
00:12:04,680 --> 00:12:08,940
to do it to be like look the world is

300
00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:10,440
now a mirror of your actions try and be

301
00:12:08,940 --> 00:12:11,940
the change the good change you want to

302
00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:15,360
see in the world of course it's it's

303
00:12:11,940 --> 00:12:17,640
great if you I mean gaming I mean

304
00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:19,560
certainly my gaming there's a lot of fun

305
00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:22,260
there's a lot of doogle on taunders

306
00:12:19,560 --> 00:12:24,540
there's a lot of leg pulling and you

307
00:12:22,260 --> 00:12:27,180
know there's comical themes that repeat

308
00:12:24,540 --> 00:12:28,980
themselves that's that's part of the

309
00:12:27,180 --> 00:12:31,200
game where you have a lot of fun but

310
00:12:28,980 --> 00:12:33,240
something I have found and particularly

311
00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:34,860
like with with Raven off with what the

312
00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:37,260
game I play is

313
00:12:34,860 --> 00:12:39,240
sometimes the players get just a little

314
00:12:37,260 --> 00:12:41,279
bit too cocky

315
00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:43,680
they're just a little bit you know with

316
00:12:41,279 --> 00:12:45,000
heroes yes yes you are the heroes and we

317
00:12:43,680 --> 00:12:46,740
can do what we want and we can do this

318
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:49,680
and we do that and

319
00:12:46,740 --> 00:12:52,560
they I mean there's a whole completely

320
00:12:49,680 --> 00:12:54,480
different conversation about the DND 5e

321
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:56,639
player characters that the heroes being

322
00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:59,160
way too powerful when we could spend all

323
00:12:56,639 --> 00:13:01,980
evening doing that but

324
00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:05,100
you know with with what I I've got at my

325
00:13:01,980 --> 00:13:07,440
fingertips easily have on my fingertips

326
00:13:05,100 --> 00:13:09,000
let's put it like that rather than you

327
00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:10,980
can suddenly get attacked by a band of

328
00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,540
50 Orcs And they're kind of like saying

329
00:13:10,980 --> 00:13:14,579
well we're out shopping how does that

330
00:13:12,540 --> 00:13:16,500
happen um you can you can get away with

331
00:13:14,579 --> 00:13:18,959
that and Raven often and I have had my

332
00:13:16,500 --> 00:13:20,899
players experience players on my ad

333
00:13:18,959 --> 00:13:23,880
literally strutting around the place

334
00:13:20,899 --> 00:13:24,899
deliberately and on purpose scaring the

335
00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:27,300
locals

336
00:13:24,899 --> 00:13:29,820
you know this this is this is borovia

337
00:13:27,300 --> 00:13:31,860
it's dark it's depressing it's cut even

338
00:13:29,820 --> 00:13:35,160
with the sun is at its highest peak it's

339
00:13:31,860 --> 00:13:37,560
overcast you know it's like a wet

340
00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:40,320
Wednesday afternoon yeah November you

341
00:13:37,560 --> 00:13:42,420
know all the time and people are people

342
00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:44,100
are scared genuinely scared and there's

343
00:13:42,420 --> 00:13:47,279
that that feeling of

344
00:13:44,100 --> 00:13:49,920
Despair and horror and despondency

345
00:13:47,279 --> 00:13:50,700
running as a theme through and then of

346
00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:52,079
course you've got the player characters

347
00:13:50,700 --> 00:13:54,480
that are just running around doing what

348
00:13:52,079 --> 00:13:57,120
they want and going to the Local Kitchen

349
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:59,579
run away screaming yeah and I had a

350
00:13:57,120 --> 00:14:01,920
party doing that and I thought you know

351
00:13:59,579 --> 00:14:03,480
what I'm sick of this I'm just so sick

352
00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:05,700
of this you are powerful yes and you are

353
00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:07,079
walking through a few encounters that

354
00:14:05,700 --> 00:14:09,839
I'm putting in your way

355
00:14:07,079 --> 00:14:11,639
so I'm going to up the antique so I had

356
00:14:09,839 --> 00:14:13,320
them they were visited by the man

357
00:14:11,639 --> 00:14:15,420
himself

358
00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:18,839
um and they were nowhere near the right

359
00:14:15,420 --> 00:14:22,440
level to take him on you know and um

360
00:14:18,839 --> 00:14:24,420
he just said I mean spoiler alert he set

361
00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:26,700
three hags on them from Ghost Estrada

362
00:14:24,420 --> 00:14:28,920
there's three hags and the and and I

363
00:14:26,700 --> 00:14:32,279
just I just completely internally

364
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:34,980
spanked them with these hags whilst he

365
00:14:32,279 --> 00:14:37,380
stood back and watched from afar

366
00:14:34,980 --> 00:14:40,860
you know and they will play things and I

367
00:14:37,380 --> 00:14:44,160
I took all the characters down to death

368
00:14:40,860 --> 00:14:46,740
saves apart from one

369
00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:48,420
and then I gave him a way out

370
00:14:46,740 --> 00:14:50,220
I did it I did a little bit of speed

371
00:14:48,420 --> 00:14:53,519
gaming which is what we did at the end

372
00:14:50,220 --> 00:14:55,320
of our session oh yes yeah and and which

373
00:14:53,519 --> 00:14:57,060
which gets the adrenaline pump in and

374
00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,459
the blood pumping and I gave him and I

375
00:14:57,060 --> 00:15:00,660
and I got them out of it and I just you

376
00:14:59,459 --> 00:15:03,899
know the bad guy just walks away

377
00:15:00,660 --> 00:15:05,459
laughing and it served really well but

378
00:15:03,899 --> 00:15:06,779
they loved it they absolutely loved it

379
00:15:05,459 --> 00:15:09,079
they said afterwards but it brought them

380
00:15:06,779 --> 00:15:11,699
back down

381
00:15:09,079 --> 00:15:13,980
yes yes that's a really good word they

382
00:15:11,699 --> 00:15:15,720
were humbled and were

383
00:15:13,980 --> 00:15:17,579
we're just a little bit more cautious

384
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,440
and careful about what they did I said

385
00:15:17,579 --> 00:15:20,940
it looks great it's great you know you

386
00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:22,500
you you're really doing well you've got

387
00:15:20,940 --> 00:15:24,600
such a reputation

388
00:15:22,500 --> 00:15:26,160
and they didn't really twig and then one

389
00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:27,899
of the guys said what do you mean

390
00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:29,040
reputation I said well nobody knows who

391
00:15:27,899 --> 00:15:31,079
you are

392
00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:33,120
you know this party of five adventurers

393
00:15:31,079 --> 00:15:35,399
wandering around borovia you might as

394
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:38,940
well have a big flag above your head

395
00:15:35,399 --> 00:15:41,040
yeah and protagonists and it was just

396
00:15:38,940 --> 00:15:43,920
like a magnet yeah and I can do that

397
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:46,440
because because within within the

398
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:49,440
the mechanics of ravenloft

399
00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:52,500
you can do that it almost instantly you

400
00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:54,540
can just draw in bad guys that's not

401
00:15:52,500 --> 00:15:57,000
something you can you can do in a town

402
00:15:54,540 --> 00:16:00,000
or not easily do it yeah no no not at

403
00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:01,500
all yeah yeah that's the struggle that I

404
00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:03,660
have and why some of my later chapters

405
00:16:01,500 --> 00:16:05,459
in my campaign are just more far-flung

406
00:16:03,660 --> 00:16:07,820
and exotic because

407
00:16:05,459 --> 00:16:10,620
it's quite boring quickly to be it's and

408
00:16:07,820 --> 00:16:12,899
another bunch of assassins in the street

409
00:16:10,620 --> 00:16:14,459
uh jumping you or like you can't have

410
00:16:12,899 --> 00:16:15,839
very outlandish things unless you're

411
00:16:14,459 --> 00:16:18,720
building to some kind of

412
00:16:15,839 --> 00:16:22,399
like apocalyptic cataclysm of course

413
00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:24,839
um hags uh tough

414
00:16:22,399 --> 00:16:26,459
this is very good well good or bad

415
00:16:24,839 --> 00:16:28,500
timing depending on how you think about

416
00:16:26,459 --> 00:16:30,660
it but they'd actually just killed my

417
00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:34,260
one and Main player character one heck

418
00:16:30,660 --> 00:16:36,540
did last Sunday four or five days ago

419
00:16:34,260 --> 00:16:38,699
my guy had it coming uh it's like from

420
00:16:36,540 --> 00:16:41,699
the uh the actual play podcast I'm in

421
00:16:38,699 --> 00:16:44,160
and uh he's a wizard chronomancy which

422
00:16:41,699 --> 00:16:46,980
is like I think one of the critical role

423
00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:49,560
classes but basically level

424
00:16:46,980 --> 00:16:52,380
I think we're 13 wizard plus chronomancy

425
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:55,139
uh he was just very difficult to hit

426
00:16:52,380 --> 00:16:57,180
powerful very powerful yeah so you know

427
00:16:55,139 --> 00:16:59,160
you can deny crits you could can deny

428
00:16:57,180 --> 00:17:00,899
attack rolls you can you know knock

429
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:02,639
people out there spell casting you can

430
00:17:00,899 --> 00:17:04,620
make people lose turns and stuff and

431
00:17:02,639 --> 00:17:07,380
obviously I do that all from

432
00:17:04,620 --> 00:17:09,540
a different postcode well the fighting

433
00:17:07,380 --> 00:17:13,199
is over there I'm nice and safe over

434
00:17:09,540 --> 00:17:15,720
here so I I as I said to the guys like

435
00:17:13,199 --> 00:17:17,699
he never went below half health for

436
00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:19,260
months and months like six months 12

437
00:17:17,699 --> 00:17:21,720
months of gaming He's just never been

438
00:17:19,260 --> 00:17:23,579
below half Health but then

439
00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:25,079
uh yeah three of us we fought this hag

440
00:17:23,579 --> 00:17:27,900
and some other creature I wasn't I'm not

441
00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:30,480
sure what it was mum melee focused beast

442
00:17:27,900 --> 00:17:32,040
and yeah between the two of them

443
00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,179
it didn't take once once they got a few

444
00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:37,020
hits off

445
00:17:33,179 --> 00:17:38,820
he was he was down now I I do go the DM

446
00:17:37,020 --> 00:17:40,980
and just tell him I'm invincible and I

447
00:17:38,820 --> 00:17:43,440
can't be killed all the time it's what I

448
00:17:40,980 --> 00:17:44,760
mean by having my character having it

449
00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:47,520
coming it was like he had a big Target

450
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:49,140
around his back but his one final trick

451
00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,760
is there the uh The Ring Of Mine

452
00:17:49,140 --> 00:17:54,059
shielding and when you die your soul

453
00:17:50,760 --> 00:17:55,980
goes into the ring uh so he's

454
00:17:54,059 --> 00:17:57,000
it's kind of still alive he's not he's

455
00:17:55,980 --> 00:17:58,799
still not there there's one last

456
00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:00,299
contingency plan but yeah that that

457
00:17:58,799 --> 00:18:02,700
hacks like

458
00:18:00,299 --> 00:18:04,200
I know I know all too well now how spicy

459
00:18:02,700 --> 00:18:09,140
they can be because it happened to me

460
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:09,140
yeah yeah four days ago

461
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:14,340
more too fresh I think it's about um a

462
00:18:12,539 --> 00:18:16,559
realm Lord as well

463
00:18:14,340 --> 00:18:19,559
um you know Stroud is a realm Lord

464
00:18:16,559 --> 00:18:21,240
um oh God Aslin I'm dragging up some

465
00:18:19,559 --> 00:18:23,880
names here aslan's A Realm Lord there's

466
00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:27,600
you know they could take any form these

467
00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:29,880
pocket Realms I've I've played

468
00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:32,280
um a game session my Dad ran it

469
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:35,940
and I always remember it there were four

470
00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:38,280
of us playing and the entire

471
00:18:35,940 --> 00:18:39,539
One-Shot scenario probably about a four

472
00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:41,940
hour game

473
00:18:39,539 --> 00:18:45,120
was based in the music room of the house

474
00:18:41,940 --> 00:18:47,520
wow with this guy on a piano

475
00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:49,080
we couldn't leave you know you you'd

476
00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:53,580
open the window and there was there was

