April 15, 2022

Mythology


For the season final I'm joined by Ramji, DM of The 4th Culture, an Asia-based TTRPG show which focuses on global voices and set in an Asian-influence homebrew world. We discuss global mythology and it's impact on TTRPGs, such as it's inherent euro-centricity and how this has affected published settings and games around the world. At it's core, D&D is collaborative storytelling, so it's more similar to folklore and myths than you might originally think! We go on to discuss tips for creating homebrew mythology, such as leveraging different systems and approaches to world building, along the way sharing our own anecdotes and cultural experiences.

  • 02:51 - The Difficulty of Mythology in D&D
  • 13:47 - Digging a Little Deeper
  • 24:29 - Building In-Game Myths
  • 37:02 - Telling Stories Through Maps
  • 42:29 - Telling Stories Through Language
  • 56:44 - Linked by Humanity

Find Ramji on:

Find Thinking Critically on:

References:

Patrons:

Intro Music: 'Local Forecast' by Kevin MacLeod
Intermission Music: 'Chill' by Kevin MacLeod
Outro Music: 'Local Forecast - Elevator' by Kevin MacLeod

Transcript

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welcome thinkers to season three episode

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25. today's topic is mythology and

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as is now usual i have a quick

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announcement to make i'm probably going

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to be taking a brief holiday in between

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seasons three and four just to have a

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little bit of time for myself

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not have the pressure of editing

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always weighing over me and just a

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little bit of self-care time so

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if you don't have another episode for a

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couple of weeks don't fret we will be

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back with season four and in fact i

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already have about 10 episodes recorded

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of top quality content

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so look forward to that and i will see

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you on the other side otherwise enjoy

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the episode

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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and today i'm joined by ramji thank you

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ever so much for joining us today ramji

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can you tell us a little bit about

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yourself thanks donnelly my name is

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ramji and i am a

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dungeon master and uh general dogs body

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for a show called the fourth culture

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we are a primarily global stream that

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focuses and channel that focuses on

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telling stories from around the world

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that are really not based on the

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classical kind of um i think some people

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it's called a eurocentric myth i

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personally prefer to think of it as the

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the non-arthurian

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non-norse myths so we do uh draw a bit

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on european culture we draw quite a lot

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quite heavily on eastern european

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culture on many of those stories and

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myths as well as of course things that

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are to the uh east of the bosphorus in

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essence so stories from age of minor

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from uh you know uh ancient persia from

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the sort of central asiatic plane india

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and of course

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china japan and southeast asia and uh

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sort of the archipelago and so

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a lot of what we like to do is blend in

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their mythology we've been

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sort of streaming primarily a bunch of

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shows

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based out of singapore but

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we're having more that are joining our

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portfolio over the course of the next

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few months and

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a lot of those are um

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stories that are people speaking from

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their own cultural voices and so we have

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for example a uh a new group of folks

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from the philippines who will be

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playing a set of games that are based

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heavily on philippine mythology and the

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stories related to the islands

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that i think is probably a an

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introduction and a half back to you

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i'd say so yeah no thank you very much

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and of course that would mean that

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today's topic is

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mythology so what does that what does

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that mean to you

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in the dnd and wide ttrpg framework

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so

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it's a great question because i think

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you know when we think about the role of

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mythology and what that actually means

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it sounds ever so grand it sounds like

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we should be thinking you know oh

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mythology that's uh that's all this sort

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of stories of ancient greek warriors or

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you know um

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the first thing that comes to many

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people's mind for example when you say

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mythology is is ancient greece it's rome

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it's the clash of the titans it's

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various stories like that maybe

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it's stories like alibaba and forty

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thieves or uh the things that disney has

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brought to us in its infinite rewriting

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of ancient tales

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underlying it all i think is that it's

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something that's essentially human um

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when we look at the role of storytelling

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and how that has basically been

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a constant for as long as people have

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been able to gather in communities and

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communicate in a meaningful way

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the

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reality is is the one thing that binds

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us the one thing that is intrinsically

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human is our desire to tell stories

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these stories become myths and legends

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and stories of ancient heroes and we

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tend to

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inject our own sort of

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uh cultural moors of the time into those

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stories that's why some of them can feel

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incredibly dated that's why some of them

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can feel you know when you look at them

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and you look at the original source

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material

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they're

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kind of grim or nasty or

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or any number of things that in today's

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context make no sense

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however

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the reality i find is that myths and

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stories and legends especially because

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they

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tended to be

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propagated by folks that were moving

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from community to community whether

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that's

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the same people who'd also carry news so

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in essence like the celtic bards or

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similar or whether these were merchants

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who were traveling along

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both ancient and

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relatively modern trade routes the

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telling stories as they went whether

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that's like by campfire and all the rest

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or or just as part of the

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you know tell me what's happening else

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in the world and you know everyone likes

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to tell a good story and these stories

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therefore grow larger and most

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importantly i think the thing is they

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get cross-pollinated and so we see these

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really rather incredible things where

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stories that you think you know well and

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you

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have heard when you were perhaps growing

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up as a child as fairy tales and various

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other things actually they have their

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roots perhaps somewhere very far away or

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perhaps the same story is told in lots

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of different places but with very

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different cultural meanings cultural

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context everything else and there are i

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mean a great example is the story of

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cinderella which i think is probably one

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of those myths that exists in

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most cultures in one way or another and

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the reality of the folks that do

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focalistics which is this entire

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discipline um about understanding

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folktales and mythology and stories and

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everything else is that

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they try to map and understand how all

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these things relate and that struck me

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the first time i came across it because

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that means that there's something

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intrinsically greater about the stories

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that we tell now in the context of d d

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it's kind of interesting for me because

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the classical d d story is

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very inspired by

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wargaming and that wargaming was very

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inspired by you know in the tales

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associated with it chain moan all the

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rest back in sort of like the late the

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70s and early 80s were sort of inspired

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by those sort of 1930s 1940s uh

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adventure stories of like conan the

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barbarian and maybe later with baffert

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and the gary mouser and all these sort

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of things where

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these roguish warrior characters you

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know conan whatever and i know conan in

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our mind iconically is a uh he's arnold

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schwarzenegger but um oh yeah but yeah

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of course right and so

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and yet

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in the books there's something of that

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sort of like

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fantastical uh blend of lots of

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different stories that kind of got

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brought together into this sort of

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semi-colonialist kind of view of this

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barbarian and you know the the

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interesting thing about

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those stories and then the way they got

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brought into dnd

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is that you know obviously lord of the

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rings which you can't really avoid even

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mentioning um surprisingly you've got

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this one without mentioning all of the

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rings

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they're very much based i mean a lot of

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the rings especially and tolkien was a a

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scholar um and then an old english

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scholar and he studied beowulf right and

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so much of lord of the rings is pretty

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much directly from beowulf you know the

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um the concept of um orcs the concept of

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many of the other creatures that are

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inside uh a lot of the rings you know

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even the elves for that matter these are

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creatures that are

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actually very distinct from the other

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fairy tales comparatively right so

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however that group of kind of that

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combination of that sort of boy's own

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fantasy conan type stuff plus lord of

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the rings

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then just sort of then stuck in

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what is the standard fantasy trope which

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is this

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combination of

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a very late middle ages

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plus

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bits from the dark ages plus you know a

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bit from here and a bit from there

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said in a kind of

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fantasy northern europe that doesn't

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really exist now i mean that is

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a hundred percent amazing i grew up with

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these stories i love these stories right

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i mean it's sort of wonderful and so

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when they then turned into

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the law if you will of g and d so

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the forgotten realms law and you know we

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can talk about that if we like but

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honestly it's so jumbled and broken that

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um hot take a hot take the forgotten

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realms

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um

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but um but then

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you sort of have

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a very

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[Music]

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interesting confluence i would say right

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um what do i mean by that yeah well

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let's take some of the amazing fantasy

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authors that you know and fancy stories

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and fancy literature obviously has a

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huge influence in the beginning of dnd

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so let's talk about

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the artifact darkrazer um you know that

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is a uh

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sentient blade

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but in no way of course is just a direct

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take out of elric's weapon from the

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michael morcock series right and

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um you know this sort of melange this

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sort of like blending together of all of

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these tropes

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then gives i would say

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the stereotypical dnd game

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a

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problem in an odd way which is that

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mythology is already a big blend of a

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lot of things but it's very very

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northern european it's very

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much

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then

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simplified to take away

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the intrinsic complexity of the

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underlying work right so there's a great

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deal of complexity in all of the rings

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as we all know because there's books and

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00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:08,079
books and books and prequels and

273
00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,600
prequels to prequels and sequels to

274
00:10:08,079 --> 00:10:12,640
prequels that yeah with all the rest

275
00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:14,000
right and the same is true of um of

276
00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,920
malcolm's word the same is true of any

277
00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:17,360
number of other things and

278
00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:20,000
in order to make it a game in order to

279
00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:21,440
not make it too complex d and d sort of

280
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:24,399
simplifies it to

281
00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:26,399
aux bad elves good and here's the rough

282
00:10:24,399 --> 00:10:30,000
law and i think that

283
00:10:26,399 --> 00:10:32,480
it is one of those things as a dm and

284
00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,920
growing up with a lot of these stories

285
00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:34,959
and really enjoying them and really

286
00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:36,959
playing with these things and then

287
00:10:34,959 --> 00:10:38,800
reading all the fantasy and the science

288
00:10:36,959 --> 00:10:40,160
fiction and various other stories in

289
00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:43,839
parallel

290
00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:45,680
that as someone of you know uh

291
00:10:43,839 --> 00:10:47,680
i guess say non-european descent

292
00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:51,040
although i can tell by my accent i grew

293
00:10:47,680 --> 00:10:53,360
up in in sunny croydon so um

294
00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:54,320
so some of you are non-european descent

295
00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,480
i

296
00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:57,519
struggled to see myself reflected in

297
00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:58,800
that game

298
00:10:57,519 --> 00:11:00,079
and then i spoke with other people who

299
00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:02,240
struggle to see themselves reflected in

300
00:11:00,079 --> 00:11:04,480
that game except in pastiche and i think

301
00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:06,480
that is the the difficulty of mythology

302
00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:09,200
in dnd because although it's got so much

303
00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:13,839
richness in one perspective and then you

304
00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:16,640
have oriental adventures or you have

305
00:11:13,839 --> 00:11:18,640
or you have these other

306
00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,640
it's not even that they're terrible

307
00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:22,800
because at the end of the day

308
00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:24,880
it's that they're racist right and it's

309
00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:27,760
sort of you know it's it's that like

310
00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,800
they they massively simplify mythology

311
00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,200
into

312
00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:33,680
a a set of expectations with a

313
00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:34,959
particularly western sort of western

314
00:11:33,680 --> 00:11:36,240
european northwestern european

315
00:11:34,959 --> 00:11:38,720
perspective

316
00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:41,040
and so it's like all the cool stuff it's

317
00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:42,320
like i want katanas and ninjas and i

318
00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:44,160
want to have some other things and then

319
00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,519
inside those books by the way there's

320
00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:47,040
other cool things there's like other

321
00:11:45,519 --> 00:11:48,079
bits of law and somebody's done some

322
00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:50,399
research and they've gone away and

323
00:11:48,079 --> 00:11:52,639
they've read some stuff but it sort of

324
00:11:50,399 --> 00:11:54,639
misses the thing that i would say at the

325
00:11:52,639 --> 00:11:56,880
beginning which is that

326
00:11:54,639 --> 00:12:00,079
all of these mythological tropes all of

327
00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:02,720
these sort of um stories actually have

328
00:12:00,079 --> 00:12:04,079
echoes and resonances across the entire

329
00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:06,240
world so

330
00:12:04,079 --> 00:12:07,600
i'll i'll finish my ted talk with this

331
00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,040
is sort of like uh

332
00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:10,320
with this broader point which is that

333
00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,160
now you've got 15 minutes left mate

334
00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:13,680
you've got to go well i can carry on my

335
00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:14,959
ted talk and so

336
00:12:13,680 --> 00:12:16,079
but

337
00:12:14,959 --> 00:12:18,639
so you take

338
00:12:16,079 --> 00:12:19,839
the chinese sort of post-buddhist

339
00:12:18,639 --> 00:12:21,680
mythology

340
00:12:19,839 --> 00:12:26,639
as in buddhism came to china

341
00:12:21,680 --> 00:12:28,800
and you have um a huge overlap with um

342
00:12:26,639 --> 00:12:32,399
stories that are common in india right

343
00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:34,000
and vice versa right um and so

344
00:12:32,399 --> 00:12:36,639
when i moved out i lived in singapore

345
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:39,760
when i moved to southeast asia i was

346
00:12:36,639 --> 00:12:40,959
stunned to realize not obviously i knew

347
00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:42,480
that thing beforehand but just to

348
00:12:40,959 --> 00:12:44,560
realize then by the way there's this

349
00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:47,120
whole area of the world called southeast

350
00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:48,639
asia where those kind of myths also then

351
00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:50,560
have that sort of syncretic relationship

352
00:12:48,639 --> 00:12:52,800
where basically you know as various

353
00:12:50,560 --> 00:12:54,959
empires have risen and foreign kingdoms

354
00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:57,279
have come and gone the myths have been