477
00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:55,020
nothing like hyperspace yeah avoid yeah

478
00:18:53,580 --> 00:18:57,360
you can't stick your hand out because

479
00:18:55,020 --> 00:19:00,840
there's nothing there you know yeah and

480
00:18:57,360 --> 00:19:03,419
we were we were in this room and the

481
00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:05,100
object was to get out somehow

482
00:19:03,419 --> 00:19:06,419
and we were trying of course you know

483
00:19:05,100 --> 00:19:08,460
we've got this guy playing the piano and

484
00:19:06,419 --> 00:19:10,400
we're talking to this guy he's a he's a

485
00:19:08,460 --> 00:19:12,900
you know he's a very well read very

486
00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:14,760
well-bred person he's just playing this

487
00:19:12,900 --> 00:19:17,220
harpsichord and chatting with us and

488
00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:19,440
offering us tea and things like that

489
00:19:17,220 --> 00:19:21,900
and then we part of it was we were made

490
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:24,660
aware that every sort of mini in here

491
00:19:21,900 --> 00:19:27,419
was like an hour out there so you know

492
00:19:24,660 --> 00:19:29,100
if you stayed there long enough you

493
00:19:27,419 --> 00:19:31,260
you eventually when you were released

494
00:19:29,100 --> 00:19:33,480
you just died because you were like 150

495
00:19:31,260 --> 00:19:35,820
years old oh wow yeah so that that was

496
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:38,340
the the urgency to get out and we just

497
00:19:35,820 --> 00:19:40,500
could not figure out how to get out and

498
00:19:38,340 --> 00:19:42,600
um the long story short is this was a

499
00:19:40,500 --> 00:19:44,880
this was a pocket realm from Raven off

500
00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:47,700
that he picked up and used and it was

501
00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:49,740
the harpsichord the harpsichord was evil

502
00:19:47,700 --> 00:19:52,799
and the guy playing the harpsey chord

503
00:19:49,740 --> 00:19:55,140
and the music was creating

504
00:19:52,799 --> 00:19:56,580
you know the realm was sustaining the

505
00:19:55,140 --> 00:19:58,799
realm so you had to destroy the

506
00:19:56,580 --> 00:20:00,900
harpsichord and we didn't get to that

507
00:19:58,799 --> 00:20:02,280
point we got to I think within one or

508
00:20:00,900 --> 00:20:04,500
two hit points of destroying the Heart

509
00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:05,940
School oh wow we never actually did it

510
00:20:04,500 --> 00:20:09,480
we found another way out there was

511
00:20:05,940 --> 00:20:10,620
another way but um yeah I think where

512
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,660
I'm going with this is the you know

513
00:20:10,620 --> 00:20:14,220
realm rules could be anything but the

514
00:20:12,660 --> 00:20:16,260
beauty of a realm Lord is

515
00:20:14,220 --> 00:20:17,940
um strad even if you kill him even

516
00:20:16,260 --> 00:20:20,580
though he's already Undead you know but

517
00:20:17,940 --> 00:20:22,860
even if you property kill him within a

518
00:20:20,580 --> 00:20:24,799
week he's back

519
00:20:22,860 --> 00:20:27,780
um if you go back to the original

520
00:20:24,799 --> 00:20:31,320
ravenloff campaign he would

521
00:20:27,780 --> 00:20:34,799
his soul if you like or lack of Soul his

522
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:37,320
Dark Soul would um inhabit the body of a

523
00:20:34,799 --> 00:20:39,299
local possibly even a dead PC or a

524
00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:40,980
nearly dead PC and then would slowly

525
00:20:39,299 --> 00:20:43,200
over a period of About a Week transform

526
00:20:40,980 --> 00:20:44,580
back into the man himself oh wow he

527
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:49,200
would he would have all his former

528
00:20:44,580 --> 00:20:52,080
memories and um he'd Mark your card so

529
00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:55,500
that was another thing that you know you

530
00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:57,840
the bad guy was undefeatable incense yes

531
00:20:55,500 --> 00:20:59,100
yeah yeah and that adds adds to the

532
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,679
level of

533
00:20:59,100 --> 00:21:03,780
fair if you like I was going to say that

534
00:21:01,679 --> 00:21:06,539
that is such a

535
00:21:03,780 --> 00:21:08,640
like even even if they quote unquote win

536
00:21:06,539 --> 00:21:11,280
they've still not won that is such a

537
00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:13,380
like a evil like Machiavellian level of

538
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:15,419
yeah despair is the best word for it or

539
00:21:13,380 --> 00:21:17,520
you're just like this is that absolutely

540
00:21:15,419 --> 00:21:19,380
what they got what I love about it is

541
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:21,780
that they're going for a theme and it is

542
00:21:19,380 --> 00:21:24,480
they're all in they've jumped all into

543
00:21:21,780 --> 00:21:27,600
that theme like of that depression

544
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:31,260
despair bleakness of like there's no

545
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:33,480
future it permeates everything from the

546
00:21:31,260 --> 00:21:35,700
ground that they walk on interactions to

547
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,559
NPCs all the way up to the big

548
00:21:35,700 --> 00:21:40,100
mechanical crunchy boss fight at the end

549
00:21:37,559 --> 00:21:44,460
that's very gamey is like even that

550
00:21:40,100 --> 00:21:48,120
feeds into the the theme yeah the whole

551
00:21:44,460 --> 00:21:49,919
thing is is circular yeah it it's it's

552
00:21:48,120 --> 00:21:52,500
there and then it goes back to that

553
00:21:49,919 --> 00:21:55,380
question is it a prison for Ben

554
00:21:52,500 --> 00:21:58,559
the evil thing has some

555
00:21:55,380 --> 00:22:00,179
good entity created this just among

556
00:21:58,559 --> 00:22:03,240
these people away

557
00:22:00,179 --> 00:22:06,480
or is it created by their own

558
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:08,640
despair if you read if you read straud's

559
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:12,000
backstory it's it's a tragic love story

560
00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:14,039
it's classical tragical love story but

561
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:15,720
you know is he creating

562
00:22:14,039 --> 00:22:17,760
you know his own

563
00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:20,520
despair is he you know is he a

564
00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:23,179
self-fulfilling prophecy and the same

565
00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:26,039
with the other Realms and that's uh

566
00:22:23,179 --> 00:22:28,320
that's just so different I mean there's

567
00:22:26,039 --> 00:22:30,780
some this I'm up I'm a PC Gamer and a

568
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,340
console gamer as well and there are a

569
00:22:30,780 --> 00:22:34,679
few games out there where you can't

570
00:22:32,340 --> 00:22:35,940
actually win the object is just to

571
00:22:34,679 --> 00:22:41,039
survive

572
00:22:35,940 --> 00:22:44,700
and they're just so addictive

573
00:22:41,039 --> 00:22:46,740
so addictive because you can't win we've

574
00:22:44,700 --> 00:22:49,799
got to do is survive and that's kind of

575
00:22:46,740 --> 00:22:51,600
where Raven off this is yeah you know

576
00:22:49,799 --> 00:22:54,720
you don't just ride off into the sunset

577
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:57,059
with um you know trumpets blaring and

578
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:59,820
flags away with with the pot of gold and

579
00:22:57,059 --> 00:23:02,580
then yeah and the you know the treasure

580
00:22:59,820 --> 00:23:04,500
the treasure or whatever on your own you

581
00:23:02,580 --> 00:23:05,960
don't do that it's like wow we survived

582
00:23:04,500 --> 00:23:08,820
we got out of that one

583
00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:09,960
we'll talk that down to experience you

584
00:23:08,820 --> 00:23:11,640
know and then of course then you've got

585
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:15,000
the whole missed thing

586
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:18,000
whereby you know I I the original one

587
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:20,520
was The Mists you couldn't escape and

588
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:22,860
and I did that to great effect but the

589
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:26,039
trouble is that whenever whenever I was

590
00:23:22,860 --> 00:23:29,340
dming and the party saw even this the

591
00:23:26,039 --> 00:23:31,140
sniff of fog or mist or yeah they just

592
00:23:29,340 --> 00:23:33,179
run the opposite directions they're just

593
00:23:31,140 --> 00:23:34,260
not going anywhere near it so I invented

594
00:23:33,179 --> 00:23:36,480
different ways of getting you into

595
00:23:34,260 --> 00:23:39,179
ravenloft I mean you did that the game

596
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:41,340
we played which was the logging Camp if

597
00:23:39,179 --> 00:23:43,679
you remember yeah I wrote that myself

598
00:23:41,340 --> 00:23:45,659
and I've run it three or four times and

599
00:23:43,679 --> 00:23:48,659
it's always gone in different ways you

600
00:23:45,659 --> 00:23:51,900
had you had the werewolf which you so

601
00:23:48,659 --> 00:23:54,240
rightly you know predicted yeah by the

602
00:23:51,900 --> 00:23:55,820
way you're role-playing with um Ian yeah

603
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:58,500
it was brilliant I loved it thank you

604
00:23:55,820 --> 00:24:00,780
you got you dropped into character just

605
00:23:58,500 --> 00:24:02,580
banged in five minutes you were there

606
00:24:00,780 --> 00:24:04,140
and and it's like and all of a sudden

607
00:24:02,580 --> 00:24:06,840
you've got principles and it's like wow

608
00:24:04,140 --> 00:24:08,179
this is great I'm gonna go with this you

609
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:10,140
know you're having arguments about

610
00:24:08,179 --> 00:24:11,820
personality differences you know

611
00:24:10,140 --> 00:24:14,340
fantastic

612
00:24:11,820 --> 00:24:16,200
so it's really good

613
00:24:14,340 --> 00:24:18,900
um but you know you you

614
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:21,240
where you where you were within that I

615
00:24:18,900 --> 00:24:23,159
mean again spoiler alert I'm hopefully

616
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:24,360
going to write this up properly I am

617
00:24:23,159 --> 00:24:25,559
trying to write it up properly and maybe

618
00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:27,960
put it through drive through I don't

619
00:24:25,559 --> 00:24:30,299
know yeah uh where you were within the

620
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:33,960
logging Camp was was real if you like

621
00:24:30,299 --> 00:24:34,860
yeah but a short distance away you know

622
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:38,159
you

623
00:24:34,860 --> 00:24:40,140
you didn't pick up on it but you were

624
00:24:38,159 --> 00:24:42,600
surrounded by woods but the trees were

625
00:24:40,140 --> 00:24:43,740
different right and you didn't you

626
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:45,299
didn't actually pick up that I mean

627
00:24:43,740 --> 00:24:47,159
again that's the mechanical you know

628
00:24:45,299 --> 00:24:48,780
perception roles or survival roles

629
00:24:47,159 --> 00:24:50,820
something like that but you didn't pick

630
00:24:48,780 --> 00:24:53,700
up on it and it's subtle it's really

631
00:24:50,820 --> 00:24:58,380
subtle but it's this it's you know

632
00:24:53,700 --> 00:25:00,120
ravenloft as as a realm as as as a plane

633
00:24:58,380 --> 00:25:02,100
of existence

634
00:25:00,120 --> 00:25:05,580
again going right back to the original

635
00:25:02,100 --> 00:25:07,860
used to seep in between the cracks of

636
00:25:05,580 --> 00:25:09,780
your reality yeah

637
00:25:07,860 --> 00:25:12,900
um they even they even brought out

638
00:25:09,780 --> 00:25:15,539
um a box set called nightmare lands

639
00:25:12,900 --> 00:25:16,679
um sounds pleasant yeah it was it was

640
00:25:15,539 --> 00:25:18,659
deadly

641
00:25:16,679 --> 00:25:21,000
um and the the main protagonist in there

642
00:25:18,659 --> 00:25:24,720
I can't remember he was basically a

643
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:28,620
nightmare Lord and he used to feed off

644
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:30,840
of nightmares and bad dreams of the real

645
00:25:28,620 --> 00:25:34,200
world but his plane of existence would

646
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:36,779
would exist within you know your REM

647
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:39,000
sleep if you like yeah that's and and

648
00:25:36,779 --> 00:25:41,940
what it was was it was depicted as

649
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:43,620
little bubbles or so or it was like a

650
00:25:41,940 --> 00:25:44,760
beach scene but all these little glass

651
00:25:43,620 --> 00:25:46,919
bubbles

652
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:48,779
and then you could look into and see