355
00:12:54,959 --> 00:12:59,680
left behind in the names of places in

356
00:12:57,279 --> 00:13:01,920
the names of people in all of the

357
00:12:59,680 --> 00:13:04,800
stories that we tell and so i kind of

358
00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:06,320
got obsessed by it and so we started our

359
00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,360
game just to kind of say what would it

360
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:08,079
be like

361
00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,440
to

362
00:13:08,079 --> 00:13:12,720
play in a non-eurocentric world so let's

363
00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:15,440
consciously

364
00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:17,519
excise the arthurian myth let's exercise

365
00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:20,639
the kind of like the vagnerian you know

366
00:13:17,519 --> 00:13:24,399
siegfried and the ring and the sort of

367
00:13:20,639 --> 00:13:28,240
the um ragnarok kind of stories you take

368
00:13:24,399 --> 00:13:30,320
those out and then what's left and

369
00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:32,399
what's left is amazing because basically

370
00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:34,240
what's left is all of the rest of the

371
00:13:32,399 --> 00:13:37,360
cultural richness of the world and you

372
00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:39,040
don't lose the echoes of all of that

373
00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:41,279
other wonderful stuff that's kind of

374
00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,320
underlying it all

375
00:13:41,279 --> 00:13:43,760
i mean i don't know from your

376
00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,760
perspective i mean it is interesting

377
00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:47,360
right so i don't um i don't presume to

378
00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,480
know your background right tell me a

379
00:13:47,360 --> 00:13:50,720
little bit about like what were the

380
00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:52,720
stories that you grew up with what were

381
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,480
the kind of the myths and legends and

382
00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,560
stuff that you got told or you read at

383
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,480
bedtime or whatever it is sure so i'm a

384
00:13:56,560 --> 00:14:01,440
bit of a contradiction in terms or

385
00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:02,880
whatever the phrase is because i'm not a

386
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,760
typical

387
00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:07,440
fantasy consumer so like my my first

388
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,720
experience with lord of the rings for

389
00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:10,880
example was

390
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:14,240
in the cinema back when a ticket cost

391
00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:17,199
probably five pounds not 15 pounds like

392
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:19,839
it does today i mean

393
00:14:17,199 --> 00:14:21,760
so like i i was never a huge book reader

394
00:14:19,839 --> 00:14:25,519
and in fact uh science fiction has

395
00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:28,240
always been my preferred kind of fiction

396
00:14:25,519 --> 00:14:31,680
so yes i was aware growing up

397
00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:33,279
tangentially of king arthur and merlin

398
00:14:31,680 --> 00:14:36,399
again through

399
00:14:33,279 --> 00:14:38,720
disney i believe uh or whatever it was

400
00:14:36,399 --> 00:14:39,760
in the stone and yes absolutely yeah

401
00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:41,920
exactly

402
00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:43,120
so like i i will wish that i would have

403
00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,040
watched that at some point and that

404
00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:47,360
would have been you know running around

405
00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:49,360
at the back of my head but otherwise it

406
00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:52,959
is just your regular

407
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:54,880
90s kid pop culture

408
00:14:52,959 --> 00:14:57,440
uk south uk

409
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:58,720
um so like i i know of

410
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,480
and

411
00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:02,880
hold highly terry pratchett but i've

412
00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:04,639
never read any of that stuff for example

413
00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:06,320
i hope

414
00:15:04,639 --> 00:15:08,560
my listeners are just falling off the

415
00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:10,240
cliff now as i

416
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,839
as i tell them i've never listened to or

417
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:12,959
read any of their most favorite things

418
00:15:11,839 --> 00:15:14,160
um

419
00:15:12,959 --> 00:15:15,760
so no

420
00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:17,440
so coming to

421
00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:19,440
d and d

422
00:15:17,440 --> 00:15:21,199
and let me think of the way to put this

423
00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:22,959
because

424
00:15:21,199 --> 00:15:27,440
it ticked the boxes i would have

425
00:15:22,959 --> 00:15:30,160
expected it to tick in terms of the

426
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:32,240
theming so it was basically as you've

427
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:35,120
described like

428
00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:36,160
all the tropes essentially which to me

429
00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:38,240
as

430
00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:40,000
potentially an ignorant person from from

431
00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:42,560
who's only ever lived in europe you know

432
00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:44,079
west europe that it was what i would

433
00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:46,160
have expected it to be for better and

434
00:15:44,079 --> 00:15:49,519
for worse you know you know all that all

435
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:51,600
the the main boxes were ticked

436
00:15:49,519 --> 00:15:52,959
but what i mean by that is like

437
00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,480
it was this middle

438
00:15:52,959 --> 00:15:55,839
middle-earth middle

439
00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:57,759
medieval

440
00:15:55,839 --> 00:16:00,079
middle middle middle just fantasy

441
00:15:57,759 --> 00:16:01,759
quote-unquote that had everything you'd

442
00:16:00,079 --> 00:16:03,839
expect it to do now

443
00:16:01,759 --> 00:16:05,360
as a dm and a player

444
00:16:03,839 --> 00:16:06,959
sometimes that makes me

445
00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,360
makes it very difficult to run a game

446
00:16:06,959 --> 00:16:10,800
because i'm like are there bicycles in

447
00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:13,199
this world i don't know what are the

448
00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:15,120
ramifications if i bring in bicycles how

449
00:16:13,199 --> 00:16:17,519
do people tell the time i don't know is

450
00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,480
it just sundials everywhere kind of is

451
00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:20,959
is

452
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:22,560
a pain as a dm to be like well you don't

453
00:16:20,959 --> 00:16:25,360
know what time it is i go out and find a

454
00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:27,440
sundial okay cool that sucks

455
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:29,920
but i want to bring in

456
00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:31,839
some more modern items but then that

457
00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:33,279
obviously then starts to tear at the

458
00:16:31,839 --> 00:16:34,720
seams of

459
00:16:33,279 --> 00:16:37,839
this

460
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:40,639
weirdly crafted mishmash of

461
00:16:37,839 --> 00:16:42,800
tropes and idioms over the last

462
00:16:40,639 --> 00:16:44,720
40 decades the only thing i wanted to

463
00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:46,959
add is you were saying like

464
00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:48,399
a lot of them and in a previous episode

465
00:16:46,959 --> 00:16:50,959
in a previous guest i had on we talked

466
00:16:48,399 --> 00:16:52,560
about monsters and then the whole shtick

467
00:16:50,959 --> 00:16:55,519
of that episode was like something a

468
00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:57,440
monster that you might find benign or

469
00:16:55,519 --> 00:16:58,639
you might not be familiar with his roots

470
00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:00,240
actually has

471
00:16:58,639 --> 00:17:02,880
its roots in

472
00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:04,160
pagan mythology from yeah a hundred

473
00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:06,559
years ago and you're like oh i just

474
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:08,799
brought that in as a goofy npc

475
00:17:06,559 --> 00:17:10,480
and it's like no that like you might be

476
00:17:08,799 --> 00:17:12,000
being like hella

477
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,000
insensitive and you just don't know

478
00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:15,520
because it's got all this

479
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:17,120
this baggage with it so like something

480
00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:19,039
like the mummy which is in the dungeon

481
00:17:17,120 --> 00:17:21,199
masters guide is obviously

482
00:17:19,039 --> 00:17:22,880
the brendan fraser classic film uh you

483
00:17:21,199 --> 00:17:24,559
know there's

484
00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:26,319
there's there's more

485
00:17:24,559 --> 00:17:27,919
in popular culture whereas there's a

486
00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:29,600
whole bunch out there that have just

487
00:17:27,919 --> 00:17:32,000
been filtered through

488
00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:32,960
so many lenses that by the time it gets

489
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,880
to this

490
00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:36,880
mass production

491
00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:39,440
mass-produced high production

492
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:43,120
piece of 40-pound book that i buy from

493
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:45,200
my local gaming store that it is lost

494
00:17:43,120 --> 00:17:47,120
all the nuance and now just becomes the

495
00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,720
goofy npc or the goofy monster that you

496
00:17:47,120 --> 00:17:50,000
bring in to fight you're absolutely

497
00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:52,559
right i'll give you a great example

498
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:55,360
right so the um the classical d and d

499
00:17:52,559 --> 00:17:57,200
ogre right and i i did a video about

500
00:17:55,360 --> 00:17:59,280
this a while ago but it's sort of the

501
00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:00,640
the ogre is is really interesting

502
00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:03,440
because if you look at the etymology of

503
00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:06,080
it the ogre the word ogre comes from

504
00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:08,640
like um sort of probably french there's

505
00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,360
a there's a sort of french word

506
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,440
but

507
00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:12,799
it sort of relates then back

508
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:15,280
to

509
00:18:12,799 --> 00:18:16,720
the underlying word for dev or demon or

510
00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:19,200
something similar related to that which

511
00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:20,880
is really uh drives you through the sort

512
00:18:19,200 --> 00:18:22,080
of etruscan word which is a workers

513
00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:24,559
right and so

514
00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:27,360
you know ocus is obviously also you know

515
00:18:24,559 --> 00:18:29,200
the root of the word orc unsurprisingly

516
00:18:27,360 --> 00:18:31,919
and it's very unsurprising because the

517
00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:34,720
both words are found very clearly um in

518
00:18:31,919 --> 00:18:36,880
in uh in bales and therefore tolkien

519
00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:38,799
picks them up right and so in but the

520
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:40,400
interesting thing is in in

521
00:18:38,799 --> 00:18:42,960
in beowulf um

522
00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:44,720
the ogre grendel who's like the one of

523
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:47,039
the three so beowulf is basically the

524
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:48,240
story about this dude that um you know

525
00:18:47,039 --> 00:18:51,280
he's the sort of

526
00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:53,039
warrior king eventually and in essence

527
00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,720
it's a lot of blah blah blah but then he

528
00:18:53,039 --> 00:18:56,000
fights three people right he finds

529
00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:57,280
grendel he fights grendel's mother and

530
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,280
then he i think he fights i can't

531
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,559
believe he finds a serpent or a dragon

532
00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:02,640
or whatever it is but you know it's been

533
00:19:00,559 --> 00:19:05,520
a while but the the reality is is that

534
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:08,240
grendel himself is this creature that

535
00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:10,320
lives in the moors in the bogs he sort

536
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:12,320
of lives in the the light the sort of

537
00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:14,320
like the underneath the box he lives in

538
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:16,559
the darkness between

539
00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,840
the that's just beyond the realm of

540
00:19:16,559 --> 00:19:19,280
light and you have to then think to

541
00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:20,880
yourself well it must have been yeah

542
00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:23,200
back in those era

543
00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:24,480
you it's not like today where yeah you

544
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,080
know we've got lights everywhere and you

545
00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:28,480
can barely see the stars back in those

546
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:30,000
days lights were rare and expensive and

547
00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,600
people lit lights because it was a

548
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,120
survival mechanism and it was a way of

549
00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:34,559
signaling and there was a way of you

550
00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:36,480
know having hearts and telling stories

551
00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:39,120
and all the rest of it but ultimately

552
00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,400
it's to keep the the bad things away

553
00:19:39,120 --> 00:19:42,240
because if you can see it humans are

554
00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:43,840
very sight oriented and if you can see

555
00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,520
it it's all right if you can't see it

556
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,520
it's oh it's behind you right it's the

557
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:50,160
part of every horror movie and i think

558
00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:52,080
you know so grendel just being a step

559
00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:54,240
into that darkness and being sort of

560
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:56,240
like this sort of creature of darkness

561
00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:58,640
uh but it's an incredibly powerful one

562
00:19:56,240 --> 00:20:00,320
that would eat uh eat other people and

563
00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:03,919
so you're there going okay well here is

564
00:20:00,320 --> 00:20:05,919
this ogre this is it's complex that has

565
00:20:03,919 --> 00:20:07,760
you know uh grendel's mother who's

566
00:20:05,919 --> 00:20:09,440
beowulf's kind of like second big fight

567
00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:11,280
if you will um

568
00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:14,000
you know there's there's relationships

569
00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:15,840
there's other complexity there uh bro

570
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:17,039
grendel speaks he doesn't do the

571
00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:18,640
classical

572
00:20:17,039 --> 00:20:20,640
ogre growling and all the rest of it

573
00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:22,559
yeah um and then

574
00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:25,840
you know i'll give you uh to take that

575
00:20:22,559 --> 00:20:27,440
over a step a bit further the yoga in

576
00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:30,080
the most famous ogre i would guess in

577
00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:32,960
our folklore is one of puss in boots

578
00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:34,799
right so in person boots the the ogre

579
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:37,600
that has the castle is this sort of

580
00:20:34,799 --> 00:20:39,679
decadent devil that costs magic and has

581
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:42,240
parties and you know it's just a real

582
00:20:39,679 --> 00:20:43,440
rake and it's meant to be a a satirical

583
00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:45,760
character that represents the

584
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:48,320
aristocracy right you know the yeah like

585
00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:50,559
all of the bad things in our society

586
00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:53,039
right all of the the nastiness of the

587
00:20:50,559 --> 00:20:55,120
that comes with the abuse of power by

588
00:20:53,039 --> 00:20:57,600
those um who

589
00:20:55,120 --> 00:20:59,120
aren't responsible like you know so

590
00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:02,960
maybe your ogres called boris i don't

591
00:20:59,120 --> 00:21:02,960
know but the point is if we're going

592
00:21:02,970 --> 00:21:07,679
[Laughter]

593
00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:10,159
but nevertheless um so so