653
00:25:46,919 --> 00:25:51,299
people's dreams and he used he used to

654
00:25:48,779 --> 00:25:54,360
psychically feed off it and whatever you

655
00:25:51,299 --> 00:25:55,980
and that was again I I it was one of

656
00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:56,760
those box sets that they brought out I

657
00:25:55,980 --> 00:25:58,620
think

658
00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:00,480
just because they could

659
00:25:58,620 --> 00:26:02,220
I've still got them somewhere but again

660
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,440
that's part of it he just it just

661
00:26:02,220 --> 00:26:07,020
permeates everything so the whole thing

662
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:09,120
is cyclical yeah with what you were

663
00:26:07,020 --> 00:26:10,620
playing right at the end

664
00:26:09,120 --> 00:26:12,360
um I don't know if you picked up on it I

665
00:26:10,620 --> 00:26:14,480
hope you did that you'd actually

666
00:26:12,360 --> 00:26:18,179
transported yes

667
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:19,980
and the guy you met yeah yeah was the

668
00:26:18,179 --> 00:26:22,919
main guy yep

669
00:26:19,980 --> 00:26:27,659
but I think um I think you're a paladin

670
00:26:22,919 --> 00:26:30,779
I I was the Rogue I think uh who I think

671
00:26:27,659 --> 00:26:33,480
died and then the pat my Ian was playing

672
00:26:30,779 --> 00:26:36,419
the Pally who yeah it carried me out to

673
00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:38,760
safety that's right well the body out at

674
00:26:36,419 --> 00:26:40,500
least uh see now see that's another

675
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:44,179
aspect of

676
00:26:40,500 --> 00:26:44,179
some might argue so why did you let go

677
00:26:44,279 --> 00:26:48,840
let the character die but okay

678
00:26:45,900 --> 00:26:51,900
mechanically you failed your saves yeah

679
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:55,799
but it adds depth

680
00:26:51,900 --> 00:26:58,020
huge amounts of depth to to to an

681
00:26:55,799 --> 00:27:01,080
ongoing campaign that you've you've lost

682
00:26:58,020 --> 00:27:03,299
this companion mm-hmm yeah I'm loyal to

683
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:04,559
the story I'm happy if that's if that's

684
00:27:03,299 --> 00:27:07,200
how it happens and that's how it happens

685
00:27:04,559 --> 00:27:09,299
I'd rather the story be you know genuine

686
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:10,440
than there being any any like fluffs

687
00:27:09,299 --> 00:27:12,419
around it that's

688
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:14,640
um true love loyal to the story as I

689
00:27:12,419 --> 00:27:17,220
like to put it so and it also gave the

690
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:19,140
Paladin Ian's character a big huge like

691
00:27:17,220 --> 00:27:21,539
epic moment where he's like in the snow

692
00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:23,460
holding is is the dead body it was

693
00:27:21,539 --> 00:27:25,679
random in you know shouting to this to

694
00:27:23,460 --> 00:27:27,440
the sky you know it's classic you can't

695
00:27:25,679 --> 00:27:31,740
you can't see that yeah

696
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:33,900
the whole you know Crescendo music from

697
00:27:31,740 --> 00:27:36,539
Monty Coney or whoever at the end yeah

698
00:27:33,900 --> 00:27:38,340
yeah and that and that and I I use that

699
00:27:36,539 --> 00:27:41,460
a lot to build

700
00:27:38,340 --> 00:27:43,320
to build passion and to build to

701
00:27:41,460 --> 00:27:46,740
reinforce enemies within the game

702
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:48,000
because it I I found it a time and time

703
00:27:46,740 --> 00:27:50,400
again

704
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,140
where I I do a little bit of that you

705
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:54,779
know maybe a character dies or gets

706
00:27:52,140 --> 00:27:59,820
badly injured or you know on a more

707
00:27:54,779 --> 00:28:02,700
adult theme I've had sacrifices often

708
00:27:59,820 --> 00:28:04,320
not of adults oh well yeah it's yeah and

709
00:28:02,700 --> 00:28:06,539
you you have to be careful with that

710
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:10,080
obviously but you know and it brings it

711
00:28:06,539 --> 00:28:11,700
in and it's it's just like a massive

712
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:14,460
magnetizing

713
00:28:11,700 --> 00:28:16,260
things the party and one or two

714
00:28:14,460 --> 00:28:18,059
characters will often pick up on that

715
00:28:16,260 --> 00:28:19,500
and then all of a sudden wow they've got

716
00:28:18,059 --> 00:28:21,059
some Drive

717
00:28:19,500 --> 00:28:22,679
they've really got some push

718
00:28:21,059 --> 00:28:25,279
you know and then it's that they're

719
00:28:22,679 --> 00:28:25,279
getting

720
00:28:25,620 --> 00:28:30,000
old immersion thing and

721
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,200
I think we're Raven off you have to have

722
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:33,840
that buy-in

723
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:36,480
you know it's one shots are okay but

724
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:39,539
they didn't they they don't tend to be

725
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:42,720
as much fun as as playing it you know a

726
00:28:39,539 --> 00:28:44,039
darker campaign if you like yeah yeah

727
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:46,740
the whole thing the whole thing just

728
00:28:44,039 --> 00:28:51,179
feeds off itself or can feed off itself

729
00:28:46,740 --> 00:28:53,220
as you found out yes one of my a DM from

730
00:28:51,179 --> 00:28:53,760
my other game that I play in

731
00:28:53,220 --> 00:28:55,860
um

732
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,919
I know he DMS another game that I don't

733
00:28:55,860 --> 00:29:00,059
play in that which is in Raven loft or

734
00:28:57,919 --> 00:29:02,400
shadowfell at least and he is very much

735
00:29:00,059 --> 00:29:03,720
reveling in actually he's he I think

736
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,679
he's torn if he's been honest with

737
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:08,039
himself because on the one hand he's

738
00:29:04,679 --> 00:29:10,679
reveling in that oppressive bleakness

739
00:29:08,039 --> 00:29:12,360
and throwing you know exotic strong

740
00:29:10,679 --> 00:29:14,460
creatures his enemies

741
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:16,200
but on the other hand he's like oh they

742
00:29:14,460 --> 00:29:17,940
might die like all the time like this

743
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:21,360
I'm gonna be super careful otherwise

744
00:29:17,940 --> 00:29:24,120
they're just so do they uh so like the

745
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:25,320
stress is just like good I mean in a

746
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:27,240
good way like the good stress of both of

747
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,620
them is both the players and the DMS has

748
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:29,880
increased because it's that we've

749
00:29:28,620 --> 00:29:32,880
actually got a really

750
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:34,080
try to survive here it's now I'm not

751
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,659
just to walk in the park like you're

752
00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:38,399
walking through the forest you survival

753
00:29:36,659 --> 00:29:40,799
check you find berries you eat well

754
00:29:38,399 --> 00:29:44,880
there's a stream moving on it's like no

755
00:29:40,799 --> 00:29:46,620
no streams No Berries no no

756
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:50,220
um and we can use things like exhaustion

757
00:29:46,620 --> 00:29:54,659
levels to great effect to that and and

758
00:29:50,220 --> 00:29:57,240
because it all it all fits it all

759
00:29:54,659 --> 00:29:58,679
adds in and I've I say to people with

760
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,120
the Raven Loft

761
00:29:58,679 --> 00:30:02,820
um sometimes they say what if it's

762
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:05,179
raining we're not going yeah but they

763
00:30:02,820 --> 00:30:09,299
say you know running away is an option

764
00:30:05,179 --> 00:30:11,279
it is it is a genuine option it is okay

765
00:30:09,299 --> 00:30:13,380
to run screaming in the opposite

766
00:30:11,279 --> 00:30:14,460
direction if you feel about what you're

767
00:30:13,380 --> 00:30:17,279
up against

768
00:30:14,460 --> 00:30:19,500
is quite bad and I think that that

769
00:30:17,279 --> 00:30:21,779
addresses a lot of the um the powerful

770
00:30:19,500 --> 00:30:24,659
characters game you can get Bob down in

771
00:30:21,779 --> 00:30:26,820
the mechanics of it you know and

772
00:30:24,659 --> 00:30:28,260
you've probably had a podcast based

773
00:30:26,820 --> 00:30:29,880
around this you know if you start to

774
00:30:28,260 --> 00:30:31,620
stick to the to the mechanics the

775
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:34,200
player's always going to win yeah

776
00:30:31,620 --> 00:30:36,779
because the odds are stacked in their

777
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:40,440
favor yeah yeah if you bring into that

778
00:30:36,779 --> 00:30:42,899
that mysterious storytelling aspect that

779
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:44,399
horror aspect that you know that dark

780
00:30:42,899 --> 00:30:47,460
aspect

781
00:30:44,399 --> 00:30:50,940
um it sort of Beats it up as as a DM

782
00:30:47,460 --> 00:30:53,340
I've had so much fun with it so so much

783
00:30:50,940 --> 00:30:54,960
fun you know I've had the same party

784
00:30:53,340 --> 00:30:57,480
that I spanked

785
00:30:54,960 --> 00:31:00,020
with The Hags

786
00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:02,580
ended up at um

787
00:31:00,020 --> 00:31:04,320
the Amber Temple which I don't know if

788
00:31:02,580 --> 00:31:06,299
you know that

789
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:10,279
um so the Amber Temple without giving

790
00:31:06,299 --> 00:31:12,779
too much away is this ancient

791
00:31:10,279 --> 00:31:15,120
cathedral-like building in the side of a

792
00:31:12,779 --> 00:31:17,940
mountain that that is made out of Amber

793
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:20,039
oh wow so it's building blocks so it's

794
00:31:17,940 --> 00:31:23,419
very impressive yeah

795
00:31:20,039 --> 00:31:25,640
what's even more impressive that's what

796
00:31:23,419 --> 00:31:30,240
imprisoned there

797
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:33,000
are ancient Evil dark gods

798
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:35,580
that have actually been imprisoned it

799
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:37,260
doesn't actually really go into how they

800
00:31:35,580 --> 00:31:40,080
go in prisons but you've got these

801
00:31:37,260 --> 00:31:42,779
little cells and it's like yeah that's

802
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:45,600
that's a really nasty bad guy in there

803
00:31:42,779 --> 00:31:47,700
and he's imprisoned and um

804
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,200
so you've got to be careful there's

805
00:31:47,700 --> 00:31:51,240
there's lots of

806
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,980
you know monsters around and the same

807
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:55,620
party that came in that were very blase

808
00:31:52,980 --> 00:31:58,020
and what have you I I just I just

809
00:31:55,620 --> 00:32:00,480
Twisted the story I twisted a monster a

810
00:31:58,020 --> 00:32:02,039
little bit one of my players got upset

811
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:04,020
because they're not supposed to do that

812
00:32:02,039 --> 00:32:05,600
and I said well the trouble is you're

813
00:32:04,020 --> 00:32:08,279
just going to walk through everything

814
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:11,340
and I explained it to him and he said no

815
00:32:08,279 --> 00:32:13,500
that's fine I'm happy with that and um

816
00:32:11,340 --> 00:32:15,059
I had them actually I is sort of like

817
00:32:13,500 --> 00:32:18,059
this 10th level party who are very

818
00:32:15,059 --> 00:32:20,460
powerful and as a team you know I've

819
00:32:18,059 --> 00:32:23,940
been playing with these guys 15 18 years

820
00:32:20,460 --> 00:32:25,799
and as as a team we work really really

821
00:32:23,940 --> 00:32:28,500
well we all have our own different roles

822
00:32:25,799 --> 00:32:29,159
yeah you know so we can we can take on a

823
00:32:28,500 --> 00:32:31,740
lot

824
00:32:29,159 --> 00:32:34,380
and I had them either sneaking about or

825
00:32:31,740 --> 00:32:35,760
running for cover in this Temple and

826
00:32:34,380 --> 00:32:38,100
that's just Priceless you've got tenth

827
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:41,340
level characters 10th level Mages

828
00:32:38,100 --> 00:32:43,200
kitchen up their their robes running

829
00:32:41,340 --> 00:32:45,120
hell for leather because they're being

830
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,740
shot at by something they can't see or

831
00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:48,659
yeah and what have you and then you've