594
00:21:07,679 --> 00:21:12,720
it's only in d and d honestly and it's

595
00:21:10,159 --> 00:21:15,679
you know uh it's only in dnd really that

596
00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:17,520
the ogre is this dumb sort of like and

597
00:21:15,679 --> 00:21:19,520
warcraft and similar kind of derivatives

598
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:20,240
things so there's this dumb kind of you

599
00:21:19,520 --> 00:21:23,120
know

600
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:24,720
butt-scratching horrible creature i mean

601
00:21:23,120 --> 00:21:27,200
it's they're always a horrible creature

602
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:30,880
they're there but they represent

603
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:32,880
a lot of humanity's fears about gluttony

604
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:35,360
a lot of humanity's fears about misuse

605
00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:38,080
of power of the of the tyranny of

606
00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:39,520
strength alone right and

607
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:41,600
that's where i think that mythological

608
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:43,120
context is super important because a

609
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:45,679
little bit of work to scratch under the

610
00:21:43,120 --> 00:21:47,360
surface and it gives you so much more

611
00:21:45,679 --> 00:21:48,320
depth as a dm

612
00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:50,080
to

613
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:51,840
play with this idea a little bit because

614
00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:53,520
the funny thing is this idea is in the

615
00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:55,840
back of everyone's head everyone's heard

616
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,600
of custom boots right maybe maybe people

617
00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:59,280
haven't necessarily heard of beowulf or

618
00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:00,960
haven't necessarily got into it and you

619
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:02,000
know they're not back that that's not

620
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:03,679
floating in their boat but everyone's

621
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:05,280
had a puss in boots you know everyone's

622
00:22:03,679 --> 00:22:07,840
had a shrek everyone said like yeah all

623
00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:10,159
of these sort of different things and so

624
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:13,440
it's a way of um

625
00:22:10,159 --> 00:22:16,159
accessing parts of people's unconscious

626
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:19,039
right because we're all programmed with

627
00:22:16,159 --> 00:22:21,039
stories like from when before we were

628
00:22:19,039 --> 00:22:22,640
before we can remember people were

629
00:22:21,039 --> 00:22:25,679
telling us stories people were telling

630
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:27,120
us you're reading us with c-spot run

631
00:22:25,679 --> 00:22:28,559
okay that's great but you know they're

632
00:22:27,120 --> 00:22:30,640
reading us other stories too and we're

633
00:22:28,559 --> 00:22:32,080
gonna yeah

634
00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:33,440
parties or whatever it is or you know

635
00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:34,880
when you're a kid and people tell

636
00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:36,159
stories or you know people when you go

637
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,840
to bed they'll tell you stories whatever

638
00:22:36,159 --> 00:22:40,480
it is you're watching tv you're seeing

639
00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:42,400
repeats star wars is a mythological

640
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:44,240
story right it's a mythological soap

641
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:46,320
opera yeah

642
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,600
uh uh george lucas is quite famous for

643
00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,440
uh for

644
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:53,120
referring to joseph campbell who is a

645
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:55,280
very famous vocalist who um is just

646
00:22:53,120 --> 00:22:58,000
incredible actually and it's it's

647
00:22:55,280 --> 00:23:01,760
somebody that i uh probably

648
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:05,360
helped me understand just how

649
00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:06,320
amazing and interconnected different

650
00:23:05,360 --> 00:23:08,799
um

651
00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:11,039
the human experience it genuinely is

652
00:23:08,799 --> 00:23:13,760
even by people that have no reason to

653
00:23:11,039 --> 00:23:15,600
know each other have no reason to even

654
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:17,200
like there's no trait right but the

655
00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,440
reality is some of these stories are

656
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,960
true because again you know everyone's

657
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:23,120
afraid of the darkness because the

658
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,440
darkness has things that eat people

659
00:23:23,120 --> 00:23:27,440
right you know everybody seeks you know

660
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:28,720
comfort and shelter right and so there's

661
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,720
all these things

662
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:33,679
and and community and so exclusion from

663
00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:35,360
community is a huge trope in almost you

664
00:23:33,679 --> 00:23:36,640
know in so many of these stories people

665
00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:38,880
are run away from community or they're

666
00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:41,200
taken away from it or they're exiled or

667
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:43,120
otherwise yes um and a little bit of

668
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:45,120
just i guess

669
00:23:43,120 --> 00:23:47,760
understanding and playing with these

670
00:23:45,120 --> 00:23:50,559
concepts i think adds a richness to

671
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:52,720
certainly my game um that i'm very glad

672
00:23:50,559 --> 00:23:56,240
to have come across

673
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:57,760
yes yeah no absolutely it's

674
00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:59,279
it's it they don't they don't tell you

675
00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:01,520
that in the dungeon masters guide i

676
00:23:59,279 --> 00:24:04,480
don't tell you that yeah

677
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:05,360
i've had other ideas

678
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,279
i think there are some additional

679
00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:09,279
reading material but not to the extent

680
00:24:07,279 --> 00:24:11,200
that we are you know that we're going on

681
00:24:09,279 --> 00:24:13,279
today and that's why people listen to

682
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,060
your podcast

683
00:24:13,279 --> 00:24:16,880
oh thanks

684
00:24:14,060 --> 00:24:18,720
[Laughter]

685
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,400
yeah so i mean you've

686
00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:22,480
done a far better job than i would have

687
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,159
been able to do to articulate this this

688
00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:25,520
kind of stuff but i did have

689
00:24:24,159 --> 00:24:27,440
i did have one

690
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:30,640
kind of different vector to take on in

691
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:32,960
today's topic and in your games and your

692
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:35,440
campaigns do you have any

693
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:38,480
like in in-game in universe internal

694
00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:40,640
myths and and mythology and yeah folk

695
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,320
tales and all that yes

696
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:44,400
what a wonderful question so

697
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:46,400
we do the thing that i before i started

698
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:48,320
this most recent game i was watching

699
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,159
matt colville series on you know how to

700
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:52,960
be dm and this was a wonderful thing red

701
00:24:50,159 --> 00:24:55,279
so in one of those games he mentions a

702
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,400
game called microscope microscope by ben

703
00:24:55,279 --> 00:24:58,880
robbins

704
00:24:56,400 --> 00:25:01,440
and i thought well one of the things i

705
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:02,480
wanted to bring to our game because we

706
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:04,880
were just the first one we were

707
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:06,880
streaming and what i wanted to do was

708
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:10,080
have it so that um

709
00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:12,559
the players because we're on video you

710
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:14,400
know you're playing a game now if i said

711
00:25:12,559 --> 00:25:16,880
to you

712
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:18,799
the marry celeste or the titanic like

713
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:21,760
you know you you look over the side of

714
00:25:18,799 --> 00:25:23,279
the ship and the fog clears a little bit

715
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:25,120
and you see there's some writing you're

716
00:25:23,279 --> 00:25:27,200
looking at upside down strangely enough

717
00:25:25,120 --> 00:25:29,600
as the ship lists off in one particular

718
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:31,840
direction buffed by the waves you take a

719
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,520
moment you you make your perception

720
00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:36,880
check or you don't or whatever it is and

721
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:38,799
you see the words hms titanic on the

722
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:41,679
side right like

723
00:25:38,799 --> 00:25:43,760
on screen in your brain everything is

724
00:25:41,679 --> 00:25:45,600
going i know about the titanic i know

725
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:48,240
lots about the titanic my brain has just

726
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,520
been primed your memory is in loads of

727
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,120
stuff in it and you're just like you're

728
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,200
there you're in the moment and you're

729
00:25:51,120 --> 00:25:54,799
able to talk about it and so i wanted

730
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,919
that experience because you know we all

731
00:25:54,799 --> 00:25:57,520
got together we played a few games

732
00:25:55,919 --> 00:25:59,360
beforehand and we were like great you

733
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:00,960
know let's let's um let's do this stream

734
00:25:59,360 --> 00:26:03,440
it'll be fun right and then i realized

735
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,279
that we're playing in a homebrew world

736
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,919
and playing the homebrew world

737
00:26:05,279 --> 00:26:10,720
i you would lose that we would end up

738
00:26:07,919 --> 00:26:12,559
doing a lot of something i don't really

739
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:14,640
like which is that sort of it's an

740
00:26:12,559 --> 00:26:17,440
explanatory narrative right where you

741
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:19,600
kind of like try and shove loads of law

742
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,520
into a moment where like a random npc

743
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:24,080
crops up and goes oh yes will you

744
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,520
remember buldar the lord of the sea no

745
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:26,799
one likes the exposition machine yeah

746
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,240
exactly no one loves exhibition right

747
00:26:26,799 --> 00:26:29,760
you know and so

748
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:31,520
and so as a result

749
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,760
what we did instead was we got together

750
00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:35,120
and played microscope um i've got to dig

751
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:36,320
those videos out at some point and

752
00:26:35,120 --> 00:26:38,320
actually put them on our stream because

753
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,600
they're i mean that that terrible

754
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,480
quality because i don't think we'd learn

755
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:42,159
how to

756
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:44,720
edit audio and video back then yeah it's

757
00:26:42,159 --> 00:26:45,919
a couple years back but but barring that

758
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:49,039
it was really interesting because what

759
00:26:45,919 --> 00:26:50,880
we did together was collaboratively play

760
00:26:49,039 --> 00:26:52,480
a game where we built the mythology of

761
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:55,200
the world so

762
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:57,039
we we started off with you know uh the

763
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:58,799
way that um it's been a couple years so

764
00:26:57,039 --> 00:27:00,799
excuse me and i'm sorry ben for if i get

765
00:26:58,799 --> 00:27:03,360
this this wrong uh that's the ben

766
00:27:00,799 --> 00:27:04,799
robbins but um the way the game works is

767
00:27:03,360 --> 00:27:06,960
that you

768
00:27:04,799 --> 00:27:09,039
there's no gm there's no orchestrator

769
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:11,279
each person takes a turn

770
00:27:09,039 --> 00:27:13,200
and um when everybody's taking a turn

771
00:27:11,279 --> 00:27:15,120
that's the end of the round and that you

772
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:17,440
have three or four rounds and when

773
00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:19,279
somebody takes a turn uh when somebody

774
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,799
begins around someone gets to define

775
00:27:19,279 --> 00:27:22,720
what's happening they define what their

776
00:27:20,799 --> 00:27:24,480
epoch is they define like oh well you

777
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:26,559
know and so you the the the game is

778
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:28,720
bookended by you could start it at the

779
00:27:26,559 --> 00:27:31,360
dawn of all time and you could say the

780
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:32,880
other book end is the modern era right

781
00:27:31,360 --> 00:27:35,679
and then somebody says somebody

782
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:37,360
basically um says something like okay

783
00:27:35,679 --> 00:27:38,640
cool well i'm gonna do a scene

784
00:27:37,360 --> 00:27:41,200
where we

785
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,480
uh are on top of a general's tent

786
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:45,200
looking in and you can see that there

787
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:46,799
are four people uh around a map and then

788
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:48,399
each person is playing microscope plays

789
00:27:46,799 --> 00:27:50,960
one of those people and they just make

790
00:27:48,399 --> 00:27:53,039
up that person they make up that entire

791
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:55,120
backstory for that person and then they

792
00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:56,399
play that scene out right and as a

793
00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:58,640
result

794
00:27:56,399 --> 00:28:01,120
what that did was that

795
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:04,720
populated and created

796
00:28:01,120 --> 00:28:07,440
the the the age of myth as it were in my

797
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:10,240
game right not entirely i didn't include

798
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:12,080
everything but one of the the deities

799
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,440
was called the bread god and we were

800
00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:16,480
like no we're not including the bread

801
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,320
god but you know but but but never was

802
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,480
very hungry at that moment but

803
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:23,440
but the reality is is that like a lot of

804
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:26,640
those characters right um uh sadar the

805
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:29,360
blood queen uh pithia various other

806
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:31,600
people like that uh were made up by the

807
00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:34,000
players in the game and

808
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:36,399
their backstory and their actions you

809
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:39,600
know would be played out and those

810
00:28:36,399 --> 00:28:42,480
actions like that in in one case uh

811
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:43,760
pythia who was um you know sort of an

812
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:47,120
archmage

813
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:49,279
basically uh attempted to ascend and by

814
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:51,279
doing so she pulled a thousand souls

815
00:28:49,279 --> 00:28:53,760
that she'd sacrificed right and so she's

816
00:28:51,279 --> 00:28:54,960
all set up this whole thing right and so

817
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,520
um

818
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:59,440
however it went wrong and all that power

819
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:02,000
kind of like you know had nowhere to go

820
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:03,520
and so instead it blew up a tower right

821
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:06,000
loads of people died usual kind of your

822
00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:09,440
minor capitalism stuff right but what

823
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:11,600
was nice was when the players looked at

824
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:14,880
the map i then drew

825
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:17,360
they saw the ruins of pythius tower

826
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:19,440
and they were like i know that i was

827
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:22,320
there i recognized it and so when when i

828
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:23,120
had an npc just mention it in passing

829
00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:25,279
right

830
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:27,919
they were like huh or i had another one

831
00:29:25,279 --> 00:29:29,760
that where one of the players um uh

832
00:29:27,919 --> 00:29:31,919
created this character called manassas

833
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:34,480
who had fallen out with his sister who

834
00:29:31,919 --> 00:29:36,399
was also these again age of myths so

835
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:38,159
very powerful beings

836
00:29:36,399 --> 00:29:41,039
and

837
00:29:38,159 --> 00:29:42,159
they then had this war this sort of you

838
00:29:41,039 --> 00:29:43,919
know huge

839
00:29:42,159 --> 00:29:45,760
spell battle and everything else then at

840
00:29:43,919 --> 00:29:47,520
the end of it all another mountain range

841
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,279
destroyed because you know if you can't

842
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,960
destroy a mountain range of dm what good

843
00:29:49,279 --> 00:29:52,799
are you right

844
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:55,120
so what then happened was

845
00:29:52,799 --> 00:29:57,440
in one of the games

846
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:59,679
in one of our sessions a sailor just

847
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,360
swore he was just like you know by

848
00:29:59,679 --> 00:30:03,440
nasa's left testicle or something like

849
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:05,840
that right and what i loved about that

850
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,760
was all of the players like on screen on

851
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:09,600
camera they all blinked recognition

852
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:11,039
right and i i that was the thing i was

853
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,799
hoping for from the beginning and it was

854
00:30:11,039 --> 00:30:14,080
amazing and so i i thoroughly recommend

855
00:30:12,799 --> 00:30:15,279
i think it's a wonderful way of doing it

856
00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:17,600
i'm sure there are hundreds of other

857
00:30:15,279 --> 00:30:20,240
ways of doing it as well but the concept

858
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:22,320
of of building your mythology

859
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:24,480
collaboratively within the game and not

860
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:25,919
just pulling it in from

861
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,200
external thoughts we talked a lot about

862
00:30:25,919 --> 00:30:28,480
you know isn't it amazing we've got all

863
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:30,320
these cultural sources that you can pull

864
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,559
in and we do right and we do that

865
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:34,480
extensively but then to also have your

866
00:30:32,559 --> 00:30:37,039
players and other people around you

867
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:38,960
co-create that mythos because

868
00:30:37,039 --> 00:30:40,960
you know they're playing a character but

869
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,480
then they're still a person and that

870
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,240
person was actually the person that was

871
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:46,960
involved in that scene and then yeah

872
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:48,880
that it creates a complexity and

873
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,840
an experience that i think is amazing

874
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:52,640
how about you have you ever done

875
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:55,039
anything like that uh well no i know i

876
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:58,080
sound lame uh i'm sorry let's try that

877
00:30:55,039 --> 00:30:58,080
again let's try that again

878
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:02,320
the ship sale the titanic's already

879
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,320
something

880
00:31:03,039 --> 00:31:06,880
no no no not at all like again this is

881
00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:08,159
an i was saying on a recent show that i

882
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:10,159
was on i was like

883
00:31:08,159 --> 00:31:10,960
playing d d

884
00:31:10,159 --> 00:31:13,519
is

885
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:15,120
hard or let me say like the skill

886
00:31:13,519 --> 00:31:17,120
barrier that is like all over the shop

887
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,960
and on the face of it it's

888
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:20,640
it is very easy you pick up some dice

889
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,919
people sit around the table you play

890
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,919
it's not very easy at all it's an

891
00:31:21,919 --> 00:31:25,760
incredibly accessible game anyone tells

892
00:31:23,919 --> 00:31:27,519
you otherwise is uh

893
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:30,000
like me it's like

894
00:31:27,519 --> 00:31:31,760
i i i i put my my wife's a bit like

895
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,120
yours not a bit like you in some ways

896
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:34,320
and that she's probably like your

897
00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,080
teenage years and that she'd never

898
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:38,080
really read any fantasy and all the rest

899
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:39,600
of it and nobody in the sci-fi either

900
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:42,159
and so we tried to get this playlist and

901
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:44,159
she was it just took a lot of effort

902
00:31:42,159 --> 00:31:45,679
just to get uh it's not not not because

903
00:31:44,159 --> 00:31:47,600
she's thick i mean she's proper smart

904
00:31:45,679 --> 00:31:50,240
it's more a case of like you know

905
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,919
it's just if you've not engaged with it

906
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:54,799
and you're presented with a character

907
00:31:51,919 --> 00:31:57,360
sheet let alone dnd beyond right it's

908
00:31:54,799 --> 00:31:59,200
just it's a lot of hard work it is and

909
00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,720
it means it means very little to you as

910
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:01,760
well like you know maybe somebody

911
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,360
doesn't know the difference between a

912
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,559
long bow and a short bow which i would

913
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:06,159
forgive them for not knowing the

914
00:32:04,559 --> 00:32:07,760
difference despite that being a

915
00:32:06,159 --> 00:32:09,600
mechanical and b a huge flavor

916
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:11,679
difference as well so now the reason i'm

917
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,760
saying it that it's hard is because that

918
00:32:11,679 --> 00:32:15,440
what you've suggested is like a really

919
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:18,559
fantastic idea and there are ways to

920
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,840
emulate that in 5e i'm leveraging that

921
00:32:18,559 --> 00:32:21,360
because that's where my experience lies

922
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:23,120
and you can have a session

923
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,399
minus five minus four minus three minus

924
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,000
two minus one in the zero and then hit

925
00:32:24,399 --> 00:32:27,440
the start of the campaign where you set

926
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:28,399
up all of those

927
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:31,279
things

928
00:32:28,399 --> 00:32:33,360
but when i started my primary campaign

929
00:32:31,279 --> 00:32:35,760
only two players have played before

930
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:38,159
one of which has you know a bit bit more

931
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:39,919
of my seniors he's got a lot of

932
00:32:38,159 --> 00:32:41,840
fantasy experience and a couple of guys

933
00:32:39,919 --> 00:32:43,679
didn't have any in they're more like i

934
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,559
play call of duty okay

935
00:32:43,679 --> 00:32:45,279
right

936
00:32:44,559 --> 00:32:47,039
so

937
00:32:45,279 --> 00:32:48,799
it's already as we just discussed hard

938
00:32:47,039 --> 00:32:50,399
to hit the ground running

939
00:32:48,799 --> 00:32:53,519
at session one let alone we're going to

940
00:32:50,399 --> 00:32:55,360
do some mythos of the world and then a

941
00:32:53,519 --> 00:32:56,799
oh yeah will they remember will they

942
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,960
care don't know yet don't know the type

943
00:32:56,799 --> 00:33:01,440
of players they are

944
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:04,000
but i mean honestly it's the the worst

945
00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:06,399
option and you know it's not not to not

946
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:08,880
to slam dms to do this i'm just not one

947
00:33:06,399 --> 00:33:11,039
of them which is the ones that hand a

948
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:13,039
ring binder to all their players and say

949
00:33:11,039 --> 00:33:14,960
please do your homework and read 400

950
00:33:13,039 --> 00:33:16,960
pages of of my world setting and

951
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,720
mythology it's a temptation for all of

952
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:20,080
us but yeah

953
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:23,360
there's a middle ground which i like to

954
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:25,440
think i've hit in that i did it a after

955
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:27,600
we'd started maybe even good maybe for

956
00:33:25,440 --> 00:33:29,600
bad but more as a okay the players

957
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,720
actually want something let me pull my

958
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:32,799
finger out and actually make something

959
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,960
for them and it was a page of

960
00:33:32,799 --> 00:33:37,120
the real heavy hitters like

961
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:39,279
what is magic in this world like yeah

962
00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:42,240
are gonna run scared or are they gonna

963
00:33:39,279 --> 00:33:44,399
cheer and and cry um what are the main

964
00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:45,440
few days that you can leverage should

965
00:33:44,399 --> 00:33:47,440
you need to

966
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:50,399
which reminds me i wanted to loot back

967
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:52,480
rounds that how forgotten realms and d

968
00:33:50,399 --> 00:33:53,360
and d quote-unquote d is a bit of a mess

969
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,120
and

970
00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:57,919
between

971
00:33:55,120 --> 00:34:00,159
the crutch that is beyond versus having

972
00:33:57,919 --> 00:34:01,279
books of earlier editions and published

973
00:34:00,159 --> 00:34:03,519
material

974
00:34:01,279 --> 00:34:06,080
combine that with people just googling

975
00:34:03,519 --> 00:34:08,960
things there being very very many

976
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:10,000
unofficial fan wikis that have got again

977
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,359
a whole

978
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:13,359
milieu of

979
00:34:11,359 --> 00:34:15,200
homebrew things aside

980
00:34:13,359 --> 00:34:16,720
main things but that published thing was

981
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,520
from 30 years ago

982
00:34:16,720 --> 00:34:19,520
so

983
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:22,000
when my players one of them had to

984
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:23,839
reroll a new character unfortunately and

985
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,720
he's made a paladin and he's trying to

986
00:34:23,839 --> 00:34:26,399
find

987
00:34:24,720 --> 00:34:28,800
some way some some higher power that he

988
00:34:26,399 --> 00:34:29,919
can subscribe his oath to

989
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,040
and he's oh i've been thinking about

990
00:34:29,919 --> 00:34:32,720
this dear e

991
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,639
all right dude i've never heard of that

992
00:34:32,720 --> 00:34:37,040
person before in my life

993
00:34:34,639 --> 00:34:38,720
like where's that come from i found it

994
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,720
on this random

995
00:34:38,720 --> 00:34:42,800
fan wiki page

996
00:34:40,720 --> 00:34:44,399
let me take a look and let me see how

997
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:47,119
introducing this

998
00:34:44,399 --> 00:34:49,440
piece of now canon potentially myth in

999
00:34:47,119 --> 00:34:51,119
my world is going to impact the wider

1000
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,560
world because where there wasn't

1001
00:34:51,119 --> 00:34:54,399
churches to this person now there

1002
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:55,839
probably will be and

1003
00:34:54,399 --> 00:34:57,599
that was

1004
00:34:55,839 --> 00:34:58,480
you know i've only provided them six or

1005
00:34:57,599 --> 00:35:00,079
seven

1006
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:01,680
um but of course you know player

1007
00:35:00,079 --> 00:35:03,920
creativity is

1008
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:06,480
at the beast unto itself and well this

1009
00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:08,320
is this is where um at least to my mind

1010
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,680
anyway this is where mythology kind of

1011
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:12,400
comes to the rescue again a little bit

1012
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:15,119
right because i'll give you a

1013
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:19,040
an example of it so the god of the sun

1014
00:35:15,119 --> 00:35:22,880
apollo the um you know mithras

1015
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:25,520
um you know various other uh deity surya

1016
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:28,720
in indian mythology you know they all

1017
00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:31,599
are basically the same you know deity

1018
00:35:28,720 --> 00:35:33,280
who's spread um you know backwards and

1019
00:35:31,599 --> 00:35:34,880
forwards and kind of syncretically

1020
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:36,560
through the persian empire and through

1021
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:38,560
greece and through rome and everything

1022
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:40,240
else and the cultivators even pushed its

1023
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:42,000
way up into you know in fact actually if

1024
00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:43,359
you look at it the the church of bistros

1025
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:44,880
is currently in

1026
00:35:43,359 --> 00:35:46,880
somewhere in london and sort of it's a

1027
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:48,000
ruined building near um near the back of

1028
00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:50,400
um

1029
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:53,040
in the city of london in the old city

1030
00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:55,920
and uh you know a part of the freemasons

1031
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:57,839
and all this sort of stuff right and so

1032
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:59,119
the thing that's nice and people do that

1033
00:35:57,839 --> 00:36:00,960
kind of stuff more well because they do

1034
00:35:59,119 --> 00:36:02,640
it all the time is that it's just

1035
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,680
another aspect it's just another avatar

1036
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:05,119
it's another

1037
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:07,200
way that people

1038
00:36:05,119 --> 00:36:09,839
you know rather like the real world it's

1039
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,800
another way that people venerate the sun

1040
00:36:09,839 --> 00:36:12,480
and so

1041
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,560
you know you can just kind of like go

1042
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,320
yeah cool that's that's what that god's

1043
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:18,480
called over there you know and it's sort

1044
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,920
of it's it's blatant cheating right but

1045
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,680
it also allows you

1046
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:24,079
it also then allows to create some of

1047
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:25,440
the the sort of story drift that we see

1048
00:36:24,079 --> 00:36:27,200
in the real world because again i

1049
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,800
mentioned cinderella earlier the

1050
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,400
cinderella that we're used to is not the

1051
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,920
same as the germanic cinderella it's not

1052
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,839
the same as the chinese indians not seen

1053
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,680
as the russian cinderella but the story

1054
00:36:33,839 --> 00:36:36,880
is roughly the same right and so you can

1055
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:38,240
do the same thing with the deities you

1056
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:40,640
can do the same thing with your heroes

1057
00:36:38,240 --> 00:36:43,440
right so oh you call him fred the

1058
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:46,560
destroyer we refer to him as you know

1059
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:47,599
enoch the the merciful right yeah it's

1060
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:49,760
all yeah

1061
00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:51,760
yeah a matter of perspective sometimes

1062
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,850
absolutely yeah exactly right yeah

1063
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:56,159
absolutely

1064
00:36:52,850 --> 00:36:56,159
[Music]

1065
00:36:58,720 --> 00:37:04,400
[Music]

1066
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,440
now if you had a large enough world to

1067
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,760
support

1068
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:09,520
that transmission of ideas

1069
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:11,599
that i don't because i'm an idiot and

1070
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:13,359
can't do geography uh then