832
00:32:46,740 --> 00:32:50,039
and you've got you know the Frontline

833
00:32:48,659 --> 00:32:52,260
Fighters going

834
00:32:50,039 --> 00:32:55,020
because I I'm not going in there you

835
00:32:52,260 --> 00:32:56,460
know and and that's and and that's a DM

836
00:32:55,020 --> 00:32:58,860
that's that's that's beautiful that's

837
00:32:56,460 --> 00:33:02,399
priceless because and you can have this

838
00:32:58,860 --> 00:33:04,440
standoff with them for for hours

839
00:33:02,399 --> 00:33:05,580
and it makes them think and at the end

840
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:07,980
of it I'm

841
00:33:05,580 --> 00:33:09,480
you know not trying to blow my own Trump

842
00:33:07,980 --> 00:33:11,399
or anything like that but at the end of

843
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,539
it they said God that was awesome but

844
00:33:11,399 --> 00:33:15,019
I've never had a game like that it's

845
00:33:12,539 --> 00:33:16,919
awesome and they still talk about it and

846
00:33:15,019 --> 00:33:19,019
this was

847
00:33:16,919 --> 00:33:22,200
I don't know four or five years ago wow

848
00:33:19,019 --> 00:33:24,899
yeah it it's it's that impact and being

849
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:26,580
allowed to do that yeah I love those

850
00:33:24,899 --> 00:33:28,380
moments where there's that cascading

851
00:33:26,580 --> 00:33:31,039
shall we run that'll be running we're

852
00:33:28,380 --> 00:33:34,440
running now okay everyone everyone runs

853
00:33:31,039 --> 00:33:35,760
are we going yeah that is starting from

854
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:38,519
one person being like is this is this

855
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:40,820
time to run to then so rapidly Cascades

856
00:33:38,519 --> 00:33:44,530
like yeah everyone's dashing

857
00:33:40,820 --> 00:33:47,799
yeah there's a there's a classic moments

858
00:33:44,530 --> 00:33:47,799
[Music]

859
00:33:47,899 --> 00:33:52,940
thank you

860
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:56,700
[Music]

861
00:33:52,940 --> 00:34:00,419
as I said earlier on this cassistrad and

862
00:33:56,700 --> 00:34:03,799
stuff is never played in it properly

863
00:34:00,419 --> 00:34:06,360
played nebron before I've run everyone

864
00:34:03,799 --> 00:34:08,940
adjacent things at my Homebrew campaign

865
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:10,800
uh obviously kind of Forgotten realmsy

866
00:34:08,940 --> 00:34:13,619
you know traditional fantasy stuff I'm

867
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:16,320
very familiar with yeah but yeah for

868
00:34:13,619 --> 00:34:18,119
over here and that I I have the least

869
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:19,200
experience with and everyone keeps

870
00:34:18,119 --> 00:34:22,020
telling me it's great and I've also got

871
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:23,399
this reverence for it now that I almost

872
00:34:22,020 --> 00:34:26,520
don't want to read it just in case it

873
00:34:23,399 --> 00:34:29,159
spoils it for me you know uh

874
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:30,179
but one one question I had then all the

875
00:34:29,159 --> 00:34:32,580
way back

876
00:34:30,179 --> 00:34:34,740
but in in previous episodes was it like

877
00:34:32,580 --> 00:34:36,480
law I think maybe on a geography and

878
00:34:34,740 --> 00:34:39,300
stuff where the guests have educated me

879
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:41,760
on where things sit in the world and how

880
00:34:39,300 --> 00:34:44,220
the history of the Forgotten Realms and

881
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:46,200
stuff has has happened because that's a

882
00:34:44,220 --> 00:34:48,599
weakness of mine

883
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:50,159
um very much not into the not read any

884
00:34:48,599 --> 00:34:52,139
books or fiction or anything until very

885
00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:55,020
much let me let me get my Lego blocks

886
00:34:52,139 --> 00:34:57,240
and create my own world so how does

887
00:34:55,020 --> 00:34:59,660
where does ravenloft end and shadowfell

888
00:34:57,240 --> 00:35:02,580
begin or where does borovia end and

889
00:34:59,660 --> 00:35:04,320
ravenloth begin like how how are these

890
00:35:02,580 --> 00:35:07,680
three Shadow film or overgrown Raven

891
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:09,900
lost how those three things fit together

892
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,820
wow do you know what I don't really know

893
00:35:09,900 --> 00:35:14,359
um because I like you I've never read

894
00:35:11,820 --> 00:35:17,640
any of the books you know the whole

895
00:35:14,359 --> 00:35:19,440
Lord's soft right yeah that they did uh

896
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,740
that's another great uh that's a death

897
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:21,740
knight

898
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:26,940
they are awesome absolutely just if you

899
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:30,359
do see one of them just talk nicely to

900
00:35:26,940 --> 00:35:32,400
it yeah but yeah where does it start

901
00:35:30,359 --> 00:35:36,540
what is it see I'm very much I'm going

902
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:39,240
back yes so I I prefer the older startup

903
00:35:36,540 --> 00:35:41,760
I I'm not a I'm not a fan of things

904
00:35:39,240 --> 00:35:44,880
where that stops that starts and it's

905
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:47,520
clean cut I'm not yeah the whole purpose

906
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:49,320
me of Raven off then it's whole

907
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:50,220
genre if you like if that's the right

908
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,140
word

909
00:35:50,220 --> 00:35:53,099
is that it can be anywhere and

910
00:35:52,140 --> 00:35:56,220
everywhere

911
00:35:53,099 --> 00:35:58,079
um and and it's this it's this thing

912
00:35:56,220 --> 00:36:01,079
that's growing

913
00:35:58,079 --> 00:36:04,079
um and and it wants more once more I

914
00:36:01,079 --> 00:36:07,200
mean the I think it was the third

915
00:36:04,079 --> 00:36:09,599
I think it was Third Edition or 3.5

916
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:12,540
where they first started to coalesce a

917
00:36:09,599 --> 00:36:15,300
little bit more and give it some some

918
00:36:12,540 --> 00:36:17,160
geography some physicality yeah yeah

919
00:36:15,300 --> 00:36:19,020
physicality is a good one

920
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:20,820
um and they had this great category it

921
00:36:19,020 --> 00:36:22,560
was called the Great cataclysm where

922
00:36:20,820 --> 00:36:25,320
various things

923
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:27,900
you know happened and and you know this

924
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:30,359
realm disappeared and that realm became

925
00:36:27,900 --> 00:36:32,040
you know it came into being and whatever

926
00:36:30,359 --> 00:36:33,540
and then there's things like if you go

927
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:36,060
again you go back to segnition there was

928
00:36:33,540 --> 00:36:37,980
a complete box set on the islands of

929
00:36:36,060 --> 00:36:40,920
Terror the Isle of Terror and there's

930
00:36:37,980 --> 00:36:43,200
there's there's a whole archipelago of

931
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:45,420
of these islands that are all just

932
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:47,280
little dotted Realms you know with with

933
00:36:45,420 --> 00:36:48,900
different themes as you know there's

934
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:52,619
there's a swamp theme there's there's a

935
00:36:48,900 --> 00:36:53,280
prehistoric jungles of child yeah you

936
00:36:52,619 --> 00:36:55,800
know

937
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:57,960
um and and there's

938
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:59,880
it's always been it as far as I'm

939
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:01,980
concerned it's always been everywhere

940
00:36:59,880 --> 00:37:03,720
the fact that they've attached it to the

941
00:37:01,980 --> 00:37:06,420
shadowfell now and it's part of the

942
00:37:03,720 --> 00:37:07,920
Shadow fell I'm not quite sure what they

943
00:37:06,420 --> 00:37:10,740
did they probably probably just to give

944
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:13,320
it some physicality or tangibility or or

945
00:37:10,740 --> 00:37:15,540
you know I mean who knows where they go

946
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:17,040
with these things but I see it as

947
00:37:15,540 --> 00:37:20,040
everywhere I don't know I don't see it

948
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:21,660
as a singular place it's it's it's a

949
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:25,920
plane of existence but where that plane

950
00:37:21,660 --> 00:37:29,400
of existence is yeah who knows one thing

951
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:31,619
one thing that I think obviously I'm

952
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:33,000
familiar with fifth edition is that it

953
00:37:31,619 --> 00:37:34,680
is very

954
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:37,200
from what I've understand and what I've

955
00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:38,880
read it's very compartmentalized so that

956
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:40,740
like to get to another plane of

957
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,359
existence it's like a whole bloody six

958
00:37:40,740 --> 00:37:44,280
level spell and you blink and then

959
00:37:42,359 --> 00:37:46,980
you're there and it is that hard cut and

960
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:48,300
I know that there are Gates or portal

961
00:37:46,980 --> 00:37:49,980
you know that exist on the material

962
00:37:48,300 --> 00:37:52,079
plane where it's kind of you can kind of

963
00:37:49,980 --> 00:37:53,520
walk through it and it seeps it seeps

964
00:37:52,079 --> 00:37:57,900
through and effects like three miles

965
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:59,880
around it yes but even still that's very

966
00:37:57,900 --> 00:38:02,460
static it's like a place you go there

967
00:37:59,880 --> 00:38:04,920
and that is the portal to the plane of

968
00:38:02,460 --> 00:38:06,480
fire because it's in a volcano what a

969
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,940
surprise uh that's surrounded by fire

970
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,320
and lava okie dokie I can't think of a

971
00:38:08,940 --> 00:38:11,579
better place for an entry to support or

972
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:13,859
to the plane of Fire

973
00:38:11,579 --> 00:38:16,320
but I there is something very much to be

974
00:38:13,859 --> 00:38:19,500
said about that I love the idea of this

975
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:23,400
the pervasive threat and oppressiveness

976
00:38:19,500 --> 00:38:26,099
of ravenloth not only in ravenloft but

977
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:28,200
it's this ever overarching threat even

978
00:38:26,099 --> 00:38:30,119
on the material plane like anywhere we

979
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:31,740
go we could go into someone's basement

980
00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:33,960
and just because of what's happened

981
00:38:31,740 --> 00:38:36,000
there that every day every step is a

982
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:39,420
threat I've done being in this miserable

983
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:41,820
Place yeah it's and it's it's you know

984
00:38:39,420 --> 00:38:43,680
and and quite often you can read it as

985
00:38:41,820 --> 00:38:45,599
you are drawn there

986
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:47,760
um you know particularly politically if

987
00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:49,680
you've got a paladin in the party then

988
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:52,380
I'm going to say this anyway

989
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:55,380
if you've got a palette in Raven Loft

990
00:38:52,380 --> 00:38:56,660
it's like having a big orange flashing

991
00:38:55,380 --> 00:39:00,420
Beacon

992
00:38:56,660 --> 00:39:02,640
it's just like everybody knows where you

993
00:39:00,420 --> 00:39:04,560
are and well the bad guys do and and

994
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,420
again go right back to their if a

995
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:08,099
paladin into the realm strawberry

996
00:39:06,420 --> 00:39:10,140
immediately know where they were

997
00:39:08,099 --> 00:39:12,839
and always know where they are wow

998
00:39:10,140 --> 00:39:14,099
because because your ultimate good is

999
00:39:12,839 --> 00:39:16,859
Ultimate bad

1000
00:39:14,099 --> 00:39:20,099
so you've got this yin and yang and his

1001
00:39:16,859 --> 00:39:22,820
his minions his spies as well

1002
00:39:20,099 --> 00:39:26,820
report back to him the crows the Wolves

1003
00:39:22,820 --> 00:39:28,680
you know they all report back to him so

1004
00:39:26,820 --> 00:39:31,260
you know you you could be you can be

1005
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:35,760
I've had I've had parties drawn into

1006
00:39:31,260 --> 00:39:38,460
ravenloft on on false invitations

1007
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:40,619
just literally so we can play

1008
00:39:38,460 --> 00:39:42,000
you know and and they've been on the

1009
00:39:40,619 --> 00:39:43,740
they've been on the prime material plant

1010
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:46,140
I'll just bring him in do you know what