1071
00:37:11,599 --> 00:37:15,119
that might work but my my islands are

1072
00:37:13,359 --> 00:37:16,880
well well too small and too close

1073
00:37:15,119 --> 00:37:18,320
together there's literally like

1074
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:20,400
how has that changed so much i can

1075
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:22,800
literally see it's like you know

1076
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:25,520
england to france which i guess there

1077
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:27,359
would be some but still it's it's yeah i

1078
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:30,720
i envy you having the common sense of

1079
00:37:27,359 --> 00:37:33,200
having a small place uh um i i i decided

1080
00:37:30,720 --> 00:37:35,040
mine was i i looked up to see well okay

1081
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:36,560
well how big how big could you be if

1082
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,079
you're in the golden log zone and before

1083
00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:39,839
you fell apart it's a planet where

1084
00:37:38,079 --> 00:37:41,040
you're gonna be that big and so it's

1085
00:37:39,839 --> 00:37:44,000
huge

1086
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:45,119
yeah i don't see i i got i got as far as

1087
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:47,119
the planet you're on is in the

1088
00:37:45,119 --> 00:37:49,839
goldilocks zone and then

1089
00:37:47,119 --> 00:37:51,920
in research boom stop close that book

1090
00:37:49,839 --> 00:37:54,000
back to the library you go we're done

1091
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,000
and

1092
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,160
i did not do like

1093
00:37:56,720 --> 00:38:00,320
baby's first map

1094
00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:02,400
well let me let me have fun mess around

1095
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:04,240
and uh yeah needless to say the

1096
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,280
distances are all screwy and they're

1097
00:38:04,240 --> 00:38:06,240
standing there luckily i don't know but

1098
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,160
that's all right you know you know it's

1099
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:10,160
funny uh so one of the things i like

1100
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:11,920
about map making in general and that is

1101
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:13,440
just sort of like we're moving away from

1102
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:16,480
this mythology one thing i like about

1103
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:18,160
map baking generals is maps are a story

1104
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,599
and for the longest time were stories

1105
00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,520
right because

1106
00:38:19,599 --> 00:38:24,079
people had no like

1107
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:27,200
longitude hadn't been invented right and

1108
00:38:24,079 --> 00:38:29,359
so you know people had no real way of

1109
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:31,839
measuring the earth and had no real way

1110
00:38:29,359 --> 00:38:33,040
of doing these things to scale so maps

1111
00:38:31,839 --> 00:38:35,200
really were

1112
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:38,240
you know uh you hear hear there be

1113
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,240
monsters right yes

1114
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,839
very very approximate kind of

1115
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:43,760
representations of things unless it was

1116
00:38:41,839 --> 00:38:45,520
somewhere that was very very populated

1117
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,359
and lots of people had spent time doing

1118
00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:49,280
math but even then like you know the

1119
00:38:47,359 --> 00:38:51,200
royal cartography society sort of like

1120
00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:53,760
publishes these maps and that

1121
00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:56,000
that artifacts for no better word right

1122
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,520
you know especially pre-printing press

1123
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:59,599
maps you know if you think about

1124
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:02,079
everywhere back in those days right you

1125
00:38:59,599 --> 00:39:03,680
know somebody has drawn this map and

1126
00:39:02,079 --> 00:39:05,920
you've gone through great trouble to do

1127
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:08,400
it well the chances of it being accurate

1128
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:10,720
approximately zero okay

1129
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,920
yeah yes it's really interesting to see

1130
00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:13,440
those

1131
00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:15,119
when people travel they like traveled

1132
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,560
around europe and it's their interpret

1133
00:39:15,119 --> 00:39:18,400
like just from

1134
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,359
that felt like a thousand kilometers

1135
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,480
that is

1136
00:39:19,359 --> 00:39:22,560
in my head a different obviously a

1137
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:25,040
different metric at that time but like

1138
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:27,280
broadly this is this area of the country

1139
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:28,800
that i moved in and then you wouldn't

1140
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:31,119
literally unrecognizable you would never

1141
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:34,160
be able to place that to like our modern

1142
00:39:31,119 --> 00:39:35,359
day understanding uh of was it matt murr

1143
00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:36,800
what's the weighing for the way we

1144
00:39:35,359 --> 00:39:37,680
currently use like a map and an atlas

1145
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:39,520
mercury

1146
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:41,680
the most common ones locate a projection

1147
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:43,839
but um i'm so tough that i got that

1148
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:43,839
right

1149
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,839
and it wasn't some other weird way of

1150
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,359
measuring numbers or something that has

1151
00:39:47,839 --> 00:39:51,520
got screwed up in my head but yeah the

1152
00:39:49,359 --> 00:39:53,040
mercator projection like you never

1153
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:55,359
unrecognizable if you put the two side

1154
00:39:53,040 --> 00:39:57,040
by side it's super interesting to be and

1155
00:39:55,359 --> 00:39:59,280
they're trying to you know imagine being

1156
00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:00,800
in that world and trying to plan trade

1157
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,000
routes or something and you're like yeah

1158
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:02,960
it's amazing hang on a minute there

1159
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,920
should be

1160
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,240
this says there should be like a

1161
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:07,119
mountain range here and it's the sea

1162
00:40:06,240 --> 00:40:09,200
here

1163
00:40:07,119 --> 00:40:11,280
well which is what i mean obviously

1164
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:12,400
look you look back at the sort of um

1165
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:14,079
uh

1166
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:15,440
ancient sailors and all the rest who

1167
00:40:14,079 --> 00:40:17,760
made their way like you know the ancient

1168
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:19,280
chinese or even sort of uh the

1169
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:20,720
polynesians or whatever made their way

1170
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:22,720
across the pacific or they made their

1171
00:40:20,720 --> 00:40:24,079
way they navigated their way so around

1172
00:40:22,720 --> 00:40:25,119
the horn of africa various things like

1173
00:40:24,079 --> 00:40:27,839
that

1174
00:40:25,119 --> 00:40:29,280
it's incredible right oh yes you can hug

1175
00:40:27,839 --> 00:40:30,800
the coast of the land and keep it on

1176
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:32,640
your right and then hope that's gonna

1177
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:35,520
work out for you but you're kind of

1178
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:37,200
limited at that point right um

1179
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:38,960
the concept of obviously people

1180
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:40,960
navigated by the stars that was one of

1181
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:42,319
the primary ways of doing it and so you

1182
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,480
know that kind of helped you because the

1183
00:40:42,319 --> 00:40:47,040
stars are that that that is a much

1184
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:49,040
flatter map in the night sky obviously

1185
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:50,880
so it's much more available to presume

1186
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:53,599
you have weather that allows you to do

1187
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:55,119
that but yeah i think um

1188
00:40:53,599 --> 00:40:56,880
maps are

1189
00:40:55,119 --> 00:40:59,839
as much

1190
00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:00,720
a way of telling a story

1191
00:40:59,839 --> 00:41:03,200
as

1192
00:41:00,720 --> 00:41:04,640
words are and i think that's one of them

1193
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,560
come back to all the rings that's why

1194
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:08,400
you know there are maps in all the rings

1195
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:09,599
and tolkien specifically

1196
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:10,720
was very

1197
00:41:09,599 --> 00:41:13,200
careful

1198
00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:15,280
to make sure like he used the maps to

1199
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,480
make sure that at any particular time in

1200
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:18,640
the story

1201
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:21,280
he knew where all the characters were so

1202
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:23,599
if frodo is supposed to be here then you

1203
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:25,520
know aragorn is supposed to be there and

1204
00:41:23,599 --> 00:41:28,960
you know uh sarah man is supposed to be

1205
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:31,040
here and it's it's just a um

1206
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:34,319
a way of

1207
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:36,240
creating a physical relationship between

1208
00:41:34,319 --> 00:41:38,640
the story characters and so it's a

1209
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:41,680
representation in time as well as in it

1210
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:44,800
it's it's just mind-blowing yeah yeah i

1211
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:46,480
i if i was to go back now i would much

1212
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:47,359
much much prefer

1213
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:48,720
i know

1214
00:41:47,359 --> 00:41:50,400
i'll tell you why in a second i'd much

1215
00:41:48,720 --> 00:41:52,400
prefer to do the map

1216
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,240
uh as if it would be one that they found

1217
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:55,599
in game so it would be like you know cpf

1218
00:41:54,240 --> 00:41:56,480
filtered and it would be a bit rough

1219
00:41:55,599 --> 00:41:58,400
around the edges and there'd just be

1220
00:41:56,480 --> 00:42:00,240
more than landmark there's no writing on

1221
00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:02,000
it maybe because it's just like there's

1222
00:42:00,240 --> 00:42:03,680
a big thing that i saw in the distance

1223
00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:05,040
didn't go near it whereas the weird

1224
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:08,079
middle ground that i did now because

1225
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:10,160
it's kind of half bird's eye view half

1226
00:42:08,079 --> 00:42:12,000
atlas style half

1227
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:13,760
what they would find in the game

1228
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:16,079
i realized that's three halves

1229
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:17,520
but uh if only doing it that style for

1230
00:42:16,079 --> 00:42:19,119
the reason is because

1231
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:20,880
you can just say well

1232
00:42:19,119 --> 00:42:23,280
the person who wrote the map made a

1233
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:24,560
mistake if indeed you need to do some dm

1234
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,599
fudging at some point you could be like

1235
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:26,960
oh well they just didn't they just

1236
00:42:25,599 --> 00:42:29,040
didn't go that way so they didn't see

1237
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:31,040
that thing there like get over it

1238
00:42:29,040 --> 00:42:33,520
i mean it's real for us because we live

1239
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:35,599
in an era of google maps right yeah but

1240
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:38,160
you know if you if you uh uh grew up

1241
00:42:35,599 --> 00:42:39,680
before google maps you uh you you had

1242
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:40,960
this thing in your car if you're if you

1243
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:42,079
grew up in the uk anyway called the

1244
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:45,200
eight zed

1245
00:42:42,079 --> 00:42:47,520
right and the the hz is basically a map

1246
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,960
book with an index at the back and so

1247
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,319
you had to learn how to read maps you

1248
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:52,319
turn it upside down you get which way

1249
00:42:50,319 --> 00:42:54,160
are we going and basically arguments in

1250
00:42:52,319 --> 00:42:56,800
the car of like oh wait hang on no you

1251
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:59,040
turn left oh back three things ago and

1252
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:02,319
all the rest and so you know we even

1253
00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:03,599
that is inconceivable the concept of in

1254
00:43:02,319 --> 00:43:05,680
in this is where it becomes interesting

1255
00:43:03,599 --> 00:43:07,920
so you think about it yeah like a

1256
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:10,160
medieval city or if not if not a

1257
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,040
medieval city wherever your dnd setting

1258
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:14,400
is your city right how is there a map of

1259
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:16,000
your city

1260
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:18,240
how do people know to get around if they

1261
00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:20,240
if they're not from the city

1262
00:43:18,240 --> 00:43:22,079
like even today if you were to travel

1263
00:43:20,240 --> 00:43:25,680
somewhere i mean my first trip i was

1264
00:43:22,079 --> 00:43:27,040
very lucky my first trip to tokyo was in

1265
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:29,119
i must have been

1266
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:32,480
23 maybe younger than maybe

1267
00:43:29,119 --> 00:43:33,920
99 whatever right um and

1268
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:35,839
it's a bit like there's that movie lost

1269
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:37,599
in translation right which is it does

1270
00:43:35,839 --> 00:43:39,760
manage to capture

1271
00:43:37,599 --> 00:43:41,280
just how

1272
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:43,440
different

1273
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:46,240
showing up in tokyo and

1274
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:49,200
seeing the only things in english are

1275
00:43:46,240 --> 00:43:51,040
brand signs yeah sony

1276
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:53,520
you know uh phillips

1277
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:55,920
whatever it is right and everything else

1278
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:58,640
is in a language that's foreign to you

1279
00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:00,640
and the street signs uh certainly for me

1280
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:02,800
anyway uh not being a native japanese

1281
00:44:00,640 --> 00:44:04,480
speaker in any sense on the manner um

1282
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:06,640
and so um

1283
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:08,800
that sense of

1284
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:10,800
being lost right that sense of being

1285
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:12,400
unable to know where i was going both

1286
00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:13,920
was very freeing because then i couldn't

1287
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:15,680
really go the wrong way because like

1288
00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:16,800
yeah and also japan is incredibly safe

1289
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,560
so i wasn't really worried about

1290
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:21,119
anything but also

1291
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,960
but also was was fascinating because it

1292
00:44:21,119 --> 00:44:25,040
got me thinking about

1293
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:27,599
well if i was in if i showed up in some

1294
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:28,800
random medieval city and i couldn't read

1295
00:44:27,599 --> 00:44:31,200
the map

1296
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:32,800
that would do you just walk around lots

1297
00:44:31,200 --> 00:44:35,200
let's walk around just trying to find

1298
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:36,720
somewhere and i remember once there was

1299
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:38,400
i was uh i had a pair of glasses on at

1300
00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:39,920
the time and the screw came out the

1301
00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:41,200
glasses right and sorry for this very

1302
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,800
boring story everybody that's now

1303
00:44:41,200 --> 00:44:44,960
switching off but you know speaking

1304
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:47,119
about the glasses and i literally was

1305
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:48,000
like the simplest thing in the world you

1306
00:44:47,119 --> 00:44:49,599
get it

1307
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:51,119
you you're an optician you go to the

1308
00:44:49,599 --> 00:44:52,400
department store someone finds you in

1309
00:44:51,119 --> 00:44:53,599
those tiny little among your screws and

1310
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:56,079
there's tiny little like you know

1311
00:44:53,599 --> 00:44:57,680
unnecessarily small screwdrivers right

1312
00:44:56,079 --> 00:44:58,800
okay very very straightforward thing to

1313
00:44:57,680 --> 00:45:01,200
do

1314
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:02,560
in anywhere else that you speak english

1315
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:05,040
even if you spoke spanish or french

1316
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:08,960
whatever i'd be able to muddle along uh

1317
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:11,040
in in in japan i this very nice passerby

1318
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:13,040
stops and it was like ask me in japanese

1319
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:15,119
like yeah i presume something along the

1320
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:16,880
lines of you know are you lost do you

1321
00:45:15,119 --> 00:45:18,480
need help because yeah i'm rather

1322
00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:19,599
distressed at my glasses

1323
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:20,560
and i realized i had no idea what

1324
00:45:19,599 --> 00:45:22,319
they're saying but i presume they're

1325
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:24,480
being quite nice still smiling and then

1326
00:45:22,319 --> 00:45:26,240
so i ended up phantomizing like you know

1327
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:29,119
like some sort of like street clown of

1328
00:45:26,240 --> 00:45:31,760
like how my glasses were broken and yeah

1329
00:45:29,119 --> 00:45:33,839
you know screw and like the yeah all

1330
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:35,680
this kind of people who are listening on

1331
00:45:33,839 --> 00:45:37,119
the podcast and not able to watch it the

1332
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:39,599
red ball is behind the blue ball but i'm

1333
00:45:37,119 --> 00:45:40,640
like i'm i'm gesturing sort of like you

1334
00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:41,680
know

1335
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:43,359
um

1336
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,400
to support analogies watching me do this

1337
00:45:43,359 --> 00:45:47,760
going and that's not going to work on

1338
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:49,440
the podcast but uh but um uh

1339
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,040
but so i'm like

1340
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:53,839
sort of doing all this kind of random

1341
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:55,440
mime until they finally go oh great and

1342
00:45:53,839 --> 00:45:56,880
then i realized how the hell are they

1343
00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:59,440
gonna give me directions

1344
00:45:56,880 --> 00:46:00,800
yes and so they were very very lovely

1345
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,560
and they actually walked me to a

1346
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:03,920
department store basically no problem

1347
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:06,480
which is really lovely i mean everyone's

1348
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:08,640
fancy place but uh but but i but it did

1349
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:10,560
get me thinking in the back of my head

1350
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:12,319
like if you showed up in the medieval

1351
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:15,520
town of like fifty thousand people or a

1352
00:46:12,319 --> 00:46:17,599
hundred thousand people and you didn't

1353
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:20,960
speak let's say let's say you show up in

1354
00:46:17,599 --> 00:46:23,280
an orcish city right and you are

1355
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:24,640
you know you just speak common

1356
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:26,720
the [ __ ] do you do

1357
00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:28,240
yeah right i mean like yeah you you

1358
00:46:26,720 --> 00:46:30,960
can't read the maps you can't

1359
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:32,240
communicate with anybody and you know

1360
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:34,319
it's like you

1361
00:46:32,240 --> 00:46:37,040
we all kind of gloss over this stuff as

1362
00:46:34,319 --> 00:46:40,160
dms because it's hard right yes exactly

1363
00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:41,359
so it's also genuine it's also authentic

1364
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:43,680
right and so

1365
00:46:41,359 --> 00:46:45,200
yeah i think there's a uh yeah we've

1366
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:47,119
we've sort of

1367
00:46:45,200 --> 00:46:49,599
wondered merry way on this conversation

1368
00:46:47,119 --> 00:46:53,119
but i but i i you've been to japan did

1369
00:46:49,599 --> 00:46:54,880
you have a similar experience i think

1370
00:46:53,119 --> 00:46:56,800
i got an anecdote about seoul when we

1371
00:46:54,880 --> 00:46:58,240
went to south korea but for japan the

1372
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:59,599
concerns have again they've been

1373
00:46:58,240 --> 00:47:00,880
fortunate enough to be

1374
00:46:59,599 --> 00:47:03,200
i think we were quite lucky in that

1375
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:04,240
obviously tokyo central tokyo is

1376
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:07,440
in terms of

1377
00:47:04,240 --> 00:47:10,079
the like metro and stuff

1378
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:12,160
at least have it in english as well so

1379
00:47:10,079 --> 00:47:14,480
that is actually despite the vast

1380
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:16,640
distance between my home and tokyo it's

1381
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:18,800
quite easy to

1382
00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:20,480
at least use the metro i tend to not use

1383
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:22,160
bus i don't use buses in the uk to be

1384
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:24,880
honest but because they suck not because

1385
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:26,880
i don't know how to ask for a ticket

1386
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:29,119
um but i tend to avoid buses for that

1387
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:30,559
reason uh when went out and about but

1388
00:47:29,119 --> 00:47:32,720
the one confusing thing when we went to

1389
00:47:30,559 --> 00:47:35,520
tokyo was um

1390
00:47:32,720 --> 00:47:39,119
subway metro hukidori fine crystal clear

1391
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:40,240
color-coded which is beyond uh language

1392
00:47:39,119 --> 00:47:41,680
yeah and

1393
00:47:40,240 --> 00:47:44,240
obviously it's all the voice overs in

1394
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:45,680
english as well but we went to get a

1395
00:47:44,240 --> 00:47:47,839
train up to

1396
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:51,200
nico which is like an hour and a bit two

1397
00:47:47,839 --> 00:47:54,240
hours north of tokyo and that was an

1398
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:56,079
exercise in risk essentially of getting

1399
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:57,680
on the right train because that was like

1400
00:47:56,079 --> 00:48:00,319
you need to get this super express

1401
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:02,400
limited line okay well that was three

1402
00:48:00,319 --> 00:48:04,319
descriptors for a train

1403
00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:06,720
super express and limited right okay let

1404
00:48:04,319 --> 00:48:07,839
me try and find out that one is um

1405
00:48:06,720 --> 00:48:09,520
and then you've got to change like a

1406
00:48:07,839 --> 00:48:12,559
local trunk line and then you've got to

1407
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:13,520
change into something else so that was

1408
00:48:12,559 --> 00:48:16,160
you know basically as soon as you're out

1409
00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:18,400
of the metro metropolitan area it gets a

1410
00:48:16,160 --> 00:48:20,400
little bit trickier because

1411
00:48:18,400 --> 00:48:22,160
colors start to fade away and you're not

1412
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:24,880
it's all just one uniform color on this

1413
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:27,680
that the other but um when we were in

1414
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:29,119
seoul unfortunately i was very poorly

1415
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,720
for the first three days i just

1416
00:48:29,119 --> 00:48:33,520
basically couldn't talk because my voice

1417
00:48:30,720 --> 00:48:34,960
was uh so my throat was so sore so my

1418
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:37,280
partner was traveling with she was like

1419
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:38,559
let me let me try a we'll try and find a

1420
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:41,040
pharmacy

1421
00:48:38,559 --> 00:48:43,119
okay what's the korean word for that god

1422
00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:45,040
knows we'll just look for the symbol i

1423
00:48:43,119 --> 00:48:47,200
suppose right and we did and on there

1424
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:49,680
i'm looking ill because i am jet lagged

1425
00:48:47,200 --> 00:48:51,200
and b i'm hideously ill anyway

1426
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,800
we go inside and she's trying her best

1427
00:48:51,200 --> 00:48:54,160
to talk to the the doctor behind the

1428
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:56,480
counter she's got her phone out she's

1429
00:48:54,160 --> 00:48:58,000
trying to you know again translation we

1430
00:48:56,480 --> 00:49:00,400
at least we can at least attempt it not

1431
00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:01,839
like in the you know the setup you gave

1432
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,119
and she's like ah you know my

1433
00:49:01,839 --> 00:49:05,359
boyfriend's ill

1434
00:49:03,119 --> 00:49:07,680
and he took one look at me and then in

1435
00:49:05,359 --> 00:49:09,040
insanely good english just like how long

1436
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:10,559
have you had the symptoms what are you

1437
00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:12,000
feeling

1438
00:49:10,559 --> 00:49:17,079
i missed that and the other and he's an

1439
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:17,079
older an older generation dude as well

1440
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:22,559
how do you feel about this yeah that's

1441
00:49:20,559 --> 00:49:24,319
fine okay these two times a day for the

1442
00:49:22,559 --> 00:49:26,240
next three days if you still need them

1443
00:49:24,319 --> 00:49:27,520
come back later on

1444
00:49:26,240 --> 00:49:28,880
thank you thank you thank you so we were

1445
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:30,800
expecting to go and have to have this

1446
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:32,960
hard-fought battle of like trying to

1447
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:34,319
comprehend how to take medication in a

1448
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:36,160
different language but in the end he was

1449
00:49:34,319 --> 00:49:38,800
just like no bish bash bosh get out you

1450
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:41,440
don't like yeah

1451
00:49:38,800 --> 00:49:43,359
couldn't have asked for more

1452
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:45,599
virus

1453
00:49:43,359 --> 00:49:47,520
a buttload of medication and honeyed hot

1454
00:49:45,599 --> 00:49:49,200
honey water for the next two days and i

1455
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:52,240
suddenly started to film myself again

1456
00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:54,720
but uh no i i that is the thing right we

1457
00:49:52,240 --> 00:49:56,240
talk about languages and again

1458
00:49:54,720 --> 00:49:58,400
i'm gonna continue this diversion but

1459
00:49:56,240 --> 00:49:59,760
hey that's my program because they have

1460
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,359
obviously india they have this language

1461
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:03,839
called common which is basically a

1462
00:50:01,359 --> 00:50:04,880
crutch for the the world builder to say

1463
00:50:03,839 --> 00:50:06,240
do you know what if you want to get away

1464
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,680
with everybody talking the same language

1465
00:50:06,240 --> 00:50:09,040
you can it's called this language called

1466
00:50:07,680 --> 00:50:10,480
common because there isn't a more

1467
00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:12,000
inventive word for it

1468
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:15,520
feel free to fill in that blank if you

1469
00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:17,200
want to mr mr world builder but it does

1470
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:19,359
you know i've never thought of it

1471
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:21,359
until just now as as a crotch because it

1472
00:50:19,359 --> 00:50:23,040
does take away so much of that world

1473
00:50:21,359 --> 00:50:24,400
building opportunity for you you just go

1474
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:25,920
oh okay we can speak common i guess

1475
00:50:24,400 --> 00:50:28,400
that's how this world works whereas in

1476
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,839
reality you've lost that

1477
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:32,559
you know stranger in a strange land

1478
00:50:29,839 --> 00:50:34,000
you've lost that how do i

1479
00:50:32,559 --> 00:50:36,800
communicate or talk to these people

1480
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:39,520
because there's mainly 99 times out of

1481
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:41,200
100 someone can talk common and in that

1482
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:43,440
last one edge case one of the party

1483
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:46,319
members can talk the native tongue

1484
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:48,079
and i i do think that is a very

1485
00:50:46,319 --> 00:50:49,680
that'll be a very very very interesting

1486
00:50:48,079 --> 00:50:51,839
role play experience for all the players

1487
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:54,960
at the table to be like this city you

1488
00:50:51,839 --> 00:50:56,480
found yourself in it's if you have to a

1489
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:58,640
completely homebrew like an extreme

1490
00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:00,720
homebrew language that isn't in just to

1491
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:01,760
make sure the players have it just to be

1492
00:51:00,720 --> 00:51:04,160
like you

1493
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:06,160
tell me what do you do how do you do you

1494
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:08,160
press to digitate do you minor illusion

1495
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:10,319
the sign for bread like maybe they don't

1496
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:11,920
eat bread here what does maybe bread is

1497
00:51:10,319 --> 00:51:13,200
something else you know that doesn't

1498
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:14,319
mean anything to them like that that

1499
00:51:13,200 --> 00:51:17,280
would be

1500
00:51:14,319 --> 00:51:19,599
hugely interesting as a player

1501
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:21,440
how do i get over this hurdle you know

1502
00:51:19,599 --> 00:51:23,599
maybe bread has got this weird

1503
00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:25,760
spiritual meaning to think that that

1504
00:51:23,599 --> 00:51:28,079
symbolism is is it means something else

1505
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:29,280
because of their folklore their their

1506
00:51:28,079 --> 00:51:30,960
histories you go there and you're just

1507
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:33,599
immediately insulting these people

1508
00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:36,480
because you don't know what to do uh

1509
00:51:33,599 --> 00:51:38,240
would be very an interesting conceit

1510
00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:40,800
no i i i i fully agree i mean we've

1511
00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:42,640
we've played around with it and um on

1512
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:44,880
survey team three which is one of our um

1513
00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:46,880
our main shows we play open language a

1514
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:49,359
lot where because singapore is is a very

1515
00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:51,680
multilingual place right so many of our

1516
00:51:49,359 --> 00:51:54,240
players uh speak many languages i speak

1517
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:57,599
a couple right so um the goblin player

1518
00:51:54,240 --> 00:51:58,480
at our table we uses hokkien which is a

1519
00:51:57,599 --> 00:52:02,960
a

1520
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:05,040
sort of chinese language that is from