1011
00:39:43,740 --> 00:39:48,660
players don't seem to mind they just

1012
00:39:46,140 --> 00:39:50,940
don't they can kind of see it coming

1013
00:39:48,660 --> 00:39:52,740
they kind of know you know

1014
00:39:50,940 --> 00:39:54,980
okay we're playing Ravel off I've got

1015
00:39:52,740 --> 00:39:58,619
the ravenloth screen up

1016
00:39:54,980 --> 00:40:01,339
giveaway big neon sign Raven left behind

1017
00:39:58,619 --> 00:40:01,339
you yeah yeah

1018
00:40:01,619 --> 00:40:05,940
uh they know they kind of know it's

1019
00:40:03,420 --> 00:40:07,680
coming the fun the fun I have and the

1020
00:40:05,940 --> 00:40:10,500
fun they have is is

1021
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:13,440
building that subtlety into it so it's

1022
00:40:10,500 --> 00:40:15,839
not it's not blindingly obvious and then

1023
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:19,740
and like I said that that pervasiveness

1024
00:40:15,839 --> 00:40:21,660
is You're Not Safe you are not safe and

1025
00:40:19,740 --> 00:40:23,099
again that's that's part of what I like

1026
00:40:21,660 --> 00:40:25,140
about it I mean maybe that's just why

1027
00:40:23,099 --> 00:40:26,640
how I play but you know other other

1028
00:40:25,140 --> 00:40:28,440
planes are very much there you know

1029
00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:30,960
eberron is very much there I mean there

1030
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:33,720
is a there is or was

1031
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:36,240
an add-on where you could add a cup of

1032
00:40:33,720 --> 00:40:38,940
Raven Loft esque

1033
00:40:36,240 --> 00:40:41,400
area to eberron there was this crossover

1034
00:40:38,940 --> 00:40:43,440
they did this one okay because Rave loft

1035
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:46,440
is so huge it's a thing on its own it's

1036
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:50,099
got its own yeah entity and they've done

1037
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:53,220
that and they they did a Victorian

1038
00:40:50,099 --> 00:40:56,160
style called The Mask of the Red Death

1039
00:40:53,220 --> 00:41:00,480
which was 19

1040
00:40:56,160 --> 00:41:02,099
10 19 20s 1890s you know within that

1041
00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:03,900
sort of time frame

1042
00:41:02,099 --> 00:41:04,920
and it was and it was it was Gothic

1043
00:41:03,900 --> 00:41:07,140
horror

1044
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:10,200
you know so there's that whole you know

1045
00:41:07,140 --> 00:41:13,380
it's it's spawned sorry such diversity

1046
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:16,140
across all of of the planes

1047
00:41:13,380 --> 00:41:19,079
so to me it is everywhere because it is

1048
00:41:16,140 --> 00:41:21,960
everywhere you know and and that's

1049
00:41:19,079 --> 00:41:24,480
that's the fun of it that is that is the

1050
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:27,480
fun of it it's just as I said as a DM

1051
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:29,400
you can have so so much fun I've I've

1052
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:31,560
tpk parties

1053
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:34,320
you know on a whim

1054
00:41:31,560 --> 00:41:37,440
um not on the whim but you know

1055
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:41,099
I've got them to a place where they are

1056
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:43,619
absolutely backed into a corner you know

1057
00:41:41,099 --> 00:41:46,380
and you've got this this big bad vampire

1058
00:41:43,619 --> 00:41:49,140
and he is a vampire yeah you know and

1059
00:41:46,380 --> 00:41:51,480
and he's just he's just playing with

1060
00:41:49,140 --> 00:41:54,060
them and toys with them and

1061
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:56,099
things like that it's there is a lot of

1062
00:41:54,060 --> 00:41:58,140
humor in there as well you know I've

1063
00:41:56,099 --> 00:42:01,140
there there is a there's a bit in in

1064
00:41:58,140 --> 00:42:01,980
strad where he he sends or he can send

1065
00:42:01,140 --> 00:42:05,160
his

1066
00:42:01,980 --> 00:42:07,760
coach and four horses down to the party

1067
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:10,260
and basically invites them up for dinner

1068
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,640
and I've done that and I've I've had the

1069
00:42:10,260 --> 00:42:13,140
parts of climbing the coaching go and

1070
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:16,140
have dinner with the man you know and

1071
00:42:13,140 --> 00:42:19,079
come away and and and I've had a party

1072
00:42:16,140 --> 00:42:20,339
that refused to get in the coach you

1073
00:42:19,079 --> 00:42:21,900
know and that that was that was an

1074
00:42:20,339 --> 00:42:23,520
interesting one and it's just like okay

1075
00:42:21,900 --> 00:42:24,720
how do I do with this you know and they

1076
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,619
just literally refuse to get in the

1077
00:42:24,720 --> 00:42:28,380
coach

1078
00:42:25,619 --> 00:42:29,400
and then I heard the story of another

1079
00:42:28,380 --> 00:42:31,320
party

1080
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:34,040
um the coach was sent to them so they

1081
00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:37,500
probably killed all the horses for lunch

1082
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:39,119
just to annoy the guy you know and

1083
00:42:37,500 --> 00:42:43,619
you can have a lot of fun with it it's

1084
00:42:39,119 --> 00:42:45,780
it's very flexible very very flexible uh

1085
00:42:43,619 --> 00:42:47,400
yeah I just uh that's the problem with

1086
00:42:45,780 --> 00:42:49,680
doing this bloody show is that I come

1087
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:51,240
away every time with like oh I gotta I

1088
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,440
gotta add another six months to my

1089
00:42:51,240 --> 00:42:54,619
campaign because I want to do all this

1090
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:56,760
extra new stuff now that I've uh

1091
00:42:54,619 --> 00:42:58,200
you don't you don't have to do six

1092
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:00,240
months you can you can do a couple of

1093
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:02,460
sessions I mean I I've used it I mean

1094
00:43:00,240 --> 00:43:05,520
good friend of mine Simon who was also

1095
00:43:02,460 --> 00:43:07,859
at the fabisham car yeah he was running

1096
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:10,560
um yeah I think he was running coriolis

1097
00:43:07,859 --> 00:43:12,900
which is a Sci-Fi game and

1098
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:16,200
um we've doubled the end we've swapped

1099
00:43:12,900 --> 00:43:19,859
DMS and then he's literally brought

1100
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:21,960
his ongoing campaign to a pause you know

1101
00:43:19,859 --> 00:43:23,400
work gets in the way as you know you

1102
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:25,560
know often the higher up the food chain

1103
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:27,960
you are the more demands they they place

1104
00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:29,880
on you indeed or no

1105
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:31,740
um so he said look after John I've got

1106
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,660
to back away for you know can we can you

1107
00:43:31,740 --> 00:43:35,579
take over three months and we've

1108
00:43:33,660 --> 00:43:38,940
transitioned across and it's literally

1109
00:43:35,579 --> 00:43:41,040
gone into a basement as you said

1110
00:43:38,940 --> 00:43:42,599
and you know you come out and it's like

1111
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:45,480
hang on this is this isn't Kansas

1112
00:43:42,599 --> 00:43:47,640
anymore you know where the hell are we

1113
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:49,680
and then you drop it on them and they're

1114
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:51,060
like and then the penny drops and it's

1115
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:55,020
like ah

1116
00:43:51,060 --> 00:43:57,319
yeah you know uh so yeah is this is this

1117
00:43:55,020 --> 00:43:59,280
what I think it is I think it is

1118
00:43:57,319 --> 00:44:01,200
you know and then you can do that and

1119
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:03,000
then you can just drop people back into

1120
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:05,520
so you don't necessarily have to do a

1121
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:07,200
six-month campaign because I do one

1122
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,660
thing that does does a little irritate

1123
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:12,480
me is the curse of strad is is the

1124
00:44:09,660 --> 00:44:14,280
latest Incarnation yeah but there's

1125
00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:16,560
um House of Straub is another big one

1126
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:20,400
expedition to Castle Raven Loft I think

1127
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:22,140
was was the first campaign okay based

1128
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:24,900
around Ravel often and as you know

1129
00:44:22,140 --> 00:44:27,180
campaign books are they're thick books

1130
00:44:24,900 --> 00:44:30,420
and you know there's there's six nine

1131
00:44:27,180 --> 00:44:32,880
twelve 18 months worth of play Within

1132
00:44:30,420 --> 00:44:34,859
that and you quite often get people

1133
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:37,260
saying I'm just going to run this

1134
00:44:34,859 --> 00:44:40,200
and it's like yeah it doesn't work like

1135
00:44:37,260 --> 00:44:42,240
that because you need you've you've got

1136
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:43,319
that richness and that history and to

1137
00:44:42,240 --> 00:44:45,780
make it

1138
00:44:43,319 --> 00:44:47,460
to make it worthwhile you need to you

1139
00:44:45,780 --> 00:44:50,760
need to sort of study that a bit and get

1140
00:44:47,460 --> 00:44:52,980
into it yeah drop in and out I mean the

1141
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:54,720
original game was you went into the

1142
00:44:52,980 --> 00:44:56,579
Mists you couldn't get out you defeated

1143
00:44:54,720 --> 00:44:58,619
the bad guy you got out of the Mists it

1144
00:44:56,579 --> 00:45:01,619
would release you because the realm

1145
00:44:58,619 --> 00:45:03,780
rewards control the borders so straud

1146
00:45:01,619 --> 00:45:06,660
himself controls the myth that doesn't

1147
00:45:03,780 --> 00:45:09,000
allow you out so once he's you know dead

1148
00:45:06,660 --> 00:45:10,920
temporarily dead the Mis dissipate you

1149
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:13,140
can walk back out of ravenloth that that

1150
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:15,660
was the whole initial idea going in and

1151
00:45:13,140 --> 00:45:17,819
coming out which kind of works for for

1152
00:45:15,660 --> 00:45:19,619
shorter campaigns and you can do that in

1153
00:45:17,819 --> 00:45:22,440
a subtle way if you again if you find

1154
00:45:19,619 --> 00:45:26,339
these these portals these mystical

1155
00:45:22,440 --> 00:45:28,319
portals um you can you can cross over so

1156
00:45:26,339 --> 00:45:31,440
you can you can drop it in and out of it

1157
00:45:28,319 --> 00:45:34,800
as you see fit just to run it cold as a

1158
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:36,359
campaign it's kind of lost it's kind of

1159
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:39,900
you know you're paying what

1160
00:45:36,359 --> 00:45:42,359
30 40 pound for a book or what sort of

1161
00:45:39,900 --> 00:45:44,099
45 50 from the States you know that's

1162
00:45:42,359 --> 00:45:45,240
that's a chunk of money

1163
00:45:44,099 --> 00:45:47,940
it's a chunk of money and there's a lot

1164
00:45:45,240 --> 00:45:49,740
of prep time there you know it's

1165
00:45:47,940 --> 00:45:52,140
just dabble with it just play with it

1166
00:45:49,740 --> 00:45:53,760
just do what you want but you don't have

1167
00:45:52,140 --> 00:45:56,160
to run the campaign there's there's

1168
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,240
plenty of bits out there and there's

1169
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,520
plenty of

1170
00:45:57,240 --> 00:46:02,099
Source material that you can draw on

1171
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:03,900
just to do that and you know for people

1172
00:46:02,099 --> 00:46:05,760
that like home brewing

1173
00:46:03,900 --> 00:46:07,740
um you can you can make your own role

1174
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:10,740
you can put anybody else in there you

1175
00:46:07,740 --> 00:46:13,680
know I have got a character that is in

1176
00:46:10,740 --> 00:46:14,700
ravenloft from one of my players and she

1177
00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:18,119
is there

1178
00:46:14,700 --> 00:46:20,040
he wanted to retire the character and um

1179
00:46:18,119 --> 00:46:21,720
we we did and it was a big fight at the

1180
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:23,819
Amber Temple right at the very end yeah

1181
00:46:21,720 --> 00:46:26,460
and he he said I'm going to retire Livvy

1182
00:46:23,819 --> 00:46:28,619
I'm going to retire my character and and

1183
00:46:26,460 --> 00:46:31,440
she is now

1184
00:46:28,619 --> 00:46:33,480
part of his domain

1185
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:35,099
and she's trying to work out or he's

1186
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:37,619
trying to work out

1187
00:46:35,099 --> 00:46:40,680
is he a bad guy is she a bad guy because

1188
00:46:37,619 --> 00:46:44,040
she wasn't exactly you know an angel in

1189
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:46,079
what she did or is she the good guy and

1190
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:48,540
you know and and we've got this ongoing

1191
00:46:46,079 --> 00:46:50,280
one-to-one that we pick up every now and

1192
00:46:48,540 --> 00:46:52,560
then you know we'll have a three or four

1193
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:55,319
hour session just a pair of us and it's