1521
00:52:02,960 --> 00:52:06,319
similar to taiwanese in many ways and so

1522
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:08,319
there's there's a large sort of

1523
00:52:06,319 --> 00:52:11,599
proportion of folks that are of chinese

1524
00:52:08,319 --> 00:52:13,920
origin in in singapore and it's uh it is

1525
00:52:11,599 --> 00:52:15,839
one of those languages that is beautiful

1526
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:16,960
to swear in it's just got a certain

1527
00:52:15,839 --> 00:52:19,680
visceral

1528
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:21,839
yeah filthiness to it right but like the

1529
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:23,280
swear words are just horrible i'm not

1530
00:52:21,839 --> 00:52:25,040
going to repeat any of them right and

1531
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:27,119
then julie know it don't take that some

1532
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:29,440
homework for me now oh yeah

1533
00:52:27,119 --> 00:52:31,119
it's like you know like i like languages

1534
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:33,359
you can curse in well and like you know

1535
00:52:31,119 --> 00:52:35,200
hokkien is definitely one of the mid-ceo

1536
00:52:33,359 --> 00:52:39,040
and it has some just amazing idioms as

1537
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:39,920
well so yeah so um we often do things

1538
00:52:39,040 --> 00:52:42,480
where

1539
00:52:39,920 --> 00:52:44,400
um and it it is part of the show and i

1540
00:52:42,480 --> 00:52:46,000
know that that sort of can be difficult

1541
00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:47,119
at times right but where one of the

1542
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:49,440
players

1543
00:52:47,119 --> 00:52:51,760
speaks and swears in hokkien to

1544
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:54,640
represent them speaking um

1545
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:56,319
goblin and sometimes you know some of

1546
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:59,359
the other players who also speak hokkien

1547
00:52:56,319 --> 00:53:01,839
or whatever kind of like speak it very

1548
00:52:59,359 --> 00:53:03,040
badly as it were you know to represent

1549
00:53:01,839 --> 00:53:04,880
the fact that their characters have

1550
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:06,720
learned a little bit of it but it's not

1551
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:08,000
their primary language and so they're

1552
00:53:06,720 --> 00:53:10,240
like ah

1553
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:13,760
um and then they do it the way that you

1554
00:53:10,240 --> 00:53:16,160
can you know sort of uh uh a a a young

1555
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:17,760
school boy might go oh bonjour

1556
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:20,400
uh je vous drey

1557
00:53:17,760 --> 00:53:20,400
uh um

1558
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:26,400
uh sibu play all right you know and sort

1559
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:29,119
of like kind of that awful sort of

1560
00:53:26,400 --> 00:53:30,240
stilting yes french that uh the the the

1561
00:53:29,119 --> 00:53:31,280
the sort of yeah people thought that

1562
00:53:30,240 --> 00:53:32,000
they can patronize you about and they're

1563
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:33,599
saying

1564
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:35,680
flashing that you are a foreigner like

1565
00:53:33,599 --> 00:53:37,920
you are not a native speaker yeah

1566
00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:40,480
it's it's wonderful and so the the

1567
00:53:37,920 --> 00:53:42,800
and another thing we do is that um

1568
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:44,079
so common is not the same

1569
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:45,839
from

1570
00:53:44,079 --> 00:53:48,800
everywhere in my world and what i mean

1571
00:53:45,839 --> 00:53:50,800
by that is uh if the players move from

1572
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:52,720
and primarily they've mostly hung around

1573
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:54,640
in one region in in this game there's

1574
00:53:52,720 --> 00:53:56,319
another another game there sort of in

1575
00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:59,280
another area a different set of players

1576
00:53:56,319 --> 00:54:00,319
from another area and so common is sort

1577
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:01,599
of a

1578
00:54:00,319 --> 00:54:05,280
um

1579
00:54:01,599 --> 00:54:06,000
a trade language of convenience so

1580
00:54:05,280 --> 00:54:08,160
you

1581
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:10,720
the common language between these kind

1582
00:54:08,160 --> 00:54:13,200
of regions is the kind of equivalent of

1583
00:54:10,720 --> 00:54:14,880
maybe you know chinese would have been

1584
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:17,040
right uh you know for certain areas

1585
00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:18,000
around here and the common language over

1586
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:20,160
here is

1587
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:22,559
what maybe malay would have been right

1588
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:24,400
and the common language over there is

1589
00:54:22,559 --> 00:54:26,000
what may be english or german or french

1590
00:54:24,400 --> 00:54:27,599
or italian would have been or latin

1591
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:29,440
would have been or greek yeah especially

1592
00:54:27,599 --> 00:54:31,200
right phoenician and actually if you

1593
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:32,720
look at the looking back to like the the

1594
00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:34,240
sort of history and mythology and stuff

1595
00:54:32,720 --> 00:54:36,799
and everything else if you look at the

1596
00:54:34,240 --> 00:54:39,599
the the the evolution of languages and

1597
00:54:36,799 --> 00:54:41,680
you know the especially the languages

1598
00:54:39,599 --> 00:54:43,599
from you know the levant and sort of

1599
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:45,599
areas where ancient vegeta is and

1600
00:54:43,599 --> 00:54:47,520
everything else right it's the fact that

1601
00:54:45,599 --> 00:54:49,440
they were traders that they carried all

1602
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:50,480
these words and concepts around right

1603
00:54:49,440 --> 00:54:52,079
it's the fact that the greeks were

1604
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:55,119
traders and would travel a lot it's the

1605
00:54:52,079 --> 00:54:57,359
fact that you know um that the

1606
00:54:55,119 --> 00:54:59,920
the the empires of these people also

1607
00:54:57,359 --> 00:55:01,200
expanded right and those languages got

1608
00:54:59,920 --> 00:55:03,760
brought with them and were considered

1609
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:06,799
those are this is the high language

1610
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:09,200
right and so you you end up with some

1611
00:55:06,799 --> 00:55:12,160
quite interesting things right so uh uh

1612
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:15,040
to give an example right for a long time

1613
00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:17,359
speaking english at home or you know

1614
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:20,160
speaking english in uh in

1615
00:55:17,359 --> 00:55:22,079
in society was a sign of education in

1616
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:24,480
the soviet india right and so people

1617
00:55:22,079 --> 00:55:26,079
would speak english because uh it was a

1618
00:55:24,480 --> 00:55:26,799
sign of social status

1619
00:55:26,079 --> 00:55:27,599
right

1620
00:55:26,799 --> 00:55:29,520
so

1621
00:55:27,599 --> 00:55:31,680
having people use common as a sign of

1622
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:34,240
social status is quite interesting right

1623
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:35,760
you know you can play with ideas by

1624
00:55:34,240 --> 00:55:37,119
saying oh yeah so

1625
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:38,480
they they sort of speak a little bit to

1626
00:55:37,119 --> 00:55:40,240
you in broken common then turn away and

1627
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:42,319
talk to their colleague you know in

1628
00:55:40,240 --> 00:55:44,640
language you don't understand right and

1629
00:55:42,319 --> 00:55:46,640
they turn back to you and say you know

1630
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:47,680
very happy with this i'm very happy and

1631
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:49,200
you know you have to play as make a

1632
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:50,799
perception check or an inside chat or

1633
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:53,599
whatever and then it kind of creates

1634
00:55:50,799 --> 00:55:56,160
these these additional dynamics right

1635
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:58,160
yeah yeah of how deception might work or

1636
00:55:56,160 --> 00:56:00,160
how some or how someone may play into

1637
00:55:58,160 --> 00:56:01,630
that and pretend that they don't speak

1638
00:56:00,160 --> 00:56:02,799
good comments you know

1639
00:56:01,630 --> 00:56:06,079
[Music]

1640
00:56:02,799 --> 00:56:07,520
yeah yeah the classic like when some

1641
00:56:06,079 --> 00:56:08,720
people are talking in their native

1642
00:56:07,520 --> 00:56:10,079
language and they think you don't

1643
00:56:08,720 --> 00:56:11,680
understand and they're like insulting

1644
00:56:10,079 --> 00:56:14,000
you and you just have to

1645
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:16,720
abso absolutely absolutely yeah there's

1646
00:56:14,000 --> 00:56:19,119
all kinds of fun things to be to be done

1647
00:56:16,720 --> 00:56:20,400
there and uh yeah look at this idiot he

1648
00:56:19,119 --> 00:56:22,640
doesn't know i'm i'm taking him for a

1649
00:56:20,400 --> 00:56:24,559
ride ha ha ha anyway is that a good deal

1650
00:56:22,640 --> 00:56:25,920
for you sir like yeah

1651
00:56:24,559 --> 00:56:27,359
exactly

1652
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:28,720
look look it's uh

1653
00:56:27,359 --> 00:56:29,860
see that building i'm sure i've seen

1654
00:56:28,720 --> 00:56:32,400
that building before

1655
00:56:29,860 --> 00:56:34,720
[Laughter]

1656
00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:36,240
um i know we could i mean

1657
00:56:34,720 --> 00:56:38,079
we could talk about this forever because

1658
00:56:36,240 --> 00:56:39,920
it is such an interesting dynamic and

1659
00:56:38,079 --> 00:56:41,440
deep deep topic but is there anything

1660
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:44,640
that uh you want to talk about that we

1661
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:45,839
might have not somehow reached yet yeah

1662
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:47,680
i want to

1663
00:56:45,839 --> 00:56:49,200
you know the the the subject of this is

1664
00:56:47,680 --> 00:56:51,760
mythology and it's a strange subject in

1665
00:56:49,200 --> 00:56:54,000
some ways because it's not directly you

1666
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:55,920
know a dnd subject right but it's i

1667
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:57,520
think i think part of the sort of the

1668
00:56:55,920 --> 00:57:00,960
bigger point i want to make is like is

1669
00:56:57,520 --> 00:57:03,599
that it's so much um the underlying

1670
00:57:00,960 --> 00:57:05,119
fabric of all of our backgrounds right

1671
00:57:03,599 --> 00:57:06,799
and yeah i'll give you a good example

1672
00:57:05,119 --> 00:57:07,920
right so um

1673
00:57:06,799 --> 00:57:10,240
greek

1674
00:57:07,920 --> 00:57:11,440
myth and legend right so

1675
00:57:10,240 --> 00:57:14,559
odysseus

1676
00:57:11,440 --> 00:57:16,880
and uh the odyssey or the trojan war

1677
00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:19,200
right yeah um you know the founding of

1678
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:21,359
rome was another myth right you know the

1679
00:57:19,200 --> 00:57:22,880
sort of form of troy and then then inius

1680
00:57:21,359 --> 00:57:24,400
kind of goes to rome and then you have

1681
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:25,599
rome you have romulus and remus and you

1682
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:28,240
have all this kind of stuff you have the

1683
00:57:25,599 --> 00:57:30,079
roman legions you have all of this cool

1684
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:31,760
stuff that's out there and then it kind

1685
00:57:30,079 --> 00:57:34,079
of the funny thing is it kind of then

1686
00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:37,680
enters into to britain for example and

1687
00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:39,440
you have the um the the lost legion

1688
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:41,520
right that sort of like you know that

1689
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:43,119
you survived the ninth i believe it was

1690
00:57:41,520 --> 00:57:45,280
right you probably like maybe the school

1691
00:57:43,119 --> 00:57:46,799
read stories about the the the famous

1692
00:57:45,280 --> 00:57:47,920
sort of eagle of the ninth or whatever

1693
00:57:46,799 --> 00:57:49,680
and there became a whole bunch of

1694
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:51,760
stories about like things about actually

1695
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:54,319
yeah yeah exactly right and so all of

1696
00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:57,440
these stories kind of are there and

1697
00:57:54,319 --> 00:57:59,200
they're linked and they're linked by the

1698
00:57:57,440 --> 00:58:00,319
most wonderful thing which is humanity

1699
00:57:59,200 --> 00:58:02,960
right which is the

1700
00:58:00,319 --> 00:58:05,920
all of us in this unbroken chain from

1701
00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:08,400
the dawn of time right have created and

1702
00:58:05,920 --> 00:58:10,559
trodden down all of these kind of like

1703
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:13,119
bits of myth and legend and people will

1704
00:58:10,559 --> 00:58:15,280
be talking in you know in the metaverse

1705
00:58:13,119 --> 00:58:16,720
in the thousand years in the whatever

1706
00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:18,559
the the

1707
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:21,520
the next hype cycle is after that right

1708
00:58:18,559 --> 00:58:23,359
but you know the the the tri-d meta

1709
00:58:21,520 --> 00:58:25,040
verse you know whatever it is um you

1710
00:58:23,359 --> 00:58:27,200
know years to the future they'll be

1711
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:29,520
they'll be referring back to you know

1712
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:31,440
things that are myths and legends of now

1713
00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:34,880
right and bringing those into their

1714
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:36,799
stories and i think it's just a um

1715
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:39,680
one if you're running short on

1716
00:58:36,799 --> 00:58:41,119
inspiration wikipedia and just go and

1717
00:58:39,680 --> 00:58:44,000
look at some ancient myths and legends

1718
00:58:41,119 --> 00:58:46,880
go look at the the epic of gilgamesh go

1719
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:49,680
and actually you know what and i'm i'm

1720
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:51,760
i'm a long way from being