1194
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:56,819
pretty much pure role play about what

1195
00:46:55,319 --> 00:46:58,440
she's doing why she's there what does

1196
00:46:56,819 --> 00:47:00,420
she want to do you know this is what's

1197
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:03,000
going on and you're building this

1198
00:47:00,420 --> 00:47:05,040
backstory and eventually we are going to

1199
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,660
get to a point where it's just going to

1200
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:08,520
be a one-on-one and it's it's going to

1201
00:47:06,660 --> 00:47:10,440
be another boss fight yeah that's what

1202
00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:12,540
we're building to and that's just pure

1203
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:15,240
red Loft you know that's just purely off

1204
00:47:12,540 --> 00:47:17,579
the back of that that's the power of it

1205
00:47:15,240 --> 00:47:21,480
mm-hmm that is the power of it it's it's

1206
00:47:17,579 --> 00:47:24,359
it's huge it's absolutely huge but you

1207
00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:26,220
can it's so versatile you can you know

1208
00:47:24,359 --> 00:47:28,500
things are fair run and you know they've

1209
00:47:26,220 --> 00:47:30,420
Forgotten Realms and eberron

1210
00:47:28,500 --> 00:47:32,099
there's quite a lot of set things I mean

1211
00:47:30,420 --> 00:47:35,220
particularly with everyone there's a lot

1212
00:47:32,099 --> 00:47:37,020
of the different houses the politics yes

1213
00:47:35,220 --> 00:47:38,880
I don't really do politics

1214
00:47:37,020 --> 00:47:41,040
none of my characters do politics really

1215
00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:43,800
which is you know strange

1216
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:45,599
um and I I get I get bogged down in all

1217
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:47,460
that you know this house doesn't like

1218
00:47:45,599 --> 00:47:49,140
that house because of their house Condor

1219
00:47:47,460 --> 00:47:51,480
I can go and does it yeah and then

1220
00:47:49,140 --> 00:47:53,280
you've got a lot of you know you would

1221
00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:55,500
you would do as house gun direct you

1222
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:58,260
would do this you know yeah yeah and

1223
00:47:55,500 --> 00:48:01,140
it's it's not rigid but it's it's fairly

1224
00:47:58,260 --> 00:48:04,140
linear in some aspects whereas ravenloft

1225
00:48:01,140 --> 00:48:07,020
is is just you know it's just a complete

1226
00:48:04,140 --> 00:48:09,180
free-for-all that that reminded me of um

1227
00:48:07,020 --> 00:48:11,339
talking different houses conflicts with

1228
00:48:09,180 --> 00:48:13,800
each other I'm I'm currently preparing

1229
00:48:11,339 --> 00:48:15,300
an underdark area for one of the

1230
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:16,440
remaining chapters in my Homebrew

1231
00:48:15,300 --> 00:48:18,780
campaign and they're going to go to like

1232
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:21,420
the drow City yeah and I've made a bunch

1233
00:48:18,780 --> 00:48:23,040
of like five houses in there that each

1234
00:48:21,420 --> 00:48:25,680
specialize in like a different form of

1235
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:27,000
you know one's like just Warcraft ones

1236
00:48:25,680 --> 00:48:29,280
like assassination ones like poison

1237
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:30,720
craft another house is torture but the

1238
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:31,680
simplest thing was they all just they

1239
00:48:30,720 --> 00:48:33,300
all hate each other so they're always

1240
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:34,680
fighting against the drought Society is

1241
00:48:33,300 --> 00:48:36,240
you know historically they're always

1242
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,140
trying to murder and assassinate each

1243
00:48:36,240 --> 00:48:38,640
other and all that kind of stuff yeah

1244
00:48:37,140 --> 00:48:40,440
yeah so that was actually quite

1245
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:41,579
refreshingly simple because it was like

1246
00:48:40,440 --> 00:48:42,900
I actually don't need any politics

1247
00:48:41,579 --> 00:48:45,800
because they all share the same politics

1248
00:48:42,900 --> 00:48:47,359
of we want to kill each other and that's

1249
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:49,920
simple

1250
00:48:47,359 --> 00:48:51,480
there's no don't have to remember it and

1251
00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:52,500
then throw it characters in there they

1252
00:48:51,480 --> 00:48:54,359
all were

1253
00:48:52,500 --> 00:48:56,940
they've got to negotiate between the

1254
00:48:54,359 --> 00:48:58,440
houses yes yes something I've got the

1255
00:48:56,940 --> 00:49:00,359
finer details but yes I'm looking

1256
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:02,040
forward to uh showing them each

1257
00:49:00,359 --> 00:49:04,980
different house in other words grotesque

1258
00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:06,900
Glory there one thing I wanted to I'd

1259
00:49:04,980 --> 00:49:08,700
like we're going off peace because I

1260
00:49:06,900 --> 00:49:12,420
want to get your thoughts on something

1261
00:49:08,700 --> 00:49:15,359
but my one of my players is a warlock

1262
00:49:12,420 --> 00:49:18,119
and it his Patron is the Raven Queen

1263
00:49:15,359 --> 00:49:19,859
again very much showing my ignorance

1264
00:49:18,119 --> 00:49:21,720
here in terms of like how it all fits

1265
00:49:19,859 --> 00:49:24,119
together I've just kind of like

1266
00:49:21,720 --> 00:49:26,160
get it off but I mean Forgotten Realms

1267
00:49:24,119 --> 00:49:28,619
Wiki and take that as gospel half the

1268
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:30,660
time um how does have you got any

1269
00:49:28,619 --> 00:49:33,359
familiarity with with the Raven Queen

1270
00:49:30,660 --> 00:49:35,280
and how they fit into but I feel like

1271
00:49:33,359 --> 00:49:37,319
they're cut maybe I'm getting like my

1272
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:38,460
shadow fell maybe she's like more Shadow

1273
00:49:37,319 --> 00:49:40,380
fell and when they've brought it all

1274
00:49:38,460 --> 00:49:42,780
together there's now

1275
00:49:40,380 --> 00:49:45,359
the streams have crossed and

1276
00:49:42,780 --> 00:49:47,280
they're all kind of this similar I'm not

1277
00:49:45,359 --> 00:49:49,200
sure if you've got any thoughts there

1278
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:50,940
I'll say this is really interesting

1279
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:52,920
because the character I was talking

1280
00:49:50,940 --> 00:49:57,420
about Livy

1281
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:58,220
is a warlock whose Patron is the Raven

1282
00:49:57,420 --> 00:50:00,540
Queen

1283
00:49:58,220 --> 00:50:01,740
so it's exactly what you're talking

1284
00:50:00,540 --> 00:50:06,119
about now

1285
00:50:01,740 --> 00:50:09,720
Livy's backstory is that she no longer

1286
00:50:06,119 --> 00:50:12,839
wants to serve the Raven Queen

1287
00:50:09,720 --> 00:50:14,460
so this is how I dealt with that if I

1288
00:50:12,839 --> 00:50:17,040
tell you how I dealt with it it might

1289
00:50:14,460 --> 00:50:19,680
give you an Insight of what I think so

1290
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:22,200
the Raven Queen when you're in when

1291
00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:24,240
you're in ravenloft there is a school of

1292
00:50:22,200 --> 00:50:26,940
thought and I use this and I use it

1293
00:50:24,240 --> 00:50:28,859
mechanically on a dice roll

1294
00:50:26,940 --> 00:50:32,040
because of

1295
00:50:28,859 --> 00:50:35,640
the evil nature of the realm if you like

1296
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:38,400
if you do something nasty

1297
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:42,480
quite often it can be magnified

1298
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:43,200
so you might cast a spell like told the

1299
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:43,859
dead

1300
00:50:43,200 --> 00:50:46,800
um

1301
00:50:43,859 --> 00:50:49,380
yeah lovely spell very simple

1302
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,700
but I I ran this in the game and and

1303
00:50:49,380 --> 00:50:52,819
this will bring you around to the Raven

1304
00:50:50,700 --> 00:50:55,859
queen as well so keep me on track

1305
00:50:52,819 --> 00:50:59,940
I can go off peace sometimes myself

1306
00:50:55,859 --> 00:51:01,500
um so then we cast told the dead because

1307
00:50:59,940 --> 00:51:04,200
of the nature of the spell and what it

1308
00:51:01,500 --> 00:51:07,079
was doing I would roll the dice and I

1309
00:51:04,200 --> 00:51:09,540
gave it something like 20 chance if I

1310
00:51:07,079 --> 00:51:10,859
rolled under 20 it was actually more

1311
00:51:09,540 --> 00:51:13,619
effective

1312
00:51:10,859 --> 00:51:15,540
did more damage slightly more damage you

1313
00:51:13,619 --> 00:51:18,900
know not game changing but enough

1314
00:51:15,540 --> 00:51:20,280
but the toll of the Bell yeah was a much

1315
00:51:18,900 --> 00:51:22,920
louder

1316
00:51:20,280 --> 00:51:25,559
the drawback on that was it it attracts

1317
00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:28,020
whatever wants to listen to it or hears

1318
00:51:25,559 --> 00:51:29,520
it so so that was that so that was that

1319
00:51:28,020 --> 00:51:32,160
was a that was a little mechanic that I

1320
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:34,079
dropped in Libby's background is she no

1321
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:37,500
longer wants to serve the Rival Queen

1322
00:51:34,079 --> 00:51:40,140
and once she wants out basically but as

1323
00:51:37,500 --> 00:51:43,079
you know she's made a pact you know pack

1324
00:51:40,140 --> 00:51:45,420
sword and all this yeah yeah so the

1325
00:51:43,079 --> 00:51:47,760
whole thing is is is very entwined and

1326
00:51:45,420 --> 00:51:50,460
it's very very difficult to get away

1327
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:53,339
but she's on she's on barova she's in

1328
00:51:50,460 --> 00:51:55,380
ravenloft so you've got okay yes there's

1329
00:51:53,339 --> 00:51:57,359
the shadow fell there you know and

1330
00:51:55,380 --> 00:51:59,040
you've got borovia there and you've got

1331
00:51:57,359 --> 00:52:00,720
the Raven Queen over here but then

1332
00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:04,260
you've got somebody like straud going

1333
00:52:00,720 --> 00:52:05,579
hang on a minute this is my backyard

1334
00:52:04,260 --> 00:52:07,740
and

1335
00:52:05,579 --> 00:52:11,160
part of it was

1336
00:52:07,740 --> 00:52:13,859
we had another character who was a half

1337
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:14,880
or Barbarian played by another friend of

1338
00:52:13,859 --> 00:52:18,480
mine

1339
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:19,859
who who didn't get on with Libby you

1340
00:52:18,480 --> 00:52:21,780
know there wasn't

1341
00:52:19,859 --> 00:52:24,180
a lot of animosity there but he didn't

1342
00:52:21,780 --> 00:52:27,480
always agree with some of her methods

1343
00:52:24,180 --> 00:52:30,059
let's talk about that and he got quite

1344
00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:33,619
annoyed towards the end with her because

1345
00:52:30,059 --> 00:52:37,020
he he um again he's another powerful

1346
00:52:33,619 --> 00:52:38,940
player and and as as you he's true to

1347
00:52:37,020 --> 00:52:41,339
his his story he's true to his

1348
00:52:38,940 --> 00:52:43,680
background and I love that in a game it

1349
00:52:41,339 --> 00:52:45,780
just as I said you and Ian you just

1350
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:47,819
dropped into these these two characters

1351
00:52:45,780 --> 00:52:49,680
and it was it was fantastic there was

1352
00:52:47,819 --> 00:52:51,720
there was there was it was Game On from

1353
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:54,119
the very first yeah and he's he's he's

1354
00:52:51,720 --> 00:52:57,300
very true to himself Livy's obviously

1355
00:52:54,119 --> 00:52:59,880
true to herself and I gave her an out I

1356
00:52:57,300 --> 00:53:02,220
gave him an out for a character so right

1357
00:52:59,880 --> 00:53:03,839
you you can disassociate yourself

1358
00:53:02,220 --> 00:53:05,880
because I had these voices in his head

1359
00:53:03,839 --> 00:53:07,980
and it was actually the land talking to

1360
00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:10,140
him it was that was it was the realm

1361
00:53:07,980 --> 00:53:13,440
talking to him because the realm could

1362
00:53:10,140 --> 00:53:15,839
see that there was potential here for

1363
00:53:13,440 --> 00:53:19,079
another Patron there was another another

1364
00:53:15,839 --> 00:53:23,160
convert to to my cause

1365
00:53:19,079 --> 00:53:26,400
and um I gave him an out and he took it

1366
00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:30,119
and then The Raven Queen

1367
00:53:26,400 --> 00:53:31,559
then approached the Barbarian

1368
00:53:30,119 --> 00:53:33,180
and said

1369
00:53:31,559 --> 00:53:35,160
short vengeance

1370
00:53:33,180 --> 00:53:36,900
and he kind of went yeah

1371
00:53:35,160 --> 00:53:39,540
well this is my problem

1372
00:53:36,900 --> 00:53:40,859
you see yeah and and you know I've been

1373
00:53:39,540 --> 00:53:44,940
spurned by

1374
00:53:40,859 --> 00:53:47,640
Livy who no longer wants me yes

1375
00:53:44,940 --> 00:53:50,520
and you don't do that to me

1376
00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:52,740
because I'm the Raven Queen yep and and

1377
00:53:50,520 --> 00:53:54,180
how about do you want some you want some

1378
00:53:52,740 --> 00:53:56,339
Vengeance do you want to be my Champion

1379
00:53:54,180 --> 00:53:58,800
do you want to be her Nemesis and of

1380
00:53:56,339 --> 00:54:00,900
course he's gone absolutely bang and

1381
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:04,260
there was just like I've sat team in

1382
00:54:00,900 --> 00:54:07,380
yeah and he's now in League with the

1383
00:54:04,260 --> 00:54:09,300
Raven Queen Libby is is no longer there

1384
00:54:07,380 --> 00:54:11,280
so has you know the pack sword and you

1385
00:54:09,300 --> 00:54:13,740
know various Powers have gone

1386
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:16,140
but then she's been rewarded by the land

1387
00:54:13,740 --> 00:54:18,960
and has now our own little pocket

1388
00:54:16,140 --> 00:54:20,579
Dimension if you like within

1389
00:54:18,960 --> 00:54:23,520
ravenloft

1390
00:54:20,579 --> 00:54:25,980
protected from The Raven Queen there's

1391
00:54:23,520 --> 00:54:28,740
this overarching now all of a sudden

1392
00:54:25,980 --> 00:54:32,280
it's the Raven Queens got the ass with

1393
00:54:28,740 --> 00:54:34,559
strad and vice versa so you've got this

1394
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:36,839
you've taken it up a notch and you've

1395
00:54:34,559 --> 00:54:39,000
got 10th level characters on now

1396
00:54:36,839 --> 00:54:40,680
you know Arch enemies and that's that's

1397
00:54:39,000 --> 00:54:42,059
great because there was some sparking

1398
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:43,740
going on and there was some fantastic

1399
00:54:42,059 --> 00:54:45,420
role playing in around the table

1400
00:54:43,740 --> 00:54:47,640
brilliant role playing around the table

1401
00:54:45,420 --> 00:54:49,740
and then you've got up that level it's

1402
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:53,220
it's like you know the two battle

1403
00:54:49,740 --> 00:54:55,559
Cruisers are now engaging themselves

1404
00:54:53,220 --> 00:54:58,140
above your planet and and it's all

1405
00:54:55,559 --> 00:55:01,559
kicking off in space sort of thing and

1406
00:54:58,140 --> 00:55:03,660
and that that feeds down to the two and

1407
00:55:01,559 --> 00:55:05,700
you you I think you just almost take it

1408
00:55:03,660 --> 00:55:07,980
away take it away from the players as a

1409
00:55:05,700 --> 00:55:09,540
choice but you give them a couple of

1410
00:55:07,980 --> 00:55:12,900
choices and see which way they go and

1411
00:55:09,540 --> 00:55:15,119
they absolutely took it and it was

1412
00:55:12,900 --> 00:55:17,339
um it was it was brilliant it was

1413
00:55:15,119 --> 00:55:19,740
brilliant because you know yes it's the

1414
00:55:17,339 --> 00:55:22,859
shadow of hell yes it's the Raven Queen

1415
00:55:19,740 --> 00:55:25,440
but the way I interpreted it was

1416
00:55:22,859 --> 00:55:27,660
it's it's still separate from it okay

1417
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:29,819
does that make sense yeah yeah yeah in a

1418
00:55:27,660 --> 00:55:31,140
way I mean it's I'm reassured that I'm

1419
00:55:29,819 --> 00:55:32,280
basically on the right tracks as it is

1420
00:55:31,140 --> 00:55:33,720
anyway

1421
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:36,119
um which is which is the most important

1422
00:55:33,720 --> 00:55:39,780
thing I was after uh they may well end

1423
00:55:36,119 --> 00:55:42,059
up going uh they have a cubic gate so a

1424
00:55:39,780 --> 00:55:43,680
cube that one of the each side takes you

1425
00:55:42,059 --> 00:55:45,540
to a different plane of existence um

1426
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:46,859
yeah again one reason why it's like I

1427
00:55:45,540 --> 00:55:50,280
just want you to go to these cool places

1428
00:55:46,859 --> 00:55:51,839
without having to faff around yeah and

1429
00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:53,280
one of those is that the shadow fell

1430
00:55:51,839 --> 00:55:55,740
which he knows the Raven Queen is

1431
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:58,140
probably there so they might go there at

1432
00:55:55,740 --> 00:55:59,099
some point and if I could throw in some

1433
00:55:58,140 --> 00:56:01,619
of this

1434
00:55:59,099 --> 00:56:02,760
uh historical law of Raven Loft star

1435
00:56:01,619 --> 00:56:04,260
while they're there like it's already

1436
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:06,059
going to be move and purple and

1437
00:56:04,260 --> 00:56:07,559
oppressive and oh there's Ravens

1438
00:56:06,059 --> 00:56:09,780
everywhere and never everyone everyone's

1439
00:56:07,559 --> 00:56:12,420
sad but if I can throw in this other

1440
00:56:09,780 --> 00:56:14,520
like oh and also there's vampires oh and

1441
00:56:12,420 --> 00:56:15,960
we like I've not mentioned strata them

1442
00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:17,700
once they know I've never read the books

1443
00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:18,540
or touched it so I think if I if I was

1444
00:56:17,700 --> 00:56:21,059
like

1445
00:56:18,540 --> 00:56:22,619
when they teleport in if they appeared

1446
00:56:21,059 --> 00:56:25,559
like in his court then they'll be like

1447
00:56:22,619 --> 00:56:29,359
ah yeah we forgot he lives here too yeah

1448
00:56:25,559 --> 00:56:31,619
yeah yeah this this complicates matters

1449
00:56:29,359 --> 00:56:33,720
well then you you know you could you

1450
00:56:31,619 --> 00:56:35,339
could you could have an uneasy alliance

1451
00:56:33,720 --> 00:56:37,859
with him if there's a problem with the

1452
00:56:35,339 --> 00:56:39,720
Raven Queen you know obviously so I mean

1453
00:56:37,859 --> 00:56:41,099
who knows who knows what they do you

1454
00:56:39,720 --> 00:56:43,980
know when they're at that level but

1455
00:56:41,099 --> 00:56:46,260
they're powerful powerful beings into

1456
00:56:43,980 --> 00:56:49,319
these creatures and they still

1457
00:56:46,260 --> 00:56:51,260
squabble yeah themselves you know it's

1458
00:56:49,319 --> 00:56:53,579
it's like it's like the ancient dragons

1459
00:56:51,260 --> 00:56:55,619
you know you a gold you get a gold one

1460
00:56:53,579 --> 00:56:56,780
you get a red one you know they're gonna

1461
00:56:55,619 --> 00:56:59,520
have words

1462
00:56:56,780 --> 00:57:01,440
huge huge ancient creatures are gonna

1463
00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:03,859
start kicking off above your head and

1464
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:03,859
yeah

1465
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:09,540
use that absolutely

1466
00:57:06,420 --> 00:57:11,339
again it's it's so flexible you can you

1467
00:57:09,540 --> 00:57:14,099
can do what you want with it and as a DM

1468
00:57:11,339 --> 00:57:16,740
you can have such such great fun with it

1469
00:57:14,099 --> 00:57:17,940
and have great fun with it yes I have to

1470
00:57:16,740 --> 00:57:20,940
tell them not to listen to this episode

1471
00:57:17,940 --> 00:57:22,440
because uh that's uh

1472
00:57:20,940 --> 00:57:23,760
well you don't you don't have to tell

1473
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:25,920
them there is they don't have to appear

1474
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:27,180
there it could appear in his court he

1475
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:29,339
could appear in his dungeons they could

1476
00:57:27,180 --> 00:57:31,020
appear somewhere and you just you just

1477
00:57:29,339 --> 00:57:33,720
have him turn up this this you know

1478
00:57:31,020 --> 00:57:36,960
however you want in this tall diversely

1479
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:39,720
handsome man very well dressed very well

1480
00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:42,000
spoken very well read you know in a

1481
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:44,280
black cape with a blood red lining

1482
00:57:42,000 --> 00:57:45,780
and you know and and it'll go over their

1483
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:48,000
heads and some of them I suspect and

1484
00:57:45,780 --> 00:57:50,180
others would go is that who we think it

1485
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:50,180
is

1486
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:55,079
and all of a sudden there's another

1487
00:57:52,319 --> 00:57:58,140
there's another dimension so yeah yeah

1488
00:57:55,079 --> 00:57:59,339
that would be good that would be good

1489
00:57:58,140 --> 00:58:01,319
um is there anything you want to talk

1490
00:57:59,339 --> 00:58:03,839
about that we haven't hit yet or not

1491
00:58:01,319 --> 00:58:04,819
quite got to oh god

1492
00:58:03,839 --> 00:58:08,280
um

1493
00:58:04,819 --> 00:58:09,960
yeah I took quite a lot tonight so um I

1494
00:58:08,280 --> 00:58:11,339
don't know it's just a

1495
00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:13,319
I don't know I think I think the

1496
00:58:11,339 --> 00:58:15,420
overarching thing is is Rainbow Rock is

1497
00:58:13,319 --> 00:58:18,319
great that's it that's all you have to

1498
00:58:15,420 --> 00:58:18,319
say that's the end of the episode

1499
00:58:18,660 --> 00:58:23,460
um any any new DMS out there and

1500
00:58:21,839 --> 00:58:25,020
whatever and that goes back to what I

1501
00:58:23,460 --> 00:58:26,520
said earlier if you want to run cursor

1502
00:58:25,020 --> 00:58:28,200
strads straight off the bat particularly

1503
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:30,420
if you've got new players don't do it

1504
00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:32,940
don't do it just come away step away

1505
00:58:30,420 --> 00:58:36,240
from it learn a little bit more learned

1506
00:58:32,940 --> 00:58:38,760
that the Art of Storytelling and come

1507
00:58:36,240 --> 00:58:41,040
back to it or drop in and out it's

1508
00:58:38,760 --> 00:58:44,460
perfectly acceptable to drop in and out

1509
00:58:41,040 --> 00:58:46,680
of a campaign you don't have to do it

1510
00:58:44,460 --> 00:58:49,740
back to back end to end

1511
00:58:46,680 --> 00:58:53,220
you can you can just drop in and try and

1512
00:58:49,740 --> 00:58:54,839
and Rave will not use it use it for

1513
00:58:53,220 --> 00:58:56,700
you can experiment with it if you want

1514
00:58:54,839 --> 00:58:58,260
to home brew it you can absolutely home

1515
00:58:56,700 --> 00:59:00,240
brew it you can you can do your own

1516
00:58:58,260 --> 00:59:01,980
thing you can do your own monsters you

1517
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:03,420
can do your own Realms you can do your

1518
00:59:01,980 --> 00:59:05,579
own

1519
00:59:03,420 --> 00:59:07,020
spells if that's what you're into

1520
00:59:05,579 --> 00:59:10,380
um it doesn't it's personally it's not

1521
00:59:07,020 --> 00:59:12,599
one of my things um but yeah it's just

1522
00:59:10,380 --> 00:59:14,760
take it easy with it and just you know

1523
00:59:12,599 --> 00:59:17,160
and then when you're ready just go into

1524
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:19,740
it but go into it feet first you have to