1721
00:58:49,680 --> 00:58:53,839
from pushing this on anybody right but

1722
00:58:51,760 --> 00:58:55,200
go look at the bible right i mean if you

1723
00:58:53,839 --> 00:58:57,599
want to go and grab some like you know

1724
00:58:55,200 --> 00:59:00,480
sort of like yeah uh some some stories

1725
00:58:57,599 --> 00:59:03,440
of the the near middle east right there

1726
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:05,760
you've got resonance but you know these

1727
00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:08,319
stories because they you slept through

1728
00:59:05,760 --> 00:59:10,000
re or you kind of get through sunday

1729
00:59:08,319 --> 00:59:11,920
school or maybe you're observant and you

1730
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:13,920
know these stories inside and out and so

1731
00:59:11,920 --> 00:59:15,599
if i talk to the legend of solomon you

1732
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:17,440
know you know what i'm talking about

1733
00:59:15,599 --> 00:59:19,839
right like these things have got

1734
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:20,960
resonance and they're deeply embedded in

1735
00:59:19,839 --> 00:59:23,359
all of us

1736
00:59:20,960 --> 00:59:24,960
and don't just sort of step away from

1737
00:59:23,359 --> 00:59:26,559
that and go i must

1738
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:28,799
create um

1739
00:59:26,559 --> 00:59:30,720
an entirely new world and take that

1740
00:59:28,799 --> 00:59:33,359
burden upon yourself when you have the

1741
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:36,319
whole rich tapestry of human history and

1742
00:59:33,359 --> 00:59:39,599
culture to kind of dig into

1743
00:59:36,319 --> 00:59:41,040
yeah absolutely absolutely and the one

1744
00:59:39,599 --> 00:59:42,640
one final thing

1745
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:44,240
that hopefully will be as good as that

1746
00:59:42,640 --> 00:59:46,640
that i wanted to mention and we alluded

1747
00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:47,359
to it earlier on around how there's you

1748
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:49,200
know

1749
00:59:47,359 --> 00:59:52,319
all around the world were all playing

1750
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:54,319
dnd or tt rpgs and how we met you

1751
00:59:52,319 --> 00:59:55,440
mentioned that this these myths and

1752
00:59:54,319 --> 00:59:56,880
legends

1753
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,040
are also known all the way around the

1754
00:59:56,880 --> 01:00:01,440
world just perhaps by a different name

1755
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:02,880
and i like i love the parallel there

1756
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:05,280
between

1757
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:06,799
ttrpgs and these myths and legends from

1758
01:00:05,280 --> 01:00:09,119
from centuries ago

1759
01:00:06,799 --> 01:00:11,760
where every every every table

1760
01:00:09,119 --> 01:00:15,040
somewhere will have a myth a legend from

1761
01:00:11,760 --> 01:00:16,720
their game that is just as you know

1762
01:00:15,040 --> 01:00:19,280
providing as a language

1763
01:00:16,720 --> 01:00:20,640
some to facilitate it is possible by

1764
01:00:19,280 --> 01:00:23,119
another game on the other side of the

1765
01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:25,520
table oh our fighter charged up to the

1766
01:00:23,119 --> 01:00:26,799
dragon and oh he rolled a natural 20 and

1767
01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:29,200
he chopped the dragon's head off and we

1768
01:00:26,799 --> 01:00:30,720
were watching like that is instantly

1769
01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:33,200
a legend from your game that is now

1770
01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:34,640
could be become a myth in somebody

1771
01:00:33,200 --> 01:00:36,960
else's game and on the other side of the

1772
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:39,280
pond and it's i just love that yeah that

1773
01:00:36,960 --> 01:00:41,280
transmission of of stories and ideas and

1774
01:00:39,280 --> 01:00:42,960
one of one of the reasons why we find

1775
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:45,440
ourselves talking today for the on on

1776
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:47,599
the basis of the show so yeah

1777
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:49,200
in its own way i mean you you you've hit

1778
01:00:47,599 --> 01:00:51,599
the nail on the head because the grey

1779
01:00:49,200 --> 01:00:53,680
hawk source book is exactly that right

1780
01:00:51,599 --> 01:00:56,480
it's sort of you know guy x hansen's

1781
01:00:53,680 --> 01:00:58,880
game right and uh you know

1782
01:00:56,480 --> 01:01:01,200
the taldori book that's on my shelf over

1783
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:02,799
here i mean you know not to not to the

1784
01:01:01,200 --> 01:01:04,880
mental critical role just for you know

1785
01:01:02,799 --> 01:01:07,040
shits and giggles but you know that's

1786
01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:09,599
that's part of the myth and legend that

1787
01:01:07,040 --> 01:01:12,079
people will be playing in that world and

1788
01:01:09,599 --> 01:01:13,839
using sort of you know mercer's world

1789
01:01:12,079 --> 01:01:16,240
okay that's great i mean that's that

1790
01:01:13,839 --> 01:01:18,079
that's amazing right so

1791
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:20,640
tell those stories to other people it's

1792
01:01:18,079 --> 01:01:22,400
wonderful and then let there let that

1793
01:01:20,640 --> 01:01:25,040
sort of legend live on

1794
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:26,799
absolutely well thank you ever so much

1795
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:28,799
for that is there anything you would

1796
01:01:26,799 --> 01:01:29,599
like to promote

1797
01:01:28,799 --> 01:01:31,839
so

1798
01:01:29,599 --> 01:01:33,760
a very kind of you to offer um i think

1799
01:01:31,839 --> 01:01:35,920
there's a couple of things i would like

1800
01:01:33,760 --> 01:01:37,440
to mention the first is uh

1801
01:01:35,920 --> 01:01:39,680
the fourth culture which is uh you can

1802
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:42,960
find us at t4c.online

1803
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:45,040
uh we do all kinds of nonsense um we're

1804
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:47,599
currently in the process of actually

1805
01:01:45,040 --> 01:01:49,280
incorporating t4z studios which is a

1806
01:01:47,599 --> 01:01:51,599
much bigger thing where we're pulling

1807
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:55,599
together a bunch of streams and we're uh

1808
01:01:51,599 --> 01:01:58,079
all going to uh uh can again focus on um

1809
01:01:55,599 --> 01:02:00,960
uh d d and d and d adjacent kind of

1810
01:01:58,079 --> 01:02:03,520
content ttrpg adjacent content so um you

1811
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:05,280
know there's a there's random nonsense

1812
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:07,440
that we'll be ensuring there but with

1813
01:02:05,280 --> 01:02:09,359
the idea of also

1814
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:11,359
allowing people to tell stories from

1815
01:02:09,359 --> 01:02:13,660
their own cultures and include them in

1816
01:02:11,359 --> 01:02:14,880
games so it's sort of a

1817
01:02:13,660 --> 01:02:16,160
[Music]

1818
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:18,480
very much work in progress but yeah you

1819
01:02:16,160 --> 01:02:20,880
can find it at t4c.online

1820
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:22,240
and i think the uh the second thing i

1821
01:02:20,880 --> 01:02:27,280
would like to mention if it's all

1822
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:29,599
possible is uh that um it is

1823
01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:32,400
it's very interesting the world we live

1824
01:02:29,599 --> 01:02:35,359
in right now uh because everybody is

1825
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:39,839
finding reasons to

1826
01:02:35,359 --> 01:02:41,839
separate and discriminate and say that

1827
01:02:39,839 --> 01:02:42,559
for good or for bad reasons that they

1828
01:02:41,839 --> 01:02:46,000
are

1829
01:02:42,559 --> 01:02:48,960
different and unique and special or that

1830
01:02:46,000 --> 01:02:51,200
they are different and therefore bad and

1831
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:53,039
you know not worthy

1832
01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:56,960
and

1833
01:02:53,039 --> 01:02:58,720
d is an opportunity for people to get

1834
01:02:56,960 --> 01:03:01,680
together and

1835
01:02:58,720 --> 01:03:04,000
fight monsters and you know bring some

1836
01:03:01,680 --> 01:03:05,599
light back into the world or whatever it

1837
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:08,319
is that you're doing but do it in a way

1838
01:03:05,599 --> 01:03:10,240
that is that most ancient of things it

1839
01:03:08,319 --> 01:03:12,480
sort of hearkens back to sitting around

1840
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:13,680
the fire and telling tales together it's

1841
01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:17,200
the most

1842
01:03:13,680 --> 01:03:18,880
it's the most uniting of things sitting

1843
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:23,039
together and telling stories and cutting

1844
01:03:18,880 --> 01:03:26,079
the bills bridges and friendships and

1845
01:03:23,039 --> 01:03:27,599
this is a wonderful hobby that we have

1846
01:03:26,079 --> 01:03:29,359
and a wonderful opportunity that we have

1847
01:03:27,599 --> 01:03:31,200
to tell each other stories and share

1848
01:03:29,359 --> 01:03:34,880
them and

1849
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:36,799
seek those moments of creating unity i

1850
01:03:34,880 --> 01:03:39,359
would say and so i don't know if i'm

1851
01:03:36,799 --> 01:03:42,400
plugging anything other than um you know

1852
01:03:39,359 --> 01:03:42,400
being a nice person

1853
01:03:43,200 --> 01:03:47,280
i can't think of it i can't think of a

1854
01:03:44,400 --> 01:03:48,559
better thing to to plug so no that's

1855
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:49,440
that's fine

1856
01:03:48,559 --> 01:03:51,440
um

1857
01:03:49,440 --> 01:03:53,680
well all that's left to say then is

1858
01:03:51,440 --> 01:03:55,599
thank you ever so much ramji that was a

1859
01:03:53,680 --> 01:03:56,640
fantastic discussion very insightful

1860
01:03:55,599 --> 01:03:58,160
discussion so thank you very much for

1861
01:03:56,640 --> 01:03:59,520
joining us today thank you very much for

1862
01:03:58,160 --> 01:04:01,520
having me it's been it's been incredible

1863
01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:04,000
it's a lot of fun to talk awesome uh

1864
01:04:01,520 --> 01:04:04,960
thank you to everybody for listening at

1865
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:07,200
home

1866
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:08,160
as usual all the pertinent links are in

1867
01:04:07,200 --> 01:04:10,240
the episode description i would

1868
01:04:08,160 --> 01:04:12,079
encourage you to check them all out and

1869
01:04:10,240 --> 01:04:14,000
while you're there you can find links to

1870
01:04:12,079 --> 01:04:16,160
my things that you might want to like or

1871
01:04:14,000 --> 01:04:17,680
subscribe to and you know

1872
01:04:16,160 --> 01:04:19,680
what costs what's the cost of another

1873
01:04:17,680 --> 01:04:22,319
click nothing so

1874
01:04:19,680 --> 01:04:23,839
united states that like button or

1875
01:04:22,319 --> 01:04:26,880
whatever it is whatever they whatever

1876
01:04:23,839 --> 01:04:26,880
they say

1877
01:04:28,000 --> 01:04:32,960
uh yes otherwise thank you everybody for

1878
01:04:30,400 --> 01:04:34,559
listening and good night

1879
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:35,520
and now it's time for the patreon shout

1880
01:04:34,559 --> 01:04:38,720
outs

1881
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:41,359
thank you to robert hartley dm for viva

1882
01:04:38,720 --> 01:04:43,680
the dirt league and writer on the dnd

1883
01:04:41,359 --> 01:04:45,200
the logic web series

1884
01:04:43,680 --> 01:04:48,079
i would encourage everybody to check him

1885
01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:49,039
out at robert hartley gm on twitter and

1886
01:04:48,079 --> 01:04:51,280
twitch

1887
01:04:49,039 --> 01:04:53,760
thank you to optional rule a two time

1888
01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:56,559
guest of the show and a very insightful

1889
01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:57,839
and knowledgeable source of information

1890
01:04:56,559 --> 01:05:00,839
please check them out at

1891
01:04:57,839 --> 01:05:00,839
www.optionalrule.com

1892
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:06,559
huge huge huge thank you to a great

1893
01:05:04,000 --> 01:05:08,960
friend of the show matthew perkins who's

1894
01:05:06,559 --> 01:05:11,359
out there making hilarious and

1895
01:05:08,960 --> 01:05:13,119
educational dungeons and dragons content

1896
01:05:11,359 --> 01:05:14,880
please go and check out his stuff at

1897
01:05:13,119 --> 01:05:17,280
matthewperkins.net where you can find

1898
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:18,880
links to all of his socials and all of

1899
01:05:17,280 --> 01:05:20,559
his content including his own patreon

1900
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which i would very much encourage you to

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check out

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thank you to matt street at mpstreet88

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on twitter for supporting the show

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if you need support running your

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personal or business schedule head to

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virtualtimehustle.com or on instagram to

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make that difference between should do

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and done boss it better with support

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from cat who will help you get back that

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essential time you've been searching for

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if you would like to support what we do

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and get four shout outs a month head

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over to patreon.com thinking critically

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or you can just buy me a coffee at

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kofi.com thinking critically

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[Music]

 

Ramji Venkateswaran

CEO / General Dogsbody / DM

DM Ramji is the founder of 'The 4th Culture' . Originally a stream based out of Singapore, Asia, The 4th Culture's flagship show, Survey Team 3 is set in the non-eurocentric world of Urtu. Steeped in the stories and lore of Asia, the campaign and world blends together modern asian voices telling stories that are common to us all - but with references and perspectives that are uniquely asian.