1525
00:59:17,160 --> 00:59:21,260
go all the way in you have to build that

1526
00:59:19,740 --> 00:59:23,700
tension you have to build that

1527
00:59:21,260 --> 00:59:24,720
atmosphere you have to build that sense

1528
00:59:23,700 --> 00:59:27,240
of

1529
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:29,640
danger which is I mean kind of what I

1530
00:59:27,240 --> 00:59:31,500
did with you and Ian at the end did you

1531
00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:34,380
notice when you were coming out of the

1532
00:59:31,500 --> 00:59:36,359
temple I made you roll repeated death

1533
00:59:34,380 --> 00:59:38,819
rolls and things like that but I

1534
00:59:36,359 --> 00:59:41,040
remember yeah yeah how did you feel

1535
00:59:38,819 --> 00:59:43,980
about that well sad because my guy died

1536
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:46,799
but that's the that's the nature of the

1537
00:59:43,980 --> 00:59:49,559
feast but no I mean absolutely like it's

1538
00:59:46,799 --> 00:59:51,359
not often players are forced to

1539
00:59:49,559 --> 00:59:53,819
right sometimes I'll do it I'll be like

1540
00:59:51,359 --> 00:59:56,220
make a call now or I'm making it for you

1541
00:59:53,819 --> 00:59:58,500
it doesn't happen that often and I think

1542
00:59:56,220 --> 01:00:00,780
it is actually quite a powerful tool to

1543
00:59:58,500 --> 01:00:02,400
compress that and do a lot in a short

1544
01:00:00,780 --> 01:00:04,200
space of time because it's doubling down

1545
01:00:02,400 --> 01:00:06,720
as you just said like um

1546
01:00:04,200 --> 01:00:07,980
really nailing that like we're in a

1547
01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,240
hurry here it's not just one check I'm

1548
01:00:07,980 --> 01:00:12,240
asking you to do quickly everything

1549
01:00:09,240 --> 01:00:15,119
you're doing now is yeah a critically

1550
01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:17,220
important and B you have no time to do

1551
01:00:15,119 --> 01:00:18,599
something to think yeah you've got no

1552
01:00:17,220 --> 01:00:20,280
time to think that that gets people

1553
01:00:18,599 --> 01:00:24,900
going was they start doing things

1554
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:27,480
naturally yes you know and and it all of

1555
01:00:24,900 --> 01:00:29,040
a sudden I I didn't expect that that was

1556
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:30,359
great for them somebody starts doing

1557
01:00:29,040 --> 01:00:32,640
something you don't expect it's like oh

1558
01:00:30,359 --> 01:00:34,160
well that's character building I think

1559
01:00:32,640 --> 01:00:36,960
they call it

1560
01:00:34,160 --> 01:00:39,839
in the opposite direction but yeah no

1561
01:00:36,960 --> 01:00:42,240
it's um yeah I get passionate about it

1562
01:00:39,839 --> 01:00:44,640
as you can tell and I get really serious

1563
01:00:42,240 --> 01:00:47,760
about it and and I I love running it and

1564
01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:49,680
and I love the law behind it and I would

1565
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:51,299
just say read some of the older stuff

1566
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:54,059
you know some of the second edition

1567
01:00:51,299 --> 01:00:55,680
stuff the van ripton's guides yes you

1568
01:00:54,059 --> 01:00:57,540
know a lot of the stats won't make a lot

1569
01:00:55,680 --> 01:01:00,359
of sense because it's all converted now

1570
01:00:57,540 --> 01:01:03,000
but the story the law the history the

1571
01:01:00,359 --> 01:01:05,640
reasoning you know if you actually read

1572
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:10,920
straws back during his history the guys

1573
01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:14,280
2 000 years old give or take he's he's a

1574
01:01:10,920 --> 01:01:19,020
patriarchal ancient patriarchal vampire

1575
01:01:14,280 --> 01:01:21,660
it's very very powerful but the history

1576
01:01:19,020 --> 01:01:24,000
behind it was somebody once said well if

1577
01:01:21,660 --> 01:01:26,819
you're so powerful why isn't there more

1578
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:28,200
and it's a simple again I'm not going to

1579
01:01:26,819 --> 01:01:30,059
spoil it you read the history on it and

1580
01:01:28,200 --> 01:01:32,460
a lot of them

1581
01:01:30,059 --> 01:01:35,400
go insane

1582
01:01:32,460 --> 01:01:37,200
because if if you you know

1583
01:01:35,400 --> 01:01:39,240
we often say that when somebody gets to

1584
01:01:37,200 --> 01:01:41,339
maybe 70 or 80 years old they've had

1585
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:44,040
they've had enough yeah you can imagine

1586
01:01:41,339 --> 01:01:46,440
that at 1500 years old yeah and you've

1587
01:01:44,040 --> 01:01:48,240
seen stuff and you've done stuff and you

1588
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:51,299
know you've seen loved ones come and go

1589
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:54,540
multiple times and possibly children

1590
01:01:51,299 --> 01:01:56,700
grow up and not not be around them or

1591
01:01:54,540 --> 01:01:59,640
whatever and it mentally it will affect

1592
01:01:56,700 --> 01:02:02,220
you and the whole thing that they go

1593
01:01:59,640 --> 01:02:03,180
insane and take their own lives if you

1594
01:02:02,220 --> 01:02:05,400
like

1595
01:02:03,180 --> 01:02:07,380
it's really powerful and then all of a

1596
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:10,440
sudden they they become

1597
01:02:07,380 --> 01:02:13,680
something you know it's not just a a

1598
01:02:10,440 --> 01:02:15,980
bunch of stats yes um it's it's all of a

1599
01:02:13,680 --> 01:02:19,079
sudden oh this guy's got wow you know

1600
01:02:15,980 --> 01:02:21,359
wow this is who he is this is this is

1601
01:02:19,079 --> 01:02:23,819
why and then he takes on a personality

1602
01:02:21,359 --> 01:02:25,200
and that's the same for the uh for all

1603
01:02:23,819 --> 01:02:27,480
of the realm authors there's there's

1604
01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:30,420
often backstories tragic backstories as

1605
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:32,280
to why they are where they are and just

1606
01:02:30,420 --> 01:02:33,839
just absorb I thought I would say if

1607
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:36,599
you're going to run Roblox absorb some

1608
01:02:33,839 --> 01:02:40,980
of that absorb some of that and use that

1609
01:02:36,599 --> 01:02:44,460
and play play him her it whatever it

1610
01:02:40,980 --> 01:02:46,799
happens to be as as you would a player

1611
01:02:44,460 --> 01:02:48,660
as you would a player and then and then

1612
01:02:46,799 --> 01:02:50,579
and I think you'll gain

1613
01:02:48,660 --> 01:02:52,559
a lot more from it

1614
01:02:50,579 --> 01:02:55,020
there's a lot to be gained from it and I

1615
01:02:52,559 --> 01:02:56,940
think people just skip the surface and I

1616
01:02:55,020 --> 01:02:58,079
think they just need to dive in a little

1617
01:02:56,940 --> 01:03:00,599
deeper

1618
01:02:58,079 --> 01:03:02,460
and and take it on board much the same

1619
01:03:00,599 --> 01:03:05,099
as you would with something like ever on

1620
01:03:02,460 --> 01:03:06,540
or the drow City yeah the different

1621
01:03:05,099 --> 01:03:08,099
factions you've obviously thought about

1622
01:03:06,540 --> 01:03:10,140
that you've gone into that and then

1623
01:03:08,099 --> 01:03:11,579
there's a reasoning behind that you've I

1624
01:03:10,140 --> 01:03:16,140
would like to say that you've probably

1625
01:03:11,579 --> 01:03:18,119
got key key figures in each house and

1626
01:03:16,140 --> 01:03:21,240
and rough and you've got it mapped out

1627
01:03:18,119 --> 01:03:23,819
in your brain same same with Raven just

1628
01:03:21,240 --> 01:03:26,940
absorb it and and work with it and then

1629
01:03:23,819 --> 01:03:27,799
you will get 10 times the enjoyment out

1630
01:03:26,940 --> 01:03:30,780
of it

1631
01:03:27,799 --> 01:03:33,180
well thank you that's fantastic advice

1632
01:03:30,780 --> 01:03:35,640
to bring out the show yes all that's

1633
01:03:33,180 --> 01:03:37,260
left to say is thank you ever so much

1634
01:03:35,640 --> 01:03:39,240
John for joining us today as I said

1635
01:03:37,260 --> 01:03:41,760
earlier your your your passion is

1636
01:03:39,240 --> 01:03:43,740
infectious and I've I entered this I

1637
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:45,960
entered this episode with a very little

1638
01:03:43,740 --> 01:03:48,540
appreciation understanding of Raven Loft

1639
01:03:45,960 --> 01:03:50,819
and they've come out now by planning it

1640
01:03:48,540 --> 01:03:53,460
into my campaign so that's a success I

1641
01:03:50,819 --> 01:03:56,880
think it's accomplished indeed indeed my

1642
01:03:53,460 --> 01:03:59,359
work here is done and I apologize if I

1643
01:03:56,880 --> 01:04:01,980
spoke too much but like I said

1644
01:03:59,359 --> 01:04:05,420
so and we'll talk some more about

1645
01:04:01,980 --> 01:04:08,220
project management somewhere else

1646
01:04:05,420 --> 01:04:11,400
uh so yes thank you to everybody for

1647
01:04:08,220 --> 01:04:14,099
listening at home as usual find me at

1648
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:16,559
thinking critically dot code at UK uh

1649
01:04:14,099 --> 01:04:19,380
yeah otherwise thank you all for

1650
01:04:16,559 --> 01:04:21,359
listening and good night

1651
01:04:19,380 --> 01:04:23,339
now it's time for the patreon shout outs

1652
01:04:21,359 --> 01:04:25,920
huge thank you to all my patrons

1653
01:04:23,339 --> 01:04:28,319
starting with Josh lewinike and Glenn

1654
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:29,880
the three fabulous toasts of tabletop

1655
01:04:28,319 --> 01:04:32,460
Journeys who've been on the show several

1656
01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:35,040
times before and who I'll always invite

1657
01:04:32,460 --> 01:04:38,940
back to go check out tabletop Journeys

1658
01:04:35,040 --> 01:04:42,000
at ttjourneys.com or at TT Journeys on

1659
01:04:38,940 --> 01:04:44,700
Twitter we also have Joe from the fourth

1660
01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:47,700
leg podcast because all about giving DMS

1661
01:04:44,700 --> 01:04:49,380
another leg to stand on again previous

1662
01:04:47,700 --> 01:04:50,520
guests of the show and I'd thoroughly

1663
01:04:49,380 --> 01:04:53,040
encourage you to go and check out their

1664
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:55,140
great content so you can find them at

1665
01:04:53,040 --> 01:04:56,460
the fourthleg on Twitter

1666
01:04:55,140 --> 01:04:58,260
was I have a good friend of the show

1667
01:04:56,460 --> 01:05:00,480
optional rule you can go and find him

1668
01:04:58,260 --> 01:05:03,119
out on optional rule.com or at optional

1669
01:05:00,480 --> 01:05:05,099
Rule full of very insightful and

1670
01:05:03,119 --> 01:05:08,579
educated comments and thoughts and

1671
01:05:05,099 --> 01:05:10,500
threads on the really nitty-gritty of

1672
01:05:08,579 --> 01:05:13,980
DnD we have

1673
01:05:10,500 --> 01:05:15,420
what a guy Matthew Perkins who is just

1674
01:05:13,980 --> 01:05:17,460
out there in the world trying to make

1675
01:05:15,420 --> 01:05:20,880
you laugh let's go and check him out at

1676
01:05:17,460 --> 01:05:24,660
Matthew perkins.net or at hey it's Matty

1677
01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:26,700
P m-a-t-t-y-p and good friend of the

1678
01:05:24,660 --> 01:05:29,640
show and one of my table mates Matthew

1679
01:05:26,700 --> 01:05:33,299
Street go and check out his partner's

1680
01:05:29,640 --> 01:05:36,920
hustle at virtualtime hustle.com or at

1681
01:05:33,299 --> 01:05:36,920
mp street88 on Twitter

1682
01:05:37,060 --> 01:05:59,199
[Music